What is the best way to counter a tourism victory by a computer?

I've got my self in my first Emperor game playing as Greece. Thanks to a rather lucky 3 tile mountain range me, venice and cartage got stuck on the bigger of 2 parts of a huge fractal map. The results of that are:

- I'm dominating as far as land armies are concerned.
- I'm on par technologically with the other 3 civs that are keeping up (the rest are behind).
- I'll dominate diplomatically due to having almost all the city states allied with me.
- I'm below average on the number of sea vessels but got the best navy from tech point of view.

The big problem I'm seeing to my domination of the game is the current highest scoring AI - Russia (i'm second) which has somehow gotten to 26 tourism while everyone else is very far behind 1 civ with 10t, 1 civ with 8t, 2 civs with 6t and 2 civs with 4t, the rest have none.

So what are the best steps I can take to make absolutely sure Russia cant beat me with tourism? I'm guessing taking their capitol would work but they are on the opposite end of the map and getting troops there will require a huge navy to protect them.

Any tips are welcome, for a reference point I've got less than 10 games on BNW.

Kill them, or buff up your culture. Or score a diplo/scientific victory before they get influential with everyone. Getting GWAM guild and also Sistine Chapel if possible is a good idea, the same with any +culture wonder.

How is their military doing? Is there any nearby enemies with stronger army than Russia? If so, pay them to attack. You can also pay Kate to attack someone if she's bigger, and then when shes's weakened and sent her soldiers away, get her from behind with your army.

Singulare said:

I've got my self in my first Emperor game playing as Greece. Thanks to a rather lucky 3 tile mountain range me, venice and cartage got stuck on the bigger of 2 parts of a huge fractal map. The results of that are:

- I'm dominating as far as land armies are concerned.
- I'm on par technologically with the other 3 civs that are keeping up (the rest are behind).
- I'll dominate diplomatically due to having almost all the city states allied with me.
- I'm below average on the number of sea vessels but got the best navy from tech point of view.

The big problem I'm seeing to my domination of the game is the current highest scoring AI - Russia (i'm second) which has somehow gotten to 26 tourism while everyone else is very far behind 1 civ with 10t, 1 civ with 8t, 2 civs with 6t and 2 civs with 4t, the rest have none.

So what are the best steps I can take to make absolutely sure Russia cant beat me with tourism? I'm guessing taking their capitol would work but they are on the opposite end of the map and getting troops there will require a huge navy to protect them.

Any tips are welcome, for a reference point I've got less than 10 games on BNW.

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You could always increase your culture output to prolong the time it will take russia to win, use your great writers for political treaties, and use great musicians on Russia to gain influence over them.

Drewbdu said:

You could always increase your culture output to prolong the time it will take russia to win, use your great writers for political treaties, and use great musicians on Russia to gain influence over them.

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I think that since using great musicians will only increase his influence, but not decrease theirs, it's better for him to have their Works which will give him some culture.

Enrico Swagolo said:

Kill them, or buff up your culture. Or score a diplo/scientific victory before they get influential with everyone. Getting GWAM guild and also Sistine Chapel if possible is a good idea, the same with any +culture wonder.

How is their military doing? Is there any nearby enemies with stronger army than Russia? If so, pay them to attack. You can also pay Kate to attack someone if she's bigger, and then when shes's weakened and sent her soldiers away, get her from behind with your army.

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I dont know about their military strenght since I've gotten sight on them just from a boat. I know that they have less troops than me according to the advisor but so does everyone else, so I cant judge. They are the top ranking civ currently so I expect it would be hard for one other civ to take them out and I dont really know the inner borders around there since I found them all by sea pretty late in the game just 4 turns before printing press.

Any idea how much culture would slow them how much based on their tourism?

If I get to attacking her I'll use that trick.

Drewbdu said:

You could always increase your culture output to prolong the time it will take russia to win, use your great writers for political treaties, and use great musicians on Russia to gain influence over them.

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I'll try the great writers and musicians to see how they work. Never used their second abilities till now. Some info on what they are supposed to do exactly? Any idea how much culture would make it hard for them? Due to many of the city states being culture ones I'm pretty far ahead culture wise, leading by a few to several policies.

DreadMuffin said:

26 isn't much (depending on the current age), but if you just keep up your conquest and generate culture, you should be good to go. If you are sufficiently strong diplomatically, you can also get the slower rate for the various artists though.

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Just entered Renaissance.

Good call on that international law. The moment city states come into play I'm putting it in action.

Enrico Swagolo said:

I think that since using great musicians will only increase his influence, but not decrease theirs, it's better for him to have their Works which will give him some culture.

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And what does the writer treaty do exactly I havent used those 2 abilities yet.

Singulare said:

And what does the writer treaty do exactly I havent used those 2 abilities yet.

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Great Musician creates one-time tourism to another civilization. All other civilizations receive 20% or 25% of the ammount, I don't remember.

Great Writer creates a Political Treaty, giving you a one-time culture gain worth about 7-9 turns worth.



Also if you have a production advantage, get International Games/Fair and win them. That should slow their victory down a lot.

Im Sorry wrong thread

If you are already leading in tech (or not being behind), you can try bee-lining Archeology and stealing as many of her dig sites as possible, those are the ones generating tons of tourism after Hotels/Airports, especially next to their capital. Then if possible sniping some culture wonders like Luvre (although it will cost policy), Sydney Opera House or Broadway.

Enrico Swagolo said:

Also if you have a production advantage, get International Games/Fair and win them. That should slow their victory down a lot.

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Yeah I thought of that it was the first thing I proposed and everyone seems to like the idea so I expect it will go through. Thanks for the explanation on the other things.

Nivrax said:

If you are already leading in tech (or not being behind), you can try bee-lining Archeology and stealing as many of her dig sites as possible, those are the ones generating tons of tourism after Hotels/Airports, especially next to their capital. Then if possible sniping some culture wonders like Luvre (although it will cost policy), Sydney Opera House or Broadway.

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I was planning on that. I can see that culture counters tourism but I dont get how much exactly is needed to counter it completely.

Pass the World Fair and get the 1st price (you'll need good hammer output), the huge cultural boost you get will be a good counter to their tourism.

The truth is, you are in absolutely no danger. At least as of now. If you have CSs allied and standard culture output from your cities, Russia will never dominate you with their tourism. When archeology comes, you will be able to get at least several landmarks and a ton of artifacts. If you've just entered Renaissance and you are to par with technology, you should be able to win the game easily.

All you need to do now is to get ideology as soon as possible (the route to industrialism is very short) and when you secure it, go for schools. At that point you will be able to focus on tourism or whatever else you want because AI will lag behind more and more.

Singulare said:

I was planning on that. I can see that culture counters tourism but I dont get how much exactly is needed to counter it completely.

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For cultural victory, you need to accumulate more tourism than your rivals have gathered culture. If you have 50 culture per turn, your opponent would have to be able to generate 50 tourism just to keep up with you AND even more to combat whatever you had accumulated over the course of the game. When ideologies kick in, you'll have everything laid out in tourism screen.

I can't really imagine myself losing a game due to AI's tourism. Your biggest problem may come from ideological pressure, but since you control CSs and are keeping up with tech, just vote your ideology of choice to be the world's ideology and you are safe.

PS.
Inclination towards science or arts seems to be hard-coded into each leader's scripts because in world congress civs usually vote against their better judgment on science/arts funding. Fo this reason I would recommend not to use these resolutions as it would most certainly put you at odds with everyone else. Then there come chain denouncements, embargoes, everyone with hostile ideologies, gangrapes with you as the only person not enjoying it etc. etc.

Just build all the guilds and fill the Great Writers slot up and you should be fine. I've never seen a civ getting close to CV when I neglect culture (no cultural buildings beyond Amphitheatres and guild production is delayed).

Also get Patronage -> Consolates to friend all CS (cultural CS would give +13culture/turn past Industrial era).

Thanks for all the help guys. You cleared up several things for me.

Has anyone, ever, ever seen AI win culture?

I've never even seen them come close (Immortal).

Neither have I. That was one of the points I made in my post. Even civs like Brazil and France are lacking when it comes to surmount the player's culture and there's usually at least one other highly cultured civilization opposing them.

I was worried for nothing it seems I guess I'll have an easy game and pick and choose what kind of a win I want