Pantheon, Founder and Follower Beliefs

Can you read the word forest ? elephants don't appear on forest

I thought it was just +1 food in camps. Was it later updated to only forest camps?

anyways there look to be some kind of obvious synergies, some i've noticed so far:

Dance of the Aurora (faith from deserts) - curious whether this includes flood plains. If it does, it could be quite useful. Especially for the Arabs or other desert start bias civs.

Fertility Rights (faster growth) - perfect for India, would also be nice for Aztecs to get some crazy growth.

God of Open Sky (culture from pastures) Great for huns and Russia. Perfect for the huns actually, they should get pastures up SUPER fast with their UA.

God of the sea (more production from fishing boats)- seems kinda OP actually. Anyone with decent amount of coastal cities will want this, but Carthage has the best synergy with free harbors. Other civs like England and the Dutch who are incentivized to take commerce policies would want it too.

Messenger of the Gods (+2 science in trade route cities) - good for expansive civs. Inca comes to mind especially because they get trade routes up fastest.

One with Nature (faith from natural wonders) - Spain. Duh.

Monument to the Gods (faster wonders) another duh...Egypt

The founder/follower beliefs seem more universal and would depend on your strategy more than your civ. The only one that leaps out at me is Papal Primacy - Siam would definitely want that.

Just a quick thought. If you have a Cathedral & Mosque Building Follower Belief, then I wonder if there will also be, say, a Synagogue, Pagoda & maybe Torii building belief?

Another completely random thought: All of the talk about religions having influence over a 10-tile radius got me wondering if there's going to be an option in the "tactical" map to have an overlay for religion, much like there was in Civ IV. I can see where that would be handy.

Is it just me, or do monasteries seem underpowered when compared to mosques/cathedrals?

Me said:

Is it just me, or do monasteries seem underpowered when compared to mosques/cathedrals?

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maybe, but that's not really a problem.

they give a flat bonus and then a bonus for wine/incense when worked. Top that off with the pantheon belief that also gives a bonus for wine/incense and it's looking pretty good if there's lots of it around.

I'd just consider monasteries one of the 'special case' beliefs, not to be taken unless you can get a lot out of it by having plenty of wine/incense around.

Agreed. It's situational for sure.

I'm wondering if it would be a good strategy to choose a crappy follower belief, so other civs don't get good bonuses...

Montov said:

I'm wondering if it would be a good strategy to choose a crappy follower belief, so other civs don't get good bonuses...

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Well, if the AI understands what's good and what's bad or them then you won't be able to do that. You can ofcourse pick a belief a belief that is only usefull for you, so if the AI gets your religion it won't do them any good. However, that does mean your religion is unlikely to spread and that might have negative effects for you as well.

Montov said:

I'm wondering if it would be a good strategy to choose a crappy follower belief, so other civs don't get good bonuses...

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If you choose bad follower's beliefs,others civilizations will surely reject your religion and the bonus that the Founder's Belief gives are limited to your cities and nearby city-states . And while you try to avoid spreading your religion,other's civilizations which choose the follower's belief of their religions wisely will have more advantage than you .

I'm pretty sure you can spread your religion (via missionaries) to the cities of an AI who has picked a different religion as long as you have open borders. A city's dominant religion is determined by raw numbers not the choice of an AI (IIRC).

So having bad follower beliefs doesn't hinder the spread of your religion so much as it would effect the adoption of your religion as the state religion of the AIs and thus diplomacy.

Unless they build Inquisitors.

Although why you wouldn't want your cities to get follower beliefs is beyond me.

Has there been any confirmation that a civ can choose a "state religion"? Follower beliefs depend on city religion. There is some kind of "state" effect used in diplomacy, but that does not necessarily mean that you have a choice. It could be that "state religion" = "majority religion", or it could be that the diplomatic effects are prorated.

(Unless someone has heard otherwise.)

Pazyryk said:

Has there been any confirmation that a civ can choose a "state religion"? Follower beliefs depend on city religion. There is some kind of "state" effect used in diplomacy, but that does not necessarily mean that you have a choice. It could be that "state religion" = "majority religion", or it could be that the diplomatic effects are prorated.

(Unless someone has heard otherwise.)

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TBH, I guess there is no state religion. Diplomatic effects will be based on the amount of cities with a dominant religion (''you have at least 1 city with our dominant religion'' or ''you have the same dominant religion'').

My guess is that it is very possible to have a different religion in every city and thus you have no dominant religion. I wonder if it will be based on amount of citizens belonging to a religion or on amount of cities though.

Since other civilizations will have positive or negative diplomatic modifiers towards you based on what "your religion is," there's got to be some mechanism where you choose one (because you may not necessarily be able to found one yourself). Otherwise there's no point to such a modifier, if you have no choice in the matter.

AriochIV said:

Since other civilizations will have positive or negative diplomatic modifiers towards you based on what "your religion is," there's got to be some mechanism where you choose one (because you may not necessarily be able to found one yourself). Otherwise there's no point to such a modifier, if you have no choice in the matter.

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You have a choice. You can attempt to spread a religion faster by using missionaries, you can also try to get rid of a religion through inquisitors.

It doesn't seem like there will be a ''switch state religion to X'' button. You'll have to work for it.

snipperrabbit!! said:

No, it says purchase which means using gold. missionaries are always available with faith (requires at least 1 follower).

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From which source did you get this?

CYZ said:

You have a choice. You can attempt to spread a religion faster by using missionaries, you can also try to get rid of a religion through inquisitors.

It doesn't seem like there will be a ''switch state religion to X'' button. You'll have to work for it.

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Well, whether there's a button or not, there has to be a state religion for the other civilizations to recognize. Making you play a numbers game to get the state religion you want is possible, but it seems unnecessary... and it smacks too much of micromanagement for the sort of "streamlined" play that Firaxis prefers these days.

I think the papacy says "influence rating points" as in points towards your influence rating with said civilization.