Warhammer Heart of Chaos: Design Discussion

i would say too that crime rate could be taken out if needed and instead these buildings could give unhappyness then.

I don't think we need to add unhappiness to buildings.
The smugglers port doesn't fit for Warhammer (it kind of made sense with the Undercouncil, but not with the Covenant) and should be removed.
Other crime rate impact buildings should just have those effects removed.

what plans do you have for "culture" atm?
Culture is intended to be mostly military/political influence. So its not coming from theatres and art galleries, its coming from fortresses and government agencies and demonstrations of power.

and when i remember right you had some "fights influence culture" mechanic in the old mod.
Influence-driven war modcomp. Yes, I'd very much like to have that back in. Unfortunately, our only dll coder Opera, who was going to do this for us, just dropped out. So we really lack the the technical capability to do this sort of thing. Which is a shame, I think it added more to the WH mod than anywhere else I've seen it.

Multiple forms of culture seem really confusing and hard to code, I vote no.
I suggest a single form of culture, and we just have it come from thematic buildings.

I'm on the fence on fort commanders. Where I've seen them (eg in Orbis) they were far too strong, and made it far too easy for the human player to annihilate AI invasions with minimal losses. If we have them, they will need to be massively toned down.

there could be different mechanics used instead. i.e.
-units build in towns with such buildings get a "trained" promotion.
-trained promotion could give a bit xp over time like with arcane units.
-or the trained promotion could simply give +5-10% str +10-20% more xp in battle.

The FF training mechanic IMO "solves" something that isn't a problem; it creates a way of having a highly experienced army without going to war.
First of all, a highly experienced army only for factions that go to war is realistic; throughout history, there's no training like actual battle experience, and experienced soldiers are far more effective than green ones, no matter how much parade time they've had.
Second of all, its good. Warhammer is a very militaristic mod.

Hmm. How about this: we have two types of buildings for each class.
The base "barracks" building, archery range, stables, hunting lodge, siege works, breeding pit. Gives +2 free xp to newly created melee, ranged, chariot/shock/ranged cavalry, recon, siege, beast units (respectively).

Then we have some second tier buildings at higher techs for some classes. Training yard, naval academy, hippodrome, machinist's shop etc.
Rather than using the training mechanic, they add a "trained" promotion to units of the appropriate class.
"Trained" promotion could give +50% experience from combat, and maybe something else minor.

We could also vary access to these by faction flavor. So some races get a melee booster (orks), others a ranged booster (wood elves), others a cavalry booster (bretonnia), others a beast booster (dark elves), others a recon booster (skaven) etc.

Bloodbowl arena could operate like the arena (chance of death, chance of gain xp + happy) but if you win, the unit gets the "trained" promotion.

what about giving most ranged units (i.e. archers, cannons...maybe not woodelves and other forest civs?) a malus when defending/attacking forest fields and a malus when they stand on a forest field?
and/or a malus to ranged attacks when standing in a forest or attacking a forest field.

Not necessary I think. We already have terrain penalties for cavalry, we don't need them for archers. And archers are fairly low strength anyway (they don't get metal weapon boosts), with boosts on hills and in cities.
Archers are defensive units, so they're weak enough already IMO.

but i might just have been unlucky in that situation there
Archers on a hill forest tile *should* be hard to dislodge! They have weak attack, but they're fantastic defenders.

One think we might need to do is increase the cost of the archery tech though. Its significantly cheaper to get to archery than it is to get to horsemen or melee, because those need multiple tech pre-reqs.

(i guess i missed the antiarcher promotion and hill attack one etc... i guess it might have been better with these already)
This is my guess, plus slightly higher archery tech cost.
Remember though, you can bombard their archers with your archers! And chop forests adjacent to your cities....
 
Hmm. How about this: we have two types of buildings for each class.
The base "barracks" building, archery range, stables, hunting lodge, siege works, breeding pit. Gives +2 free xp to newly created melee, ranged, chariot/shock/ranged cavalry, recon, siege, beast units (respectively).

Then we have some second tier buildings at higher techs for some classes. Training yard, naval academy, hippodrome, machinist's shop etc.
Rather than using the training mechanic, they add a "trained" promotion to units of the appropriate class.
"Trained" promotion could give +50% experience from combat, and maybe something else minor.

We could also vary access to these by faction flavor. So some races get a melee booster (orks), others a ranged booster (wood elves), others a cavalry booster (bretonnia), others a beast booster (dark elves), others a recon booster (skaven) etc.

Bloodbowl arena could operate like the arena (chance of death, chance of gain xp + happy) but if you win, the unit gets the "trained" promotion.

i really like this.
 
Hey Ahri, We need to beef up the empire unit list a bit, they look really poor as they stand. here are some ideas of replacements, we just need to figure out how they will differ to the base units and if they should at all.


Halberdiers (replaces Pikemen). as pikeman but +1 defense
Greatswords (Legion UU) as Legion but +1 attack
Flagellants (Fanatic UU)
Hellblaster Volly Gun (New units)
Helstorm rocket battery (New units)
Great Cannon (Cannon UU)
Mortar (Catapult UU)
Hochland Longrifleman (NEw unit)
Knightly Orders (Lancers)
Rieksguard Knigts (Knights)

i also propose we add a new base unit called the 'Legion' (or something else) which is primarily offensive. there are a lot of units that fill the Pikeman slot that should really be a more offensive like the legion (Wardancer, Swordsmaster of hoeth, Greatsword etc)
 
Halbardiers are already in the Empire list (or, they're supposed to be). They are strength 6, +25% vs melee + 25% vs shock cavalry, can use metal weapons, 1 move, starts with musician promotion.

Greatswords are supposed to be the Royal Guard unit UU, they are a royal guard with an extra 10% bonus vs melee.

Hellblaster I oppose. The Empire already has a superior cannon unit, the Great Cannon. They should not be as good at siege as dwarves, or dwarves lose their specialness; the empire should be an "all round good" faction, not an "excellent at everything" faction.

Great cannon should already be there, its a cannon with 2 range bombardment.

Oppose mortar again, leave superior massively siege to the dwarven factions.
Also, blackpowder units should not come until cannons tech.

The Empire gets the basic handgunner; the handgunner unit was designed around the Empire version of it. Most factions don't get this at all, a few have an inferior version (Ind, Skaven).

Not sure if knight orders make sense at the lancer slot, but I don't care much. I don't think they need a superior lancer unit though.
I wouldn't mind making say Reiksguard a Knight UU, but with normal knight stats.

Note, I did want to add units to the design as per:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8925036&postcount=15

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The "pikemen" slot is not really a pikemen slot, its an advanced tier3 melee slot. Its not actually pikemen for most units, chaos warriors, wardancer, swordmasters, etc are all in this slot. It doesn't really matter what you call the class, because almost every faction has a UU in that slot.
Its just a mental design characterization.
 
Not sure if this has been brought up before, but has there been anything on including Westerland and Albion as civs?
 
Not sure if this has been brought up before, but has there been anything on including Westerland and Albion as civs?

I don't really know anything about either one.... I think we're going to struggle to get the current design done, let alone extras. Sorry.
 
In the early stages of development i wanted to include Albion, but like Ahri said we are sticking to the few we have for the moment as i dont think we will get around to adding more in.

Both Westerland and Albion do appear in the mod though:

Westerland is incorporated into the Empire civ

Albion is incorporated into the Brettonia civ
 
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