1st Immortal Victory!!

Really the biggest jump!
After failling at Immortal 6-7 times, I went back to Emperor and forced myself to get out of my confort zone... Playing warmogering civs or going for cultural victories, or whatever I was not doing usualy even knowing it was sound strategy...

Paid off!!! And thanks to lots of you guys... reading the forum and asking few questions here among other things really helped me in many ways.

Wasnt a very heroic vicory tho... Sent the ship with Mayas on turn 384... even if Rome was 2 techs in front of me!

Among other weird things... I took only one city during the game, and retain it for only 2-3 turns despite the fact I was at war with rome for most of the game...

Not sure I can consider myself an Immotal player, but at least I broke the ice!! haha

Congratulations.
I was in your boat a few months ago, but now I can win quite consistently on Immortal(no Deity is not next). A few habits I broke were:
Wonder-whoring
I build roads much earlier now, even if there is tiles to improve. The quicker there is connections to the capital the quicker I generate more gold.
Build 4 cities, preferring a 2 city NC approach. Before I'd build 3 cities.
Research Masonry quicker. Before this wouldn't be a consideration unless stone/marble was nearby but if I'm DOWed early then it's a quick jump to Construction after the NC.

Worker Stealing
Still not perfected this but the first civ I meet I sent a unit towards them in the hope of stealing their workers, and and unguarded settler.
Barb hunting
I like to keep my units close by early on as you never know when a settler escorted by a warrior comes nearby. If they are out hunting barb camps an AI civ might forward settle me.

Congrats! Sound like a very legit win to me!

KingKong76 said:

Really the biggest jump!
After failling at Immortal 6-7 times, I went back to Emperor and forced myself to get out of my confort zone... Playing warmogering civs or going for cultural victories, or whatever I was not doing usualy even knowing it was sound strategy...

Paid off!!! And thanks to lots of you guys... reading the forum and asking few questions here among other things really helped me in many ways.

Wasnt a very heroic vicory tho... Sent the ship with Mayas on turn 384... even if Rome was 2 techs in front of me!

Among other weird things... I took only one city during the game, and retain it for only 2-3 turns despite the fact I was at war with rome for most of the game...

Not sure I can consider myself an Immotal player, but at least I broke the ice!! haha

Click to expand...

If you want a good map to practice warfare on immortal, then i suggest you try this map:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=523901

You play as Mongolia, have access to lots of horse, lots of salt, huge amounts of faith potential, and even fountain of youth. You should be able to roll the map easy as it is so heavily weighed in your favor. But its probably the most fun map i have ever played on civ 5.

sherbz said:

If you want a good map to practice warfare on immortal, then i suggest you try this map:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=523901

You play as Mongolia, have access to lots of horse, lots of salt, huge amounts of faith potential, and even fountain of youth. You should be able to roll the map easy as it is so heavily weighed in your favor. But its probably the most fun map i have ever played on civ 5.

Click to expand...

Ill Do!!!
THnaks!

And thanks to all!

phillipwyllie said:

Congratulations.
I was in your boat a few months ago, but now I can win quite consistently on Immortal(no Deity is not next). A few habits I broke were:
Wonder-whoring
I build roads much earlier now, even if there is tiles to improve. The quicker there is connections to the capital the quicker I generate more gold.
Build 4 cities, preferring a 2 city NC approach. Before I'd build 3 cities.
Research Masonry quicker. Before this wouldn't be a consideration unless stone/marble was nearby but if I'm DOWed early then it's a quick jump to Construction after the NC.

Worker Stealing
Still not perfected this but the first civ I meet I sent a unit towards them in the hope of stealing their workers, and and unguarded settler.
Barb hunting
I like to keep my units close by early on as you never know when a settler escorted by a warrior comes nearby. If they are out hunting barb camps an AI civ might forward settle me.

Click to expand...

Wait a minute??
You guys steal settlers and workers to other civs!?!
And then what, you just propose peace and they accept?
cause really, at immortal yet I have quiet a hard time already to keep the inane unit spamming pace of the AI and keet them at war with each other instead of me...
If I start stealing their sh*t, I cant imagine how tough it will be!

But tell me more, maybe there is someting Im missing...

There are few better ways of dealing with a neighboring warmonger than to steal their workers and settlers. If you've stolen a worker and some turns later the AI asks for peace, be assured that a settler is headed your way. Decline the peace offer and steal the settler. Rinse and repeat, as you assemble an army to cap his capital.

KingKong76 said:

Wait a minute??You guys steal settlers and workers from other civs!?!...

Click to expand...

Indeed, there is nothing more satisfying than bringing an Immortal AI(or Deity) down to Immortal/Emperor level by stealing their settler(s). You should also take 1 worker from a CS(only 1 DOW mind you).

KingKong76 said:

And then what, you just propose peace and they accept?...

Click to expand...

Most of the times, yes for the reason Browd has suggested. But it'll be them proposing the peace. Early war without the mongering(capturing cities) has very little impact on relations with other civs, even more so since the Halloween patch. Just don't denounce and you might even be friends. Don't DOW every civ just your immediate neighbor. As you start trading with other civs you could even get them pariah-ed early on.

Browd said:

...as you assemble an army to cap his capital.

Click to expand...

If the capital isn't on a hill you might even get away with only using archers.

Congrats!!! That's awesome. I'm kinda in the same boat, trying to get to Immortal level. I think I do OK for a while, but haven't a clear vision on what to do in the med/ren eras.

The last game I made a huge mistake. I was Shoshones and had Aztec and Incas on my continent. I got worried one of them would come after me, so I got Monte to double team the Incas with me. I took one Inca city (which stunk, but was right up in my grill), but Monte got the cap and second city. After that, he was too powerful and carpeted the continent. So basically, I killed myself...ha!

Note to self: only double team when it actually HELPS you!

Ok Im stunned!
Belive me Ill give it a shot...
Im not playing Civ5 for a long time... probably loged in 5-600 hours or so (total denial, its probably more haha)... cant tell exactly, cause me and girl friend use the same account.

But believe it or not, I started at level 3 (Chief I think) played 2-3 games there... same for prince... significantly more on King and most of my time on Emperor but I never, ever, did that a single time! I dont remember seeing a youtube video showing or suggesting doing that neither.

But well... it makes sens... so ill give it a shot!

Thanks!

KingKong76 said:

Wait a minute?? You guys steal settlers and workers to other civs!?! And then what, you just propose peace and they accept?

Click to expand...

Yeah, it almost feels like an exploit, it makes the game so much easier! Because it is so OP, most games, I resist specifically hunting for civilians. OTOH, all too often the AI is practically handing them to you. Two worker steal on one turn with a scout? Unescorted settler on my borders? How can I pass those up?

tribefaninnc said:

Congrats!!! That's awesome. I'm kinda in the same boat, trying to get to Immortal level. I think I do OK for a while, but haven't a clear vision on what to do in the med/ren eras.

The last game I made a huge mistake. I was Shoshones and had Aztec and Incas on my continent. I got worried one of them would come after me, so I got Monte to double team the Incas with me. I took one Inca city (which stunk, but was right up in my grill), but Monte got the cap and second city. After that, he was too powerful and carpeted the continent. So basically, I killed myself...ha!

Note to self: only double team when it actually HELPS you!

Click to expand...

Its funny, cause that almost happen to me!
My continent was Shaka, Ceasar, Theodora, nd myself...
Early on, turn 75 I think, Ceasar DoW Shaka and had him exterminate by turn 110...

In the mean time Theodora DoW on me... with really no freakin reasons! Cesar already started to grind her territory, true, so she wanted mine I guess. Anyway, I totaly outdrove her depiste the fact she had like 5 times my army, and lost only one unit for literaly 20-25 (maybe more)!
Basicaly, she lost her whole army... An
d by the time I could build a few more units (Iwas so freakin poor before turn 180 it was crazy) to go after her capital, Ceasar DoW on her and took her 3 cities in like 3-4 turns!

So now Im stock on a continent with the freakin Roman empire haveng 75% of the territory, a HUGE army and most insane incomes on the planet...

Had no choice but to build defensive army and resist! I even ended up taking Constantinople once and I managed to retain it for an AMAZING... ok.. maybe 3 turns!

He was just to strong!

So I decided to go for full science and turtle! Set all my specialists to max out my science and great scientist production. Same for my faith... scientist bying... used 2 spies to steal techs on Ghengis and Ceasar... All of that by trying no to negelect growth and keeping my defensive army up to date.

Then when I got tons of scientists, and pretty much max science I could reach I started to kill them for techs when I ended up killing the last one, I discovered The last ship part... bought it... next turn I was in space! couldnt believe it since Ceasar was 2 techs ahaed and already started ship too...

any way... all of tha to say I was kind of in the same situation!
Good luck!

beetle said:

OTOH, all too often the AI is practically handing them to you. Two worker steal on one turn with a scout? Unescorted settler on my borders? How can I pass those up?

Click to expand...

I think I ran across the stupidest example I've seen of this last night. I'm surrounding Shaka on 3 sides trying to take his cap early on (before the carpet gets rolling). I resisted the urge to DoW early just to steal a worker. The worker hides in the grey just before I DoW. Fine, I move in for the siege. The worker pops up right next to my chariot archer 2 turns later. I take it as spoils of war. The siege wears on, but I'm not making much headway. A couple turns later, out pops a settler from the city and it moves THROUGH my sieging troops. I take it. A couple turns later, out pops a SECOND settler and again it moves THROUGH my troops toward my land. I take it.

The siege didn't go so well (tough terrain, high city strength), but the 3 free workers probably made up for it.

Yeah, the AI likes to scout with civilians while at war. Very strange. After a DoW, it is not stealing! Those are perfectly legitimate spoils of war.

Congrats on the victory, hope I can join your ranks soon (I'm still on Prince or King).

tribefaninnc said:

Note to self: only double team when it actually HELPS you!

Click to expand...

Or when it looks like you've no other choice?

My current game is as Rome, aiming for SV. The year is about the 2000s, I'm the most advanced tech-wise and have a few thousand in gold (~150 gpt). My army is pretty much non-existent; I've been keeping the neighbors happy with trade deals while focusing on science, which is about 800 bpt from 6 cities. I've declined all research agreements but one.

I'm on a continent with Venice and Indonesia, with the Celts nearby. Another big continent is owned by Poland (and formerly Songhai), and the other big continent has China and America, the latter of which has founded 2 cities on my main land mass and has taken the Venetian capital (they took 2 CSs w MoVs).

Some dozen or so turns ago I saw Washington's forces beginning to surround my capital. He then asks if I can join him in war against Indonesia. Fearing the consequences of a "no" answer, I ask for 10 turns. Sure enough, he starts moving those surrounding forces into position towards Indonesia. I took that time to beef up my city defenses and be in a better position to crank out double-promoted units. Afterward, he asks for confirmation that I'm still on board. I said "yes".

So now I'm at war with Indonesia backing up Washington. I might be able to take a city while he wipes out the capital, but what then? I have little reason not to believe he won't just come for me next. Sure, there's the Celts left, but there's no guarantee he'll go that way first.

Should I let him do most of the fighting, putting my units mostly on defense while I build an army? Should I surprise attack him? Pillage his tiles? Hit up unlikely allies? Build a thick layer of units around my capital while I hope to crank out the spaceship before he breaches the defenses? I'm not yet in the Information Era, so I've a ways to go research-wise.

Should I have just not agreed to help him, risking becoming his next immediate target? Or changed my mind after the 10 turns? Feel free to scathe my stats if you find them pathetic; I know I made at least a few mistakes in this game, I'm just wondering if it's even salvageable.

You really have to explain me how you succed to do that...
Every time I tried... ok only twice my unit was dead 2 turns after and worker returned...
I could see that would happen... Im not stupid, but it seems so easy when you say:
Yeah take the worker... and any ettler sent in you direction... yaya just like that!!
loll

What Im missing?

KingKong76 said:

...What Im missing?

Click to expand...

Watch any Deity LP videos especially Acken's as he seems quite expert at stealing workers. You need to wait for the best moment when the AI's units are more than 2 hexes away or there's rough terrain in the way. Try to use an upgraded warrior(to spear man) as they can withstand more damage than a warrior/scout. Taking workers from ring 3 is the better choice. If using multiple units to steal workers from the same city you can use the stolen worker as bait to try and lure the garrisoned unit out.
Taking guarded settlers is just like any warfare but you want to heard them away from you as they might settle right there and then. Baiting with workers might help.

It's not easy to do and I'm no expert but I think the trick is in spotting the right opportunity and taking it.

KingKong76 said:

You guys steal settlers and workers to other civs!?!
And then what, you just propose peace and they accept?

Click to expand...

Yeah. It's incredibly stupid and exploitative. I have no issues with taking workers/settlers if I'm actually going to war, but I have never and will never "worker steal" like that...and I can easily beat Deity without doing it.

Early fisticuffs
This is another habit I've broken, before I'd be like Gandhi and try and play the peaceful game. Consider my last game as Spain, although I did a bit of warmongering to keep Japan at bay and Arabia who just wanted to forward settle me I generated a GG quite quickly. Having settled Ularu and KSM I though that'll be it until I saw LV not to far from KSM....
Having an early GG is nice as you never know when you might need it.

I blew my GG on s citadel