Colonialist Legacies: Histories of the New World | Colonial + Pre-Colonial civs

Perhaps I should be more amenable to the idea, then. I have a conducive theme, at least (European civs). Maybe I'll think of a fancy project title to replace the bland and factual title I currently have.

I appreciate your response. It has given me something to think about.
 
"Eurovision"
 
If you're focusing on obscure European polities that were at each other's throats (i.e. all of them), you might care to call it "Maxim's Response".

At an arms fair, I forget which, Hiram Maxim's machine gun got a lukewarm response, but he was told afterwards by a supporter (forgive my paraphrasing here) "Send it to Europe. Europeans love to buy things that enable them to kill other Europeans."

Or something like that, anyway. =]
 
If you're focusing on obscure European polities that were at each other's throats (i.e. all of them)

:lol:

Come on, not all of them. For example Poland and Hungary are friendly towards each other... I mean we had few wars with them but comparing to other European countries -



Oh.


:crazyeye:


Lol yeah, if I remember properly my country had something like 18 (full scale) wars with Russia/Rus, something similar has been always happening between France and England :crazyeye: England was clashing with Scotland, Holy Roman Empire and Italian city states were permanent mess, Scandinavia origins from Viking raiders and goes to Norway - Denmark - Sweden random dynasty conflicts, Balkans were insane and... Yeah :lol:


At current speed of creating more or less obscure civs, I wouldn't be shocked if right before Civ VI Pouakai would release Poland split - Pomerania, Great Poland, Lesser Poland and Masovia :crazyeye: (right after releasing Gotland Civilisation)
 
Pomerania will only come about with the Doge Civ split. =]
 
At current speed of creating more or less obscure civs, I wouldn't be shocked if right before Civ VI Pouakai would release Poland split - Pomerania, Great Poland, Lesser Poland and Masovia :crazyeye: (right after releasing Gotland Civilisation)

Hehehehehe.
 
 
BE PREPARED!!

 
You appear to have The Waterhole on there twice, but no Pride Rock. This seems a little odd to me. =]
 
All DoM screens do this, it's basically a repetition of the same map :)

Pride Rock is behind Simba.
 
Ah, righto. Never noticed that before. =]

If you want me to do DoM speeches for anyone else in CL, hit me up, 'kay? Simba's was a lot of fun to write.
 
Returning to Vietnam
Civ is closer and closer to completion :D
But as we all wanna it to be perfect, I have one idea...
In the past there were two ideas for Vietnamese Trait - mine and TPangolin's. Finally I decided that mine idea was impossible to balance and not really fitting this civ.

Currently Vietnamese Trait is:




One Eternal Vietnam - Each outgoing Trade Route connecting with another civilization in the empire adds +5 Defensive Strength to all cities.




And I have to admit, I really like it. However I am not really sure if it is enough for Civ Trait - each previous Colonialist Civ had two or three parts of the trait!
Australia - colonial buildings + bonus production from mines
Canada - bonus happiness + claiming neutral land + delegates
Mexico - walls boosting artists + additional XP + faster artists generation after ideology
Philippines - unique building stuff + cheaper cargo ships
Vietnam - only bonus defense...


So, in my opinion, in order to not make Vietnam (historically overpowered :lol: ) underpowered or boring, we would need second part of this UA. There was one guy in Ideas and Suggestions thread who said that Vietnamese Trait is too bland - I am afraid that many people wouldn't like it (there are many players who deny any value of city strenght :p )

by Meowschwitz* - I don't like the UA for Vietnam. It's just not all that good. I think you should add in a boost like +1 culture for every 10 city defense strength. If you're worrying about city defense because you're being attacked, then you're trade routes are probably already plundered. (...)To be fair, it's probably just my playstyle that looks at city defense as one of the most worthless things to boost.
I generally play immortal and I've always found Archers/Other units are a much better alternative than walls. I'd only build them if there was some other side benefit to these defensive buildings like India's UB. Still a small boost to actually encourage increasing city defense doesn't sound too horrible. And while it's all nice and good to encourage honor, I firmly think that should be done by making honor more appealing rather than pigeon-holing a civ into the same playstyle each game. The Water Puppet Theatre is useless if you don't go honor. That just isn't my cup of tea.


I was thinking on something interesting, balanced, and reflecting Vietnamese superb defense and ability to retake already lost territories. And also remaining with TPangolin's (and mine!) 'Defensive Vietnam' flavour. And this is my idea:


One Eternal Vietnam - Each outgoing :trade: Trade Route connecting with another civilization in the empire adds +5 :c5strength: Defensive Strength to all cities. Each Vietnamese unit adjacent to former city of Vietnam taken by enemy gains +1 :c5strength: per every :c5citizen: of this city.


Now, wait before you scream 'OP'! This ability is not only interesting, unique and reflects Vietnamese Resistance and Uprisings, but also remains useful and balanced:

Spoiler :
Population of city is cut by half when it is captured by army. This perfectly balances bonus unit strenght of Vietnamese units. Early cities have only few population points and would provide minor but useful strenght boost. Later eras remain surprisingly balanced - in medieval/renaissance average cities have around 12 pop, +6 to strenght only for units adjecent to enemy city is cool but not OP. And this would be the best period of Vietnamese UA - which is historically correct as Vietnam had its golden ages in medieval/renaissance :D
In very late game, only the biggest cities have something like 30 pop. +15 combat strenght is something like +20% bonus for modern army, less significant for endgame units.

- It applies only for frontline units which risk much while being adjacent to enemy city - only them receive bonus. It is very useful for them but not gamebreaking as even with this bonus taking siege/ranged units so close to city ends badly - and melee units still aren't so strong to capture the city alone. Also, how many units can you fit adjacently to city during difficult siege? Two, three? If you can encircle the entire city with units, it means it is already lost even without Vietnamese Trait :D

- It applies only for FORMER VIETNAMESE CITIES TAKEN BY ENEMY. So Vietnam doesn't receive bonus towards its own cities - this would be OP when connected with bonus Defensive Strenght. It also doesn't receive bonus towards all enemy cities which would make ridiculous domination civ out of defensive Vietnam - TPangolin doesn't want them to become domination civ :)

This extended trait actually requires some tactics and engagement. I can imagine Vietnamese player who does exactly what Vietnamese generals did when their country was overrun by enemies - abandons city which is impossible to defend, retreats to better tactical position, regroups, and retakes the city using Vietnamese Patriotism [Trait :p ].


To sum up, this trait, combination of mine and TPangolin's ideas, is immersive, requires some strategy, remains balanced and perfectly reflects Vietnamese history.

Please review it ;)
 
Sucks. =]
 
Lol :lol: why? I demand extremely reasonable review with very deep understanding of Civ5, modding, IT, history, military and quantum mechanics.

EDIT
Hey TPangolin, I have just realised that this guy noticed one very interesting thing - Water Puppet Theatre is useless without Honor.

Yeah, I am not sure about this design choice (although I really like bonus food/culture from honor policies!). I have an alternate solution: replace UA with UB. So:

- One Eternal Vietnam - +5% to :c5food: food and :c5culture: culture in cities for each Honor policy branch finished. Each Vietnamese unit adjacent to former city of Vietnam taken by enemy gains +1 :c5strength: per every :c5citizen: of this city.

aaand UB would be:

- Water Puppet Theatre - Each outgoing Trade Route connecting with another civilization in the empire adds +5 :c5strenght: Defensive Strength to all cities with Watet Puppet Theatres.

Now we achieve THREE goals: firstly, WPT is not useless without Honor. Secondly, it prevents 'unfair' exploitation of game mechanics when player would spam cities in the frontline and immediately get giant defensive bonus for them (imagine that you are playing against Vietnam on Immortal and AI spawn lots of cities impossible to conquer!) - now Defensive Bonus requires building WPT. Thirdly, previous solution was penalizing founding new cities - they had to build WPT before gaining bonus tile and food growth. :(
 
One Eternal Vietnam - Each outgoing Trade Route connecting with another civilization in the empire adds +5 Defensive Strength to all cities. Each Vietnamese unit adjacent to former city of Vietnam taken by enemy gains +1 per every of this city.

I dont think it synergyses very well, seeing as the second part of the UA requires you to loose a city first, and you shouldnt be loosing cities as Vietnam in the first place.
 
On the other hand, this will make Vietnam difficult to conquer not only while attacking its cities but also after taking them :p this is also historical... And adds yet another tactical decision - what is better, getting city defense bonus or unit defense bonus? Yet another layer of Vietnamese defenses. Personally I don't see the lack of synergy here :( outside of purely abstract divagations.

You could say the same thing about Canadian trait! First part of it:
- when cavalry remains in city, increases happiness
Second part:
- when cavalry doesn't remain in city it can claim neutral land!

So you're basically saying that first part of the Canadian trait contradicts the second one. I see interesting tactical choice here - what is better, tile expansion or happiness boost? The same with mine Vietnamese trait.

ALSO, you basically say that GREEK trait contradicts itself! City-State influence degrades at half and recovers at twice the normal rate. - Greece, diplomatic civ shouldn't lose influence in city states below zero :lol:

See? Yet nobody complains on that.

The same thing happens with Ethiopia (spam many cities to get steles or go tall and gain combat bonus?), Sweden (awesome Carolean invasion unit and peaceful ability!) and few high quality custom civs (among them - TPangolins awesome Canada and mounted units ;) ). 'Contradiction' or interesting unique choice? I prefer second interpretation. Contradiction would be something like 'has bonus faith points from Nachos resource but needs 50% more faith points to generate great prophet' :lol: Also, I don't like straightforward and boring 'let's make civilisation which has only bonuses towards science' :p


Obviously, everything depends on TPangolin's and Senshidendhi's verdicts :D
 
It was only a joke, hun. =]

Seriously, though, I'm not entirely convinced by the second part. Don't get me wrong, it's certainly interesting, but I just don't think it'd be very useful. In most games, I spam Artillery/Battleships, beat the city down to 0 HP with those, and then take it with Armoured Units/Destroyers, depending on the map type. I don't go in for melee carpets of doom, is what I'm saying here. Now don't get me wrong, the way I choose to play is not the only one, not by a long shot, but it is very effective, particularly on higher difficulty settings. What I propose is the following:-

UA: One Eternal Vietnam
Each of the empire's outgoing International Trade Routes adds +5 :c5strength: Defensiveness to all Cities. Every time a City is taken by an enemy Civ, your units gain a permanent +5% Combat Bonus. This only applies once per City.

I think this does what you're trying to do a little bit better; rather than give a weird, fluctuating boost that'd be damned hard to code, it works on the same principle as Assyria's tech-nicking thing, but more defensive in nature. What d'you think?
 
One Eternal Vietnam - Each outgoing Trade Route connecting with another civilization in the empire adds +5 Defensive Strength to all cities. Each Vietnamese unit adjacent to former city of Vietnam taken by enemy gains +1 per every of this city.

I dont think it synergyses very well, seeing as the second part of the UA requires you to loose a city first, and you shouldnt be loosing cities as Vietnam in the first place.

maybe each honor SP you take adds defense to cities?

Bonus defense for cities built near jungle (get +5 tiles per adjacent jungle tile?)
 
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