Can't get anywhere as Russia - Bankrupt and Unhappy in early game.

H

HerrMansen

Chieftain
Joined
Apr 12, 2010
Messages
7
I haven't touched the game since G&K where I played a few games before shelving the game again (So I am by no means a Civ V veteran)

Got Brave New World a few days ago and won with Morocco (Basically ended up being able to pick my victory in the end). Fueled by this victory I random'ed Russia. Scout, Shrine, Worker, Settler (I like competing for dominant religion for its bonuses to gold and the ability to buy units later on) and quickly settled four initial cities (This was Pangea so I had to be a bit aggressive to avoid being surrounded on all sides)

Because nobody seemed to have any tradeable luxury goods (myself included), unhappiness was coming in fast - even with Colosseums it was a losing battle - I started losing money fast as well in spite of three, 5-8 gold trade routes to other civs.

Disaster - By the time I had researched and built markets I was bleeding 13 gold a turn and unhappiness was at 6. I eventually gave up and ragequitted for the night.

--------

So what am I doing wrong here? I realize that Russia is more of a military attuned civilization but with only a single military unit I am bleeding so much money that I could never hope to amass an actual army. :sad:
 
My guess is that you're spreading way too fast. Don't found cities you can't support yet. Also, make sure you have roads between your cities because those are still a major source of income early on.
 
VainoValkea said:
My guess is that you're spreading way too fast. Don't found cities you can't support yet. Also, make sure you have roads between your cities because those are still a major source of income early on.
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I am horrible at micromanaging so my workers usually go on Auto early on - Roads were built aplenty. Overextending is a good point - I noticed that the AI seems to stop at three cities. Maybe I should try that next time.

Martinus said:
Could I ask what policies did you choose?
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I "think" I picked Piety first for the half off Shrines and Temples and then Liberty from there on for the workers and settlers.
 
Are you sure that you were having 5+ international trade routes & still loosing money? :eek: Seems like you had a huge military then.

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Did you connect everything with roads? Contrary to what someone else have said, building roads early on can be a massive gold drain, until the cities grow sufficiently.
 
Babri said:
Are you sure that you were having 5+ international trade routes & still loosing money? :eek: Seems like you had a huge military then.
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I only had three - Turn 170 :)

I loaded up my game again and realized that my religious units also costed me upkeep - Never realized this with Morocco. No wonder I was going bankrupt with that many workers and Great Prophets/Inquisitors idling.

I'll try again with just three cities and avoid spawning religious units before I need them (I bought the Inquisitors to avoid getting another Prophet - The AI always gets pissed if I use them on them)

Martinus said:
Did you connect everything with roads? Contrary to what someone else have said, building roads early on can be a massive gold drain, until the cities grow sufficiently.
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My workers did - Pains of auto-improve.
 
You have to find some way to earn money in BNW - trade is one option, trade routes, religion with +gold policies, working tiles with gold (luxuries tile), puppets (or even some of your cities) should have trade posts, choose policies that give money or reduce costs etc. Watch for maintenance costs, too many unneeded units drain money fast. Also don't build everything just to have it, you don't need barracks and stable in every city. Try to optimize your economy and cities generally.

Once you have good economy you can go to war. Then rebuild economy after the war. Repeat. Win :)
 
I would say that roads are probably the biggest culprit. They now cost 1 gold per tile, so are extremely expensive, especially when you lack any source of income. Likewise, all units cost upkeep, not just the military ones, and I think the cost tends to go up geometrically at some point - so wonders such as Pyramids or Borobadur can quickly plunge you into red.
 
Martinus said:
Did you connect everything with roads? Contrary to what someone else have said, building roads early on can be a massive gold drain, until the cities grow sufficiently.
Click to expand...

I thought that even small cities tend to break even when connected with roads.
 
VainoValkea said:
I thought that even small cities tend to break even when connected with roads.
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As already mentioned here the formula for profitable road connection with the city is the following:

If your capital pop lower than 8, the city population should be N+1, where N is an amount of road tiles required to connect this city into the network.

If your capital pop is 8 or higher, the city population should be the same as an amount of road tiles required to connect this city into the network.

Of course, this is correct before you get the commerce policy. Also note, that if you go liberty you can sacrifice some income if you are short on happiness.
 
VainoValkea said:
I thought that even small cities tend to break even when connected with roads.
Click to expand...

As a rule of thumb, connecting a city is generally profitable when the number of road tiles you use is the same as the population.

As for OP, it seems like you got unlucky with lack of unique luxuries, and expanded too quickly. I'd guess you have too many workers and to automate them is dangerous and should definitely be avoided as you move up to higher difficulties.
 
Well you should not auto workers imho. And roads can kill you!!!! The best way I found to road up is by going both directions. That way you only have to have each worker do a few tiles each. And like what was said above, do not do this to early.
 
If you have a consolidated empire (as you would likey have on a pangea map), then auto-building works pretty well, so don't pay heed to the big taboo. When I ignored the computer, I often found myself building mines that didn't get worked because there wasn't enough food, or waiting too long to build a road.

If you find yourself in a bad spot where there aren't other civ's to trade with, or luxuries to provide enough happiness, I find that Tradition is the best policy set.
 
Automating workers early in the game seems to be a bad idea--in particular, don't have them automatically building roads, they won't necessarily make the best route. When you control the worker yourself, evaluate each time he needs a new task to figure what you need most: food, gold or production. Automated seems to prioritize food, but sometimes you need to slow growth in order to fix your economy.
 
I don't think you pay for road tiles that are not within your national borders. Start building your road from the middle (in "no-man's land") and build out from there, both directions if you like, toward your cities. This way, you only start paying for roads toward the end of the completion of the route (once your worker has re-entered your national borders), but the time you are paying for it before connection is much shorter.

Of course, once your borders expand to encompass those road segments between the cities, you will then start paying for them. However, that has given your cities time to grow and therefor mitigate, if not eliminate, the cost.
 
renkenbd said:
I don't think you pay for road tiles that are not within your national borders. Start building your road from the middle (in "no-man's land") and build out from there, both directions if you like, toward your cities. This way, you only start paying for roads toward the end of the completion of the route (once your worker has re-entered your national borders), but the time you are paying for it before connection is much shorter.

Of course, once your borders expand to encompass those road segments between the cities, you will then start paying for them. However, that has given your cities time to grow and therefor mitigate, if not eliminate, the cost.
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I remember this being debunked a very long time ago. If you build that road in non controled area, you are going to be paying full price for it.
 
I did't know it was debunked. Now I'll have to try it in my next game and see.

I don't usually use this strategy myself as I am a little OCD when it comes to roads: I always build them for aesthetic value first. As such, I don't always build them in the most cost-efficient manner and never pay attention to how much it is costing me; don't ever tell me the cost. :)
 
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