Tholal has still not released an update of More Naval AI, so I still cannot fix the biggest bugs i my modmod yet. I guess I'll take this time to reply to a couple pages of this thread instead.
I'm not sure if anyone else raised this issue, but you may want to examine the relative strengths of the Gargoyles and Iron Golems. The Gargoyles have the same strength as the Iron Golems, can obtain the same golem promotions, receive bonus promotions, do not require any resource to build, require less tech investment, and are cheaper to construct if you have marble and iron. Unless I am missing something, the Gargoyles are superior in every way.
Also, what is the trigger for new golems to receive the strong promotion?
Check out my super city. I think I have 49 free specialists.
Gargoyles were made stronger because they replace Longbowmen, which are much more useful in my modmod. It didn't seem right though to give them Ranged Attacks. I guess I just did not notice that their strength ended up tying with Iron Golems.
What would be a good way of changing that? Maybe give Gargolyes greater defensive strength and lower offensive strength? Maybe weaken them overall but give them the Winged promotion (which lets them add and remove Flying)?
Not sure of the mechanics of this, but in the last 5 games I have played, every time the Lurchuirp are the dominate force. In terms of the size of their empire, they are good, but in terms of their research, they are HUGE. Every time they are absolutely miles ahead of every other ai, and quite a bit ahead of me (I play monarch level). While its great that there is some challenging here, why is there such a discrepancy between them and everyone else?
I think a big part of it is their Creation mana, which gives research and great person rate bonuses as well as very useful spells to give more specialists, food, and health. The only other civ to start with this mana is the Kuriotates, which cannot take full advantage of it in their settlements. If I recall correctly, in classical start games the Luchuirp start with Adepts whereas the Kuriotates do not, which lets them use the advantage sooner. One of their leaders also has the arcane trait, letting them use Creation II and III sooner.
This is thematically appropriate though, so I probably won't change it.
I'd remove free GP from workshops for lurchuirp and for Guild of Endeavours, that is all.
I have already removed the GP from Sculter's Studios, but don't plan to change the wonder that any civ could build.
I don't know, when I can summon dozens of skeletons per turn, it doesn't really matter how weak they are individually. And summoning a djinn with a strength of 85, before promotions, means there is essentially nothing you can't beat.
They are impressive, but not all that effective against Magic Immune units.
Just a couple of questions about the illians.
1. Iv'e just completed divine essence, and it says that if I have the white hand holy city (I do) I can build aquilians beast units. Cannot find their icon to build.
2. Are the illians considered to have a dragon unit (Drifa) ? In the civ info is says they have this dragon, however, in the units section its says drifa is a beast unit. Having just completed divine essence, I cannot see awake from slumber ritual as being available, so I'm assuming the illians cannot build it?
You should be able to build Aquilans in the White Hand Holy city if you have the White Hand
state religion and the Divine Essence technology.
Beast units are a unitcombat, like Melee, Archer, or Mounted. Drifa is a beast unit that should only serve the Illians (Auric)
The Stir from Slumber ritual requires the Cult of the Dragon religion be present in the city performing it.
Stir from Slumber will only give Drifa to Auric if someone has already completed The Draw. Drifa will not rise to serve just any Illian leader, but only one who is close to becoming a god.
I think you need Drifa's bones in order to be able to perform the Stir from Slumber ritual.
You don't need to control the Bones of Drifa, but Drifa will be created on the tile that held her bones.
Drifa can also be acquired by casting the Resurrection spell on the site of her bones, but only after Stir from Slumber is completed. This can be used if she was awakened and then killed (leaving her bones behind where she died) or if you did not get her because The Draw had not been completed.
I got Driffa, which happened to be near my capital, but I was playing Amarites.
Do you mean that Drifa was under your control as an Amurite (that should not have happened) or that an Illian player got her through the ritual when you happened to be nearby?
Does that mean if the Ilian say did the Stir from Slumber ritual, that the appopriate dragon spawns in the appropriate place? The Ilians get Drifa, Sheaim get Abashi, Kuriotates get Eurabates?
Are there any more dragons besides Acheron out there? I know about the Octopus Overlords one.
There are 5 dragons, all spawned on the site of their bones.
Stupid Modmod trick:
You can merge your heroes with flesh golems and then use Life III to bring them back. You can probably do this in vanilla FFH2, but only with national heroes. This makes for some really spectacular flesh golems.
Also, any unit that has the great commander promotion can pass it on to the flesh golem and if the first unit was hero if you resurrect it, it will come back with the great commander promotion. This enables the player to gather as many free great commanders as you have Life III spells (for all that's worth. It's hardly gamebreaking.)
I intend to remove these exploits.
From what people said, I entered world builder and placed cult of dragon in one of my cities (that religion, at this late stage in my game is nearly non existent because of wars). This then, did allow me to build stir from slumber. Upon completion Archon and Drifa came to life (other dragon civs dead), however, both were barb unit, even though I was Illian.
Drifa was a barbarian? That should not be happening unless a barbairan Beastmaster captured her from Auric.
The prereqs should be made known somewhere. E.g. the civilopedia. Otherwise its kinda hard to just guess them.
I thought that the civilopedia would already show it automatically, but I don't feel like checking at this moment. If it does not, then I'll add an explanation there. (A mouseover strategy or help text would do no good if the ability is unavailable because you don't havethe right tech yet.)
I don't know if anyone has reported before , the ability that unit can turn defeated unit into food and production isn't working. Not even inside the boundary that the ability suppose to be in effect.
It was working last time I tested it.
Are the zero tile yields for black sea and abyss intentional? Found it surprising, given that the basic yields don't change on land (from e.g. grassland to broken lands).
I forget. The descriptions of hell's bodies of water don't sound like anything that would provide much seafood though.
Have been messing with the Infernal Grimoire a bit, and decided to have a peek at what the possible outcomes of reading it are; while doing so noticed PROMOTION_POTENCY in a couple of places - should that be PROMOTION_ARCANE instead, given the way (I believe) this mod has revamped the Arcane trait?
Thanks. I fixed this.
when trading units with another civ, now many turns have to pass before they can move?
I have no idea how that is determined. I have not touched Tholal's code there.
Spotted a typo in the section of CvSpellInterface.py for the spell Wonder: "pPlot.setBonusType(gc.getInfoTypeForString('BONUS_MUSHROOM'))'" ought to be "pPlot.setBonusType(gc.getInfoTypeForString('BONUS_MUSHROOMS'))" - noticed when I got the effect and it removed the previous bonus rather than replacing it with mushrooms.
Also, I see that some of the more exotic new animal buildings (I really like this feature, incidentally), like the Sea Serpent and Giant Tortoise Tank, give neither culture, additional happiness or resources/promotions like the Spider and Scorpion counterparts do; is this as intended, or are they a work-in-progress? Adding bonuses on par with e.g. the Tiger Cage would be suitable, IMHO.
Thanks again. I fixed the typo and plan to add the cage bonuses.
Is there a way to prevent the game from removing the wrong religions in scenarios?
You would have to edit the scenario files.
I was thinking the game options were set in a long series of 0s and 1s like in the ini files, but when I opened Fall of Cuantine in Notepad++ to check I found that they are actually written out in full. That should make them pretty easy to change.
Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_0 => Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_3
Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_1 => Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_0
Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_2 => Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_4
Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_3 => Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_2
Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_4 => Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_6
Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_5 => Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_1
Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_6 => Option=GAMEOPTION_NO_RELIGION_5
Note that this change is needed to use scenarios with my modmod at all:
ModPath=Mods\Fall from Heaven 2 => ModPath=Mods\Magister Modmod for FfH2
I would make these changes myself and include the modified versions of the scenarios in the installer, but I'm pretty sure at least a couple of the scenarios are no longer compatible with my modmod anyway. I'd rather not bother until I can assure compatibility.
I'm approaching the end of another game. This time as the Grigori. And there's a few points I'd like to raise for consideration. As a whole, I am enjoying much of the modmod. There are a lot of interesting things in it that make the game different and complex. But there are a few things that I think someone should look into changing if possible.
[*]Explroring a lot, I got 3 treasure chests. 2 of them contained Tomor Masks.There should be some check so that unique items can't be duplicated like that,
That lair exploring behavior is unchanged from base FfH2. I suppose I could add checks to prevent pieces of equipment from being generated if they have existed in the game already, but that would be a bit of a hassle. I'm not completely sure that things like the Jade Torq are meant to be truly unique. I don't think I should allow more than one Spear of Majosi though.
[*]Weapons like Orcus's Ax should not be something that can be taken by another unit after it has been used in combat that turn. I faced a stack much larger than mine, but with more strong units on my side and more with multiple moves. By taking the ax by unit after unit I got something like 20-25 kills more than I would have if only one unit kept the ax.
I suppose I could add a check to prevent taking equipment from a unit that has already attacked (it would have to apply to all equipment, as the code would quickly get to complicated otherwise), but I rather like that exploit. It can be really hard for a poor human like me to compete with all the fodder of those cheating AIs otherwise.
[*]Building the Alters of Lunator with Lunator (sp) units is just too cheap of a way towards victory. That should be disabled.
I have no intention of removing this feature, although I may increase (double?) the level prerequisites for each Altar building ability.
[*]Does it really make sense that triremes can routinely beat privateers?
[*]Does it make sense that privateers and frigates can be built without blasting powder?
I don't recall adjusting anything about these units (except adding ranged attacks to Frigates). I may do so. I might also decide to remove the Privateer unit entirely and instead make it a promotion.
[*]I built the Mercurian Gate because the Infernal was destroying a continent. But then Basius just sat there. 50 Angels locked up in one of my cities for 20 turns while the Basius unit suicided a lone charge against a stack 70 strong.
The suicidal behavior of heroes is caused by a bug that Tholal introduced into his last release of More Naval AI, which is included in my modmod. He clams to have fixed it but we are still waiting for his next update. The other issue I believe is related to his lack of a city, which I explain later.
[*]At the same time, that stack did not come after me right after I DoWed. If it had, I was scattered, and could have been hurt really bad. What I am looking for in a game is not just an AI that builds a ton of units, and not one that will declare war at the drop of a hat, but one that makes better decisions on where and when to fight. I don't know how to do that, or if it can be done. But that's what I really want. And better decisions on which units to build. Building 60 imps or dozens of adepts doesn't help an AI that does not really use the magic spells. If that had been 60 axmen, it would have been far more effective. And why did that stack not attack the other enemies before I got over to that continent? They were at war long before I crossed the ocean.
I'm afraid I know little to nothing about programming AI behavior. I rely on Tholal for that.
I was just playing a game as Tebryn, with Bones of Abashi on a hill near my capital. A little ways into the game, units in my capital started to gain the enraged promotion and move out of the city. At the same time, I noticed Bones of Abashi had disappeared. What happened? I was completely isolated by peaks in this game, so I hadn't met any other players let alone gone to war.
Bones of Abashi should not disappear until Stir from Slumber is completed (in which case Abashi would be created on the site, under Tebryn's control if he is in the game and another Sheaim leader otherwise), but the Bones of Acheron tend to disappear early when the Barbarian state builds Acheron.
It is important for reasons I won't go into that the Bones of Acheron be marked as bUnique. The game engine automatically places improvements with this tag on the map, and there is not much I could do about it. I suppose I could remove it in python at the start of the game, but that might cause issues if people choose to regenerate the map. It would also not stop the improvement from influencing starting positions on the map.
Enraged may be granted either by Crazed or Rebellious. Rebellious is given automatically to units of the Cult of the Dragon religion that belong to players that don't have dragons. A while back I changed it so that Sheaim (or Kuriotates, or Barbarian) units should never be effected by that, but you may be using an older version.
I should have been the Bones of acheron ..
Acheron is "raised" relatively earlyin the game by the barbs, so his skeleton disappears very quickly.
as for the enraged, no ideas.
@ magister:
I didn't notice at that time, but as girgori are atheist.. they can't get any temple... and thus can't get any of all those free specialists... wouldn't that boni (the temples specialists bonus) be a double edge sword that strikes the grigori in full force ?
I actually ended up removing the Agnostic/Misotheist trait as it wasn't really doing much, but the Grigori still cannot build temples. Other players can use priests to build temples in their cities though.
When my units go on to serve the Infernal, is that killing my living units or resurrecting my dead?
When units die, there is a chance that their death will provide the Infernals or Mercurians with Manes or Angels. As far as the game is concerned it just creates a new unit, but they do get the religion and xp of the unit you lost.
OK, Something just happened that I don't understand. When I completed the Mercurian Gate, the Mercurians didn't get a city. They are still hold up in one of my cities, and not moving. But when an AI completed Infernal Pact, I got kicked out of a city I had just taken from the other Infernal to create a new Infernal civ. Why is it happening like that?
In basic FfH2 Basium's Convert City spell allows him to take control only of a city containing the Mercurian Gate. I changed it so that it has no building requirement, but only works in cities owned by AI teammates. It cannot take Capital cities and unless the other player has at least twice as many cities as Basium it will only work in Settlements.
I disabled the spell in cities owned by human players because I strongly prefer being able to choose what cities to give my ally rather. This worked well for a while, but unfortunately without my knowledge Tholal's last More Naval AI update disabled all diplomatic relations with AI players that do not own any cities. (Apparently this was to fix problems related to diplomacy with rebel factions generated by the revolutions component.) He has since then agreed to make an exception that permits diplomacy with teammates even when they do not own cities, but he has not released another update since then.
I think the Mercurians start out with a very military focused AI, which might stop them from using their settler very well. On the other hand, they are much better at conquest once they get going, and are often the strongest civ in my games.
Infernal Pact should never give the Infernals a city owned by the player that summoned them. It should only select cities that have the Ashen Veil present and belong to one of their summoner's rivals (and not anyone's capital city). Which qualifying city is determined by factors like population, buildings, and wonders present in the city.
Is it possible that another player happened to finish the Infernal Pact at the same time you did, and your city was taken by the Demon Lord they summoned?
Are the BUG alerts working? I have them enabled in the BUG options but none are firing.
I don't really know anything about BUG alerts. It should work the same in my modmod as it does in Tholal's More Naval AI, as I did not touch anything BUG related that I copied from it.
I'm sorry if this more of a general FfH question (I haven't played the base mod much) but when I built Infernal Pact, I made sure to spread Ashen Veil to one city from another civ. I expected the Infernals to take that city, but instead they spawned in a tundra area. Is that normal? Could Ashen Veil have spread to a barbarian city?
theoretically (unless Magsiter changed that) Hyborem is summoned on a patch of land that is out of any cultural borders. He is summoned with manes and with a settler. (thus He will never be summoned inside your civ or any other civ territory .. a consequence is that often Hyborem is summoned in tundra or desert as those are generaly the only un-civilized places remaining.)
Then he can use his world spell to subdue/convert some cities with AV on them. But that is a different matter.
They might be able to only take a city from a civ that actually follows the Veil, as well.
In the base mod the Infernals would always spawn on a random tile, which is heavily weighted to be unowned and thus is usually a marginal tile like Tundra or Snow. (It is possible for Hyborem to spawn within cultural borders, but it rarely happens unless every single tile is owned.)
My modmod defaults to that method (but gives them a Hellfire improvement and a plot counter of 100 on that tile) if there are no valid target cites for the Infernals to steal.
It is possible for AV to spread to barbarian cities and for the Infernals to enter the world by stealing a barbarian city, but barbarian cities do not often have the population, buildings, and wonders to make them as likely targets as cities owned by real players.
As I mentioned, cities that are owned by the player that completed the ritual that summons that particular demon lord are not valid targets for the Infernals to steal. If you want the demon lords you summon to start out with cities, you should spread AV to your rivals' cities rather than your own.
per priest or the +xp to disciple units ... they have no temples so very few priest slots and very few disciple units that may use the xp)
)
) - currently even civs following Esus could only capture such equipment-units if at war with the owner, as unfortunately the Steal "spell" only works if the equipment is attached to a unit or city. Anyway, it makes sense to me that leaving valuable equipment "lying around" would be risky; which isn't really the case currently, but would be if they were always capturable (unless attached to a unit or city).
