SIP supposed to have food?

well, now we are comparing bad caps to surrounding land....kinda different methinks and I don't know what OPs surrounding land is like.

The Sumer cap start is quite good. The surrounding land not so much, but would be more than fine with GLH. The most important thing is you have pretty good food, even in surrounding land. With that the world is your oyster.

I still like to know what map script the OP used to get that start, cause I've never seen one that bad on a "normal" map in BTS....and it is very bad, Nate, no matter how you spin it. (edit: well, certainly close to that bad..ha)

Elite...how dare you present us with that abomination ...my eyes! my eyes!

On that sumeria start, I'd prefer to have settled 1 NE to be able to build another city between the cow and horses. I can see 6 good city locations up to the corn, and there might be more after that. If Kublai is close you can block him off easily, hope for copper to vulture rush, or take his cities later.

You mean your other NE, bhavv. Nate may have not had the map knowledge to make that decision at the start. The dead fish is a shame, but that happens sometimes. However, you are right, there are plenty enough reasonable cities here for the early game and a very nice cap to get started. GLH would make it sweet.

Oops yes, my other NE.

And yea, if that was done the fish would be unworkable, so instead I would just WB in an extra land tile to the east for another city.

Go go WB.

ha..well, do what you like for fun, but that is generally frowned upon

No food can be fine, esp. with early rush Civs like Celts, Romans.
I will agree with Nate, it's not an unplayable or terrible start it's just not standard.
You can work only gold (or probably better, FPs and gold with the time your worker needs for improving gold ), chop forests for workers, settlers and tech IW.
No reason why that cannot result in something fun with gallics.

OK it is pangea, normal size, 8 players, solid shoreline. medium sea level.

Nate, where in the world would you get the idea that this Sumerian start (having 2 seafood sources, a grassland pig, plains cow, and plains horse) is BAD. That's [potentially] a crushing win of a start. The surrounding land has room for 1 mediocre production/early scientist city, 1 fine production/whipping/specialist (fish/clam and hills) city, and 1 production with calendar resource. Sure there's some desert there, but what you have there in the cap is a whipping dream along with some fine production (3 half fed hills, a plains cow, AND a plains horse). This looks like a good SE start with potential HA rush written all over it.

How is this a bad start? I have a cap right now that looks similar (only no horse or cows) and the surrounding land is total crap with Zara (REXer) immediately past that crappy land. I still considered it a pretty damn good start and have since claimed all of Zara's fine land compliments of food heavy whipping and judicious use of specialists.

Yea you can just set such a capital up for a HA rush with a couple more cities too.

Or if you had copper Vulture rush, or if you have good room to expand, Gilgamesh has great traits for Trebs + Xbows bulbing.

If you have zero strat resources, you still have Protective Archers + longbows. I <3 Sumeria with a heavy food / production start.

The only problem is deciding between BW or Writing or Oracle rush.