SGOTM 15 - One Short Straw

magnus?

Good luck, magnus. Looks good to me.
edit: big cross post. I have some more reading to do

LowtherCastle said:

magnus?

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Yes? Sorry been busy rl stuff.

I'll play the next 3 turns when I get home tonight.

Played until 1880BC

Having difficulty submitting file to site

Emailed save game to alanh


Barb to the north and barb to south.

Barb to the north just went sw. (Do we want to move our warrior to the forest and get 1 turn of fort before he is attacked or stay in cultural zone?

Lazy Japanese archer doesn't want to go south and take care of the barb archer

OH and Taoism was founded I believe turn 2000 bc

*****CAUTION******
ATTACHED SAVE IS REAL SAVE
*****CAUTION******

magnusmarcus said:

Barb to the north just went sw. (Do we want to move our warrior to the forest and get 1 turn of fort before he is attacked or stay in cultural zone?

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I would think that we would want to move the Warrior to the Forest, since it's a good choke point location. I'm just 100% certain that we want to move there now versus later.

It's a pretty good defensive square with the Forest, but it's not a guaranteed win.

Regardless, we will want to move somewhere... either to the north on the Grassland Forest River or else one of NE or E, so that if the Barb Warrior does make a move on us, we'll be in good defensive terrain.

The Barb Warrior himself will help to spawn-bust the far west piece of Coast in the meantime.


In favour of keeping the Barb Warrior alive is the thinking that he will be an easy kill to make later and he wanders to the north for a few turns, we can then pretty safely move into position on the Grassland Forest River that is 1N of our Warrior's current position. Meanwhile, he will be a free spawn-buster for us as long as he stays outside of our borders.

So, I'm not certain, but I definitely want to see that Warrior move somewhere onto a Forest, both to have better defensive terrain and to allow for the chance of a Forest to grow on the square that the Warrior is currently standing.

A Forest can't grow on a square where a unit sits but if no unit is on a square, then a Forest-eligible square (like a Grassland square) can have a Forest randomly grow on it if there is a horizontally or vertically adjacent Forest, as is the case with the square where the Warrior is currently standing.


@magnusmarcus: Is it possible for you to provide us with a test saved game that matches your moves made in the real saved game up to date? It would be greatly appreciated if you could!

Note that if you did not manually save the saved games each turn, you might want to first make a copy of your autosaves sub-directory under the "single" player saved games directory, so that we can have access to each turn's saved game, if required. Starting up the test game will erase the real game's autosaved games.

I have 4 end of turn saves available if needed

Upload them in a zip file. I'm sure LC will want to see them.

Do we know roughly where the Barb Archer in the south is located? It would suck if, while we were hiding out, that Barb Archer wandered to a location that allowed a second Barb unit to spawn down there.

If we know at least roughly where the Barb Archer is located, we can consider popping out of our Cultural Borders to help spawn-bust temporarily.

By the way, good turnset so far, magnusmarcus! Things are looking good!


I tried loading the latest real saved game, only to find out that it appears to be an autosave from the start of the turn... because I was asked which tech I wanted to research and which build item to build in Delhi, which are questions that you only get asked when loading an automatically saved game.

Fortunately, those decisions are reversible, so we're okay. However, there is a danger in using an autosaved game to pass around to the rest of the team, since, if an AI comes to you asking a question, you will be asked that question a second time as part of an autosaved game, and answering the same question from an AI twice would be treated as reloading. So, it is preferable if we can make sure that we are sharing manually-created saved games, which won't ask the same "start of turn" questions when the saved game gets loaded.


So, where are we at in terms of the big decisions to make? Besides figuring out how to best deal with the Barbs, are we mostly just debating which Worker actions + amount of whipping to use, or are there other decisions that still need to be decided upon?

Dhoomstriker said:

I tried loading the latest real saved game, only to find out that it appears to be an autosave from the start of the turn... because I was asked which tech I wanted to research and which build item to build in Delhi, which are questions that you only get asked when loading an automatically saved game.

Click to expand...

Then again, I noticed that magnusmarcus' screenshots have the icons on the right-hand side of the screen, so perhaps it is just a matter of us having different game settings... he probably has in-game pop-ups disabled. So, perhaps it's not an autosave after all, which would make me feel a whole lot more comfortable knowing whether or not it is a manually-saved game, just one where our settings cause me to get pop-ups at the start of the turn while he won't get them until the end of the turn.

Dhoomstriker said:

Then again, I noticed that magnusmarcus' screenshots have the icons on the right-hand side of the screen, so perhaps it is just a matter of us having different game settings... he probably has in-game pop-ups disabled. So, perhaps it's not an autosave after all, which would make me feel a whole lot more comfortable knowing whether or not it is a manually-saved game, just one where our settings cause me to get pop-ups at the start of the turn while he won't get them until the end of the turn.

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It is indeed a Manual save done at the very beginning of the turn. (I have automatic unit cycling off)

Dhoomstriker said:

@magnusmarcus: Is it possible for you to provide us with a test saved game that matches your moves made in the real saved game up to date? It would be greatly appreciated if you could!

Click to expand...

I have never used the worldbuilder so I'm not quite sure how to create an accurate test.

Dhoomstriker said:

Do we know roughly where the Barb Archer in the south is located? It would suck if, while we were hiding out, that Barb Archer wandered to a location that allowed a second Barb unit to spawn down there.

If we know at least roughly where the Barb Archer is located, we can consider popping out of our Cultural Borders to help spawn-bust temporarily.

Click to expand...

I literally eagle eyed that area during while clicking end of turn after verifying I had show enemy moves on. (I've had to change alot of the game settings I normally don't mess with to make sure nothing happens automatically without me seeing it).
I didnt see a thing in that area after initial contact.

Mitchum said:

Upload them in a zip file. I'm sure LC will want to see them.

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They are saved on my desktop on my gaming pc. (which is in a room currently occupied by house guests who have kinda overstayed there welcome) I know. TMI.

I'll get them uploaded this afternoon after work.

Dhoomstriker said:

Ctrl + x will toggle them from being visible to invisible and from invisible to visible.

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Thank you for this. IT WAS DRIVING ME CRAZY!

I know OCD

magnusmarcus said:

I have 4 end of turn saves available if needed

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Magnus, we need to know how many cities exist worldwide, because when there are 30 cities, all barbs will leming themselves toward the nearest city. To determine the number of worldwide cities, I compare the population statistics from one turn to the next. I don't know how to do it without one save from each turn, so I need for you to upload those saves to this thread. YOu can either put all of them in a zip file or upload them one by one.

xpost

As requested

Dhoomstriker said:

By the way, good turnset so far, magnusmarcus! Things are looking good!


I tried loading the latest real saved game, only to find out that it appears to be an autosave from the start of the turn... because I was asked which tech I wanted to research and which build item to build in Delhi, which are questions that you only get asked when loading an automatically saved game.

Fortunately, those decisions are reversible, so we're okay. However, there is a danger in using an autosaved game to pass around to the rest of the team, since, if an AI comes to you asking a question, you will be asked that question a second time as part of an autosaved game, and answering the same question from an AI twice would be treated as reloading. So, it is preferable if we can make sure that we are sharing manually-created saved games, which won't ask the same "start of turn" questions when the saved game gets loaded.


So, where are we at in terms of the big decisions to make? Besides figuring out how to best deal with the Barbs, are we mostly just debating which Worker actions + amount of whipping to use, or are there other decisions that still need to be decided upon?

Click to expand...

It's not an autosave - magnus has popups suppressed until the end of the turn.
You don't, and get confronted with them immediately upon loading.

The question is, do barb warriors approach our cultural borders or not? If not, we can wait to move to teh forest to see if that barb goes NW toward the wheat. Otherwise, we should move to the forest this turn, I think, to prevent that barb warrior from grabbing that forest and pushing us backwards a few turns.

We're still at 24 cities worldwide by my calcs. Still no barb cities. Toku still doesn't have BW. Hammy now has Sailing, can but won't trade resources to us, and has clams and stone. For some odd reason, Osaka just stopped building something (granary?) at 33h and started something completely new at 3hpt, which means it's not a worker or settler.

Question:

Between moves... who moves first ai Toku or ai Barb?

If barb moves first we can move warrior w/ toku's archer as long as the archer moves sw.
If barb attacks it would be againts toku's archer and not our warrior. If either archer dies we can then clean up if necessary with the warrior. We can call this..

"Operation Shadow Step"

Now if toku moves first... then it is epic fail as our warrior gets his club handed to him.
in which case perhaps we can initiate...

"Operation Lode Stone"

Which would be to neglect techs not immediately necessary and save up gold to upgrade the warrior to an axe. Step out on to the marble and then hunt down and destroy said Barbarian.

We can also decide the best case scenario is...

"Operation Wishful Thinking"
Which is to do nothing and hope Toku does all our dirty work for us.


I believe to do nothing would invite a barbarian city to settle on our southern border and wreck all our hard work.