Loyal PC gamers finally kicked in teeth

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I noticed on other forums gamers complained about having to install DMC4 on PS3 HDD so most console gamers like everything to be very simple.
This is probably why there were more hardcore games on the PS than on PS2 and now the Wii is out selling both the ps3 and 360 combined. (Even many years ago (back in C-64) I found most console games were more simplifed including hardcore games like Silent Service.) I find that even some recent PC games seem to be dumb down a bit lately.

P.S. Both Civ1 and Civ2 were ported straight to consoles yet they didn't sale very well. Starcraft was also on the consoles (N64) yet never sold anywhere close to the PC version.

um..the reason they were complaining is because 360 owners didn't have to do that, and because they are stuck with 20-80GB harddrives, so having a Blu-Ray install itself on your harddrive takes up a large chunk of your available space
Civ2 and Starcraft on consoles were crap. Civ1 was good, but it was a very low key series at the time, with a very low key release...I didn't even know that Civ1 was a PC game originally until a couple years after I'd bought Civ2 for PC.

I have a PS2 myself. I find that console games are stupid, dumbdowned license games from hell and that only a few games are worth mentioning. Also, PC games are much cheaper. I noticed your troll, BTW.

It can't. Console games are for people who want action and sit in the couch. PC games are for serious gamers.

Show me a console game that can be fully modded, BTW.

I wasn't trolling any more than anyone else on this thread that states consoles are for lamers/non-gamers/etc...seriously, the fact that last year's console gaming industry produced over 17 billion dollars of sales in the US alone says that the problem is not with consoles, but with anyone who bashes them the way you and others have

As for the number of games worth mentioning...if you hadn't noticed, both consoles and PCs have about the same ration of trash:goodness in games...price of PC games? Last I saw, they normally cost $39.99-$49.99 new...consoles are $39.99-$59.99...not really a price difference.

Action vs Serious games: um...you do realize that the two genres that are considered the mainstay of computers are FPS and RTS...and the entire purpose of those types of games is action...yes?

As far as modding goes, it really doesn't matter if you can or not, because until this generation, systems didn't have on-board storage space(XBOX notwithstanding...) so moddable games were impractical. If you want an example of one that will be out this year, try LittleBigPlanet...the entire game is simply a massive mod.

You've obviously never played an RTS or an FPS.

I'd say you've never played one if you really think there's no action in Warcraft, Starcraft, Call of Duty, Battlefield, Quake Wars, Unreal Tournament, Half Life, Command and Conquer, etc...

I hope you are not referring to Oblivion since it was clearly dumb down for console gamers. (Xbox 360) This rpg was very shallow especially since a 2 level character could do and go pretty much everything a 20 level character could. (the world leveled up with the character so why bother leveling up?) Thankfully there are mods for the PC which did give the game a little depth.

Developers of Vagrant Story learn a long time ago on the PS you can't add too much depth to a RPG as one of the biggest complaint was it was too hard. VS wasn't hard at all if you spend a few minutes to understand that you need to use and level up more than one weapon during the game.

um...the very reason for that was that it was a wide open world...you could do what you wanted, when you wanted. It makes a lot more sense gameplay-wise to make the game not dependent upon you grinding to level up, and more dependent on your skill choices, personal skill, and combat abilities(the world levels up with you in Final Fantasy VIII too, did that game have no depth or reason to leveling up?). Besides, leveling up does still have a point...if you do not level up your skills, you will never be able to win the game, no matter your skill at playing, because you'll be missing out on any advanced in-game abilities, and just because you are level 3 and the rest of the game is always the same number of levels above/below you, does not mean it is just as easy as if you are level 20...1 level difference at level 3 is a much greater difference than 1 level difference at level 20.

How does depth=hard in an RPG? Vagrant Story was a great game, and the developers of it have continued to make great, deep RPGs for consoles.
 
This is crazy how you guys all get into this discussion.

I'll just add my two cents.

PC's are becoming consoles and consoles are becoming PC's.

I've been a die hard PC gamer for a decade now and have finally made the switch to a next gen console. I'm not saying which. But I made the move because looking at bang for the buck, the consoles now meet my financial, gaming, and lack of time.... needs.

A maxed out PC is the best gaming platform handsdown. But for the time and work(keeping latest OS, drivers, hardware, etc) and $$$ to make that happen, it just isn't worth it to a lot of people. And there are just a whole lot of Positive facts for both PC and console argument but down the road, there are just going to be more Positives to go for the consoles and the industry knows this.

Now, back to the trolls.
 
Hey I remember Vagrant Story :) Although I played it on an emulator about a year ago. I think that perhaps it was too deep for the typical console player back THEN in the late 90s but things have changed. I know for sure that if I had had a PS instead of a N64 at that time I would have bought Vagrant Story because it was really nice although it suffered from a couple of gameplay issues.

No, you shouldn't be afraid of adding too much depth into console games today because the standard is already higher. With big screen TVs we will also see that more people will accept a bit more deeper menu systems and so on because you have more room for it.
 
...No, you shouldn't be afraid of adding too much depth into console games today because the standard is already higher. With big screen TVs we will also see that more people will accept a bit more deeper menu systems and so on because you have more room for it.
The opposite is what often happens which is why so many Morrowind fans were so disappointed with Oblivion. I haven't seen console games increase in depth since the PS days. Even many FPS they seem a little more shallow and more easy. There are a few exception but not many.
PC WOW has been a huge hit because it's casual approach and just when I thought MMORPG couldn't get more shallow.
With the cost of console games ever increasing developers have to appeal even more to people than those during PS,N-64 days. Yet I wish what you said was really true since I would love a sequel to VS with even more depth.
 
The opposite is what often happens which is why so many Morrowind fans were so disappointed with Oblivion. I haven't seen console games increase in depth since the PS days. Even many FPS they seem a little more shallow and more easy. There are a few exception but not many.
PC WOW has been a huge hit because it's casual approach and just when I thought MMORPG couldn't get more shallow.
With the cost of console games ever increasing developers have to appeal even more to people than those during PS,N-64 days. Yet I wish what you said was really true since I would love a sequel to VS with even more depth.

Another problem is that there is so much work involved in making 3D graphics today that people can't really focus making a great story and revolutionary gameplay.
 
um...the very reason for that was that it was a wide open world...you could do what you wanted, when you wanted. It makes a lot more sense gameplay-wise to make the game not dependent upon you grinding to level up, and more dependent on your skill choices, personal skill, and combat abilities(the world levels up with you in Final Fantasy VIII too, did that game have no depth or reason to leveling up?). Besides, leveling up does still have a point...if you do not level up your skills, you will never be able to win the game, no matter your skill at playing, because you'll be missing out on any advanced in-game abilities, and just because you are level 3 and the rest of the game is always the same number of levels above/below you, does not mean it is just as easy as if you are level 20...1 level difference at level 3 is a much greater difference than 1 level difference at level 20.

How does depth=hard in an RPG? Vagrant Story was a great game, and the developers of it have continued to make great, deep RPGs for consoles.
I never stated that VS was hard yet a lot of gamers hated the depth of it's combat system. VS was hard only if you didn't level up your weapons correctly. I wish it did have a hard difficulty level.
Also I hated FF8 for the same reason. I found a lot agree FF8 was one of the worst of the FF series including it's story. A RPG "not dependent" on leveling up is like a FPS that doesn't require you to aim a weapon.
Yes Oblivion had an open world yet when it comes to do your chores (quest) they were simply straight forward. No brains required, kind like washing dishes.

P.S By the way, the most depth I've seen in RPG was back in C-64 days. (which is a shame) Anyone here ever played "Knights of the Legend" by Origin (also the makers of Ultra series)? Man that game was deep. For example during battle if you character gets hit in the right arm you could no longer swing your sword with full force. Also the more hit overall you take (as well as swinging a two-handed sword like a mad man) the slower and weaker your character becomes until they could rest and heal up.
 
if you think that you must be one of the noob's always camping somewhere (strategy) until you get killed easily in a fair fight.
 
So bf1942 is more strategic and serious then other console fps' because it is on the PC?

Battlefield 2, when it comes down to it, is the same gameplay. And it's on consoles as well as pc.

So taking your above argument about bf1942 and applying it to BF2(same gameplay basically). Then BF2 is a strategic and serious fps on PC's. BUT it is also on the consoles.

Therefore, leading to the conclusion that there are serious and strategic gamers on the consoles. I am one of them.

You have been served.

The same can be applied to RPG type games. Example. KOTOR. People can get pretty serious about their KOTOR console version of the game which is pretty much identical to the PC version.

P.S this is coming from a main PC gamer who also has a PS2 and xbox360. And if you have never played Warcraft, Starcraft, Half Life series, Call of duty, Unreal, Command and Conquer. Not all of them are needed but at least if you have not played most of those. Then you really should stop discussing gaming. Because.... Swedishguy, you are not a gamer. Keep your discussion to what you know, Civilization.
 
yeah, Crysis become pretty mainstream and it only is computer
 
No, those games listed are mainstream garbage! I'm a member of PC Gamer, of course I'm a gamer!

The Civ games are pretty mainstream too. You better start hating them now because they're popular.


On Morrowind Vs Oblivion

Morrowind is a boring game with generic NPC's who when it comes down to it are just Wiki's tailored for that specific area and dull and tedious combat that amounts to clicking repeatedly and praying one of your attacks hits so you can chip off a tiny bit of their life bar.

Oblivion is the above only with generic landscapes instead of generic NPCs and attacks actually work most of the time.
 
ok, I don't know why you even decided to start going on whether Morrowind vs. Oblivion but WTH, these are master-crafted RPG's man........
 
Some other guy bought it up.
 
but still, they're not FPS or action, they're RPG's and focused on the story, which they do perfectly......
 
but still, they're not FPS or action, they're RPG's and focused on the story, which they do perfectly......

However the wastelands of morrowind were a bad choice simply because it was boring and in Oblivion it was boring as hell at the part where you had to run into the same type of dungeons all the time (the oblivion gates).
 
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