R.E.D. World War II development thread

Cool update

I'm assuming that unchecking alternative history, means you cannot declare war out side of the set defines table for diplomacy? If that is the case then I like it the way you have it, it would be nice however to have the defualt option on false for the alternative history.


On Second note I also played the Stalingrad map as Germany, everything worked great but it was really easy, I'm guessing this is the vannila military AI issue. And should there be more starting air units?

T_KCommanderbly said:

Cool update

I'm assuming that unchecking alternative history, means you cannot declare war out side of the set defines table for diplomacy?

Click to expand...

exactly

T_KCommanderbly said:

If that is the case then I like it the way you have it, it would be nice however to have the defualt option on false for the alternative history.

Click to expand...

It should be unchecked the first time you load the mod. After the user preference are saved, try to delete your civ5 cache folder, if it's checked by default, I should change it, yes.

Or do you mean that the option should be "Real History" and checking it will make sure you can't declare war outside the diplomacy tables ?

T_KCommanderbly said:

On Second note I also played the Stalingrad map as Germany, everything worked great but it was really easy, I'm guessing this is the vannila military AI issue. And should there be more starting air units?

Click to expand...

Yep it's almost empty, but I wanted it in that release anyway, for early feedback, or for humans in hotseat.

Working on the reinforcement spawning and score/victory right now

Score will be simply the number of turns you've owned Stalingrad (no need to be consecutively), at the end of the game (maybe 29 turns) the player with the higher score wins.

I've edited the first post ("How To" sections) to reflect the "simplification" when adding a new scenario since the last update.

Next version will enforce the option that are pre-set in the setup lua files instead of using the saved value.

For example T_KCommanderbly, I've set "Alternate History" to be always disable by default in the setup screen of your scenario, still leaving the player the choice to check it. Same for the embark options.

@ Gedemon

Hi, have you ever considered creating a World War One or Great War mod? With GnK coming out I am seriously considering it, except the fact that I have a lot to learn about modding CiV. I will learn and I have some good ideas. Let me know what you think. nokmirt

Oh and I love you R.E.D. mod I wish I started playing that long long ago. I suppose you'll be make an update with GnK, correct? I can't wait.

Thanks !

Yes, I've considered a WWI scenario, but only considered, nothing serious planned (same goes for a Napoleon Era scenario, or a Secession War scenario, etc...)

What I hope is to be able to brake the unit's limit barrier, then I could have a base wargame mod (this one) for multiple eras and scenario.

All this is very time-consuming, but R.E.D Modpack will be updated for G&K, as YnAEMP, only "when ?" is something I can't answer (not too long after release I hope)

edit : for a WWI scenario, one of the challenge will be to simulate trench warfare, but I think that this mod code could handle it, allow units to resist more before retreating and add code to create fortification under units that are fortified for say, 2 or 3 turns.

now, will a trench war be fun to play ?

Gedemon said:

All this is very time-consuming, but R.E.D Modpack will be updated for G&K, as YnAEMP, only "when ?" is something I can't answer (not too long after release I hope)

edit : for a WWI scenario, one of the challenge will be to simulate trench warfare, but I think that this mod code could handle it, allow units to resist more before retreating and add code to create fortification under units that are fortified for say, 2 or 3 turns.

now, will a trench war be fun to play ?

Click to expand...

I figured you'd be updating your mod an YnAEMP, can't wait for them.

Trench warfare is always the problem. I was hoping there was going to be some scenarios made for Blood & Iron, so we could see how snafusmith dealt with the problem of trenches. From what I understand he had special linking trench improvements made up, which could be built. This sounded all very interesting.

I suppose if you had the war bogged down on certain fronts it might be fun if there were other things to keep you occupied. Which there would be anyway,things like naval warfare, sub warfare, air warfare, and espionage. In other words, something else to think about other than just slugging it out in the trenches.

You should also be able to take a chance on trying to attack the enemy from behind his own trenches, with amphib operations, and using diplomacy to gather up allies. Sending airships and aircraft to bomb naval units and cities. Trying to gain important technology before your enemies do.

If your France or England your priority would be to get America involved in the war. In the meantime, Germany is trying to retire Russia from the war so they can bring troops over to bolster the Western front and overwhelm the British and French, before they can get help from the US. Maybe you could put in several victory locations, with rewards of some sort for capturing them. If you capture enough of these you then could break the deadlock in order to be able to continue more mobile warfare. Which is really what they were trying to do. The fun would be trying to change history I think.

When I think about it, trench warfare might not be that hard to replicate if you break it down to game rules/parameters.

Graphics aside, trench warfare would just be the fortification ability of units. By using the promotions system, you could give all units a base trench ability which strengthens their fortify mode. You could then have storm-troopers with a promo ability that counters the trench ability and so on.

If the map is more tactical (i.e. 1km per hex) then the terrain system and features could be used assuming we have ability to add new terrain types in G&K (which I doubt!).

ww2commander said:

When I think about it, trench warfare might not be that hard to replicate if you break it down to game rules/parameters.

Graphics aside, trench warfare would just be the fortification ability of units. By using the promotions system, you could give all units a base trench ability which strengthens their fortify mode. You could then have storm-troopers with a promo ability that counters the trench ability and so on.

If the map is more tactical (i.e. 1km per hex) then the terrain system and features could be used assuming we have ability to add new terrain types in G&K (which I doubt!).

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Certainly, it does not have to be too complicated a standard trench fortification promo for infantry and MGs (if MGs need this?) would be fine, landships (tanks), and stormtroopers could be counter trench units. Then the early tanks would be susceptible to artillery fire. Artillery should also be able to gain a creeping barrage promo with experience.

For finland, I know that someone made a Finnish civ, with a picture of mannerhiem and a Jager unit graphic. You guys may want to talk to him.

I would love to help develop but I'm not sure I can!
I'll send you a PM of what I hope to acheive.

my PM box is almost full, don't use it unless it's really private please.

Sure thing!
So, I was thinking:

I hope I can help!

Thanks for the suggestions

• Machineguns may be part of a fortification units (for Maginot, Siegfried, Metaxas lines, or Atlantic Wall), but I'll need someone to convert the units from Civ4 first.
  
• Leader Traits are still W.I.P., for Greece it will surely be some kind of defensive bonus, yes.
  
• I don't want squadron to be destroyed from air attacks.
  
• I've got comments asking to nerf artillery, who to believe ?
  
• I've tried to make artillery an independent component of any other land unit, but failed. this will require the DLL source code.
  
• Homeguard, that's possible, an unit without embarking capability only buildable in U.K. in limited numbers.
  
• I prefer infantry to be standardized for all civs. Now small adjustements/ specific promotions may be added.
  
• Paratroopers are planned. Now that's something I could use help on, but with the change from pre-G&K patch, I'll need to rewrite the "how to" for new units in first page...
  
• Design from other civs for Greece or France is possible, but I'll need new skins for those units.

On a general note, until I've found a way to fix the 256 unit types problem when using WB maps, adding new units in the mod is frozen.

As for Finland, the techtree for planes would go like this,
Fighters:
Fokker D.XXI, BF-109E, BF-109F, BF-109G
Also, the B-239 (variant of American Brewster Buffalo, abit stronger,) and Italian G-50 were also used.
Fast Bombers:
Bristol Blendheim, Ju-88
Dive Bombers:
Fokker CX?
Hope this helps!

A nominal eastern seaboard in 1939-1945 that starts out friendly to to the Allies and in december 1941 is annexed by britian would help greatly.


Improving the AI so that it 'used its force in mass' in a somewhat unpredictable manner would be good too, although i realize how hard to approaching impossible this would be. The tendency for the AI to just send single navel units against your cities is confounding

It would be cool Gedemon (I don't know if it's possible) if when promoting a unit (or maybe just upon construction) we could choose between adding a Anti-Tank Brigade or Anti-Aircraft Brigade (just as an example), which would both make the unit stronger accordingly but also add actual Anti-Tank Guns/Anti-Aircraft Guns to the group.

Do you plan on standardizing paratroopers too?

T_KCommanderbly said:

It would be cool Gedemon (I don't know if it's possible) if when promoting a unit (or maybe just upon construction) we could choose between adding a Anti-Tank Brigade or Anti-Aircraft Brigade (just as an example), which would both make the unit stronger accordingly but also add actual Anti-Tank Guns/Anti-Aircraft Guns to the group.

Do you plan on standardizing paratroopers too?

Click to expand...

Yes, you know I was not very happy with Artillery regiment being independent unit on the map, and my first tries to make them a part of other units had failed.

There is always the possibility to create different graphic representation (Base Infantry, Infantry+Anti-Tank, Infantry+Anti-Air, etc...) but that would multiply the number of units to define. then I could switch the infantry representation to ethnic graphics as I've done for R.E.D. Modpack to reduce unique units definition, but this would means that each infantry would have the exact same statistics (well it's already the case, but we may want to tweak infantry values per nation in the future)

And I can't use that approach for Tanks as we want unique names here.

So what I want to test is allowing one "specialized" regiment to be attached to any land division, a civilian units (to respect the 1UT mechanism) representing a regiment/brigade of Artillery, Anti-Air, Engineer, etc... or why not a Mobile HQ which would allow nearby units to get reinforcement even when cut from friendly cities...

Edit: And we will have more paratroopers, yes.

Ya that specialized regiment idea sounds better

The civilian-specialization is an elegent solution, but the AI would not utilize it to its fullest advantage, effectively only giving human players added depth to their game.




Is multiplayer mods in the offing?

@Gedemon:

Can you us a clue about how in detail the "upgrading" of units ingame works? For example, when finishing a new design on tanks the older versions in some cases will upgrade, and sometimes not. It costs material, but i am not sure how much material need is to expect. Also some models will never be upgraded. But i can't get why?

I don't know if it's a bug, or just working as intended: i played nazis, diety, worldmap '42, alternate history. Berlin is aircraft-specialized City. I finished Tiger-Tank design there, but in no city i can build Tigertanks. I can place the models on the map via worldbuilder and start game and see them (first intention was that they aren't in the mod yet). But what came into my mind is: when i built the project, the normal perspective shows that it needs 1 round to be finished, but game forces me to choose another production. Is this the normal behavior? Are heavy tanks not completely implemented yet?