Whrn you think you've got a great starting location....but you haven't

So I always play random civ, random map. I like the variety, and the challenge of succeeding in different circumstances. Emperor level.

Last game, I rolled Attilla, and got what seemed like a fantastic start. In my initial six ring I got fish, wheat, marble, sheep, stone and salt. The first time I've ever had a resource in every starting tile. In the ring outside that I had another stone and another salt. Cows on the outer ring. My settler was stood on a coastal grassland hill, surrounded by forests and grassland.

Wow, I'm thinking, this is the best start ever. All I was missing was a river and a mountain.

Then I set to exploring. By the time I'd finished my 2nd scout I'd come to realise that I was all alone on an island big enough for maybe 3 cities, with barely a resource to be found away from my capital. Not so much as a city state for me to conquer. No horses either (not that Attilla needs them for HA's at the start, but no +1 hammers from pasture either).

Now, I could still play turtle and try and win that way, but that's not why I play random civs, especially when my last game was a Babylon archipelaego turtle victory

*waves angry fist at the RNG. He giveth with one hand, and he taketh away with the other*

That's a hilarious start for Attila. It is like torment to roll Attila and have an isolated start.

that sounds unbearable and reminiscent of many starts i had on vanilla maps. good capital location, horrendous surrounding land

Then just do one city to challenge yourself

ahahahaha!

Well embarking isn't too far off, sure, you definitely will lose a bit of edge but you should be able to locate a CS or AI near enough to assault by sea in the classical.

I am always surprised to see so many players saying they abandoned vanilla maps so long ago. Are they really that bad? I still use vanilla starts and operate with a no rerolling rule. I've never had a start that was so awful I couldn't win given the AI didn't use the opportunity to wipe me out in an early rush (which has happened a few times). But I really like challenging starts because the game is far too easy with a good start, even on Deity. It's like playing immortal again. If so many top-tier players use custom map scripts I guess that explains why I don't see them get as bad dirt as I regularly do in their videos. I WAS wondering about that haha. I'm ecstatic to get 2 luxes and a couple growth tiles given my past luck.

I was under the impression that most top players play strong maps like GP/GPP, lakes, highlands, sandstorm without need for a custom map script.

Iamteehee said:

I was under the impression that most top players play strong maps like GP/GPP, lakes, highlands, sandstorm without need for a custom map script.

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They also re-roll until they get the start they want. I believe mountains are a must.

Mount Suribachi said:

They also re-roll until they get the start they want.

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If you are talking about HOF runs -- yes of course. But in general, I am confident the “top players” are happy to roll with what they get. If one plays only starts that are (for example) coastal hills on a mountain with a river -- then one is spoiled for public game series like GOTM/DCL/CDG.

Well, for competitive time on HoF, you either have to have coastal and/or mountain starts. You also need some luck on getting WLTKD and getting the right CS.

I am tempted when I've finished my current Byzantium game (which it looks like I'm going to lose ) to go back to this and see what I can make of it.

I can't decide whether to turtle with my one city and see if I can win a peaceful victory, or go for the maritime techs and see if I can still wipe out a couple of civs and take it from there.

If I'd had this start with Venice.....oh man. Venice is still the easiest victory I've had yet, with this starting location for a 1 city civ I would be on for a PB I reckon.

I`m one of those weird guys who likes a completely random map (except for size) and live with whatever happens.

i`m even quite happy when I get a map which is barren with mostly ice everywhere. I just think, `oh well, let`s see if I can turn these lemons into lemonade?`

I`m no great player either.

Socratatus said:

I`m one of those weird guys who likes a completely random map (except for size) and live with whatever happens.

i`m even quite happy when I get a map which is barren with mostly ice everywhere. I just think, `oh well, let`s see if I can turn these lemons into lemonade?`

I`m no great player either.

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I respect your views, but I prefer a start I am happy with. My view is that a game (for me) takes so long why start with something that is going to drive you mad?

Convict said:

I respect your views, but I prefer a start I am happy with. My view is that a game (for me) takes so long why start with something that is going to drive you mad?

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I enjoy the challenge. You like many won`t get it, but I treat it like reality. You can`t choose where you`re born or as whom. You can`t choose where your nation starts and if you happen to be in a terrible position you make the best of it. Early settlers had to deal with bleak moors in Europe in ancient days. I look at it like that.

Socratatus said:

I enjoy the challenge. You like many won`t get it, but I treat it like reality. You can`t choose where you`re born or as whom. You can`t choose where your nation starts and if you happen to be in a terrible position you make the best of it. Early settlers had to deal with bleak moors in Europe in ancient days. I look at it like that.

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Generally speaking I agree with that. But I remember Civ4 especially was particularly good at sticking you on a landmass with none of the resources needed for your UU. I had a Roman game with no Iron for Praetorians, and Byzantine game with no horses for Kataphracts

Having England or Venice blocked in an Inland sea (or ice) when you're unaware of it is always one of the worst types of starts.