*Spoiler* Qsc18r2 - Barbarian Insanity Game progress

Sorry if my spreadsheet is one turn out. I'll correct it for GOTM19.

Here is what I did up till 1000BC. It's a bit boring I'm afraid.

1425BC. Trade Iroquois Mathematics for contact with Rome and 62G. How they don't have contact with Rome by now beats me.

1350BC. Found Georgovia.

1300BC. Found Lleocantores. Buy Philosophy from Iroquois for 92G. Must be my birthday.

1275BC. Aztechs demand 24G. I'm really tempted to refuse and allow a war, but I'm still a few turns from being ready. I give in.

1250BC. Get Map making from Rome for Poly + 22G. Then I trade maps with everyone selling my world map for territory map + gold.
Generally this is probably not a good idea, but I wanted to impress everyone with how much of the world I know at 1000BC.
Why doesn't this make up part of the QSC score?

1125BC. Found Brempovia. Trade code of laws with the good ol' Iroquois for WM and 138G.

1100BC. Found Syrplebonum near (roman) horses. Unfortunately 1 turn too late. So I start a temple. Those horses will know on which side their bread is buttered.

1075BC. Found Augustodurum.


This could go on for ever. Build settler, found city build worker etc. I have to make something happen soon. I have 11 cities with two settlers in transit. This is probably a bit better than I expected to do. I have 12 warriors which I will upgrade to UU. I needed a baracks for that, so I built one. I took a peek at the Barb peninsula too a few turns after the timeline ends. The volcanos were gone and the fog had a path through it. The french, carthags, iroqouis and Aztech all had units in there, and I watched them all die horribly. This is a lot earlier than in my proper GOTM. Now I just want to find a way of playing the pied piper and leading them to Gay Paris. (Silent S).

As I said earlier, I'll play the last couple of turns and post about the next 10 turns tonight.



:Here is my savegame

I lost track of worker numbers a couple of turns from the end, but this timeline is still reasonable
 
This will be a nice comparison to my 1000BC save in the normal QSC Celt game:

61.1475BC-Finish researching polyteism, start researching monarchy at 10%sci/0%lux, Entremont produce spearman, order settler(5-3-5). Spearman sent to gems. WG1 complete road to gems, move to tile S of Entremont. Found Richborough SW - SW - S of Entremont, order temple - citizen on BG. Warrior in Camu sent to Richborough. Wa1 NW.
62.1450BC-Alesia finish barracks, order settler(4-2-4) - Alesia grows, 3. citizen on forest. Fortify spear on gems. Wa1 W.
63.1425BC-Found Verulamium 4 tiles SE of Richborough, order worker there - citizen on fish. WG1 start mine S of Entremont. Wa1 W.
64.1400BC-Camu finish warrior, order new - send warrior to Verulamium. Trade map making from greece for poly. Trade code of law from Iroquois for poly. Trade map from most civs for mapmaking, have a rather complete uncowered world map now.
65.1375BC-Entremont finish settler, order warrior - send settler to plains 8 tiles SW of Richmound where there is dye&iron close to greece capitol. WG1 finish mine, start and finish road S of Entremont. Whip granary at Lugd. Warrior fortify in Richborough. Trade maps from Iroquios and Greece for our maps. Send warrior from Alesia to Entremont, warrior from Entremont to Richborough. Minimap screen taken. Entremont on fish+2MBG. Alesia on IC+2MBG. Camu on 2MBG.
66.1350BC-Lugd finish granary, order settler. Warrior headed for Entremont rerouted to Verul. Wa1 set to automove to Camu. Regular warrior from Richb escort settler headed for dye. WG1 go W.
67.1325BC-Alesia finish settler, order warrior - send settler to grass 3 tiles N of Alesia. Entremont finish warrior, order new - warrior fortify in Entremont. Camu finish warrior, order new - send him to grass 3 tiles N of Alesia. WG1 start mine N of Richb.
68.1300BC-*(not a single action - check for slaves and trades as I do every round - Iroquois have Philosophy).
69.1275BC-Entremont finish warrior, order settler - send warrior to Alesia. WG1 finish mine N of Richb, start and finish road.
70.1250BC-Gergovia founded 3 tiles N of Alesia - order temple there. Camu finish warrior, order new - send warrior to Alesia. Alesia finish warrior, order new - send warrior to Verulamium. Both warriors sent to Verulamium has arrived there. WG1 S - W.
71.1225BC-I'm doing too many citizens move now to monitor, emphasize is on timing growth with settler production and maximizing citizens on worked tiles. Change prod at Alesium from warrior to settler(4-2-4). WG1 start mine W of Richb.
72.1200BC-Entremont finish settler, order warrior - send settler to hills 7 tiles SW of Entremont. Lugd finish settler, order new - send settler to grass 3 tiles SW of Alesia. Camu finish warrior order settler(4-2-4) - send warrior to grass 3 tiles SW of Alesia. Richb finish temple, order barracks. Verul finish worker order new, worker move to grass 2 tiles SW of Alesia. WG1 finish mine W of Rushb, finish road.
73.1175BC-Warrior from Rich escort settler headin SW. WG1 W.
74.1150BC-WG1 start and finish road 2 tiles W of Richb, move W.
75.1125BC-Lleorycantores founded 3 tiles SE of Alesia, order temple. Brempovia founded next to dye and iron 8 tiles SW of Richb, order temple. Alesia finish settler, order warrior - move settler to grass 4 tiles SE of Entremont.
76.1100BC-Settler arrival in SW delayed one turn as a roman warrior occupies the tile we want to build our city on. We're being overtaken in science - but hopefully we'll research monarchy first so that we can trade to tech parity. WG1 SW.
77.1075BC-Wa1 finally return to Camu from his great journey in the west, he garrison there. Worker start road SE-SE-E of entremont. WG1 start and finish road NE of future city in the SW of Richb.
78.1050BC-SyrPlebonium founded on hill W-W-S-S of Richb - order temple. WG1 SW - S. Alesia produce warrior, order new. Richb produce barracks, order warrior.
79.1025BC-Augustodorum founded 4 tiles SE of Entremont. WG1 start and finish road S of Syrplebonium.
80.1000BC-Entremont finish settler, order warriror - send settler to grass 5 tiles NW of Richb. Camu finish settler, order warrior - send settler to grass 5 tiles NW of Entr. Lugd finish settler, order new settler - send settler to forest 3 tiles SE of Lleorycantores. Worker finish road N of Augusteodorum, move N.WG1 SW. Send warriors from Entr and Camu to NW settler pairs destinations. Send warrior from Alesia to escort eastbound settler.



Treasury is 734G and I'm making 14GTP. And I have 4 slaves.

Compared to my GOTMQSC I had 9 cities, 1 settler, 4 workers, 4 slaves and 15 warriors. 615 gold in the bin and 11GPT.

So slightly better in my second run, but not much.
 
Hey all,

Well - we can post further now!

Turn 120: I have 15 cities, IW and am building the Gallic Warrior army.



At this point in time I had 47 out of 60 "free" units.



The powergraph rates me 7th from 11.




I can say that the future war against rome was a success, the gallic warrior army got up to size 40 or so at best, and that nearing 1000 and I have 30 cities(3 more than Egypt) in a tight build config (imho), am rated 4rd on score, and am beginning to look at eating into the IRO, to form a cruching attack on greece from 3 sides. Having 30 cities, I expect to churn out the units fast enough to try a blitz. I am a few tech behind, and am not certain if I'll wait too long to go after IRO ( a failing I have, I suspect). Still given that I haven't achieved too many wins on Monarch difficulty, I'm happy to try this plan, and see.

Really looking forward ot the review of the play to 1000 bc, and turn 90 and 120. i hope to learn lots from the better players - I can only regularly win at regent, (apart from one ridiculously good run in gotm 16, where I ended 2nd on powergraph - space race loss, but oh so close!) so I'm KEEN to get feedback from everyone here.
 
Wanderer: It's a little late for me to look hard at your timeline now, It's past midnight here. I'll have a look at work tomorrow when I have more time ;). However, any comments I make come with a public health warning.

I see you've added some columns to the spreadsheet - Nice!
Personally I can't wait for an automatic logger. Filling in the sheet is a Royal pain in the bum. :)
 
Originally posted by mad-bax
Wanderer: It's a little late for me to look hard at your timeline now, It's past midnight here. I'll have a look at work tomorrow when I have more time ;). However, any comments I make come with a public health warning.

I see you've added some columns to the spreadsheet - Nice!
Personally I can't wait for an automatic logger. Filling in the sheet is a Royal pain in the bum. :)

Would LOVE an automatic logger!! As to late - I'm guessing your in the UK ? I'm in Cape Town, south africa - it's 1:45 AM here, and I'm just crawling along at the end of a 56 K modem!!!

sigh

here is my save game:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads4/120_turns-_170_bc.zip
 
I did it again, I managed to foul up the number of rounds and made my save in 150BC.... But my timeline is intact, so it should show just about where I was one turn earlier.

Noteable achievments in my game:

Great leader + pyramids + third lux resource when I captured Carthage in 190BC. 170BC I rushed FP NE of my capitol

The barbs where a bit slow getting down to my fortified towns in the chokes in the north, but this screen shows the situation immediately after 150BC.


Here is a zip of my complete timeline in XLS format and turn 121 save @ 150BC, I used PTW1.14f: BarbBrennusSingu150BC

Here is a copy from my final notes in my timeline:
I have 25 GS, 2 spears and 1 galley. I have 1 settler, 22 workers and 8 slaves. 26 cities with 86 citizens and a territory of 303 tiles. I have 3 luxuries and 141G in the treasury with a GPT of 163. I have 2 turns to feudalism is researched and have 404 shields in the bin. I have no middleage techs, and lack republic in ancient age(this is my problem, I stop visiting the trade screens as I play for a while - and suddenly everybody has traded well past my advantage after polyteism). All in all I'm happy with this opening, it's not particulary stronger than my GOTM opening on this map, but I feel I can finish this game quicker since I waited a bit longer with my GA and has a more powerful build around my core cities. Things I regret is as usual too few workers, it's really hard to keep expanding and supplying enough workers to make the new cities productive as soon as possible...

Just take away two cities and 100 shields or so, and you have my situation in 170BC.

Here is a zoomin of my NE borders in 190BC as the GS barbs started flowing down the choked land. I don't know how successfull my solution to the barb problem is as I havent played past 150BC, but reinforcements where streaming towards my two towns, and I will have pikes in two turns. I put a galley out to observe the barb movement patterns, and it seemed like they where hesitant to approach my towns. Some of them where retreating, while others came downwards.
 
All I did in the following 10 turns was switch from settlers, workers and warriors to spears, UUs and barracks.

I decided in the end that I am going to pick a fight, probably against Greece and Rome simultaneously just to see what will happen. I just need to upgrade my warriors. I have just traded monarchy with Rome, so they will be in anarchy as I start my GA. The Greeks I'll worry about when I test their strength. I don't think I'm really ready for a war, but I want to see if I really need as many units as I usually build or not. The road to Gems will be finished in 2 so I can let the cities get a bit bigger and leave them lightly defended probably with a couple of quick GS's dotted around the place to intercept counter attacks. I expect to get murdered. :)







My saved game is here.
 
cracker- Thanks, I get it now. BTW this was a bit delayed I was out of town this weekend.

Here is the first segment.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads4/Smirk_QSC18R2_1525BC.zip



Here is the continuation of my exact timeline, which I ended at 1000BC.



1500 BC
Fort Entremont (2) finished settler now buiding archer
settler heads north east
worker to follow
1450 BC
Fort Lugdunum (1) finished settler now buiding archer
settler heads north
1425 BC
Fort Alesia (2) finished settler now buiding archer
1400 BC
Fort Entremont (3) finished archer now building settler
archer heads south
founded Fort Richborough building barracks
worker to irrigate cow
1375 BC
contacted by Joan and Toku
1350 BC
founded Fort Verulamium building worker
founded Fort Gergovia building worker
1300 BC
Fort Camulodunum (3) finished archer now buiding settler
1275 BC
Fort Entremont (2) finished settler now building archer
settler moves south
1250 BC
archer kills Carthage archer now 5/5
Hannibal gives me Mysticism and Masonry for peace
Fort Alesia (3) finished archer now building settler
Fort Alesia archer kills Greek warrior now 3/5, declaring war, they were in my territory
1225 BC
Fort Alesia archer kills Greek warrior that attacked now 2/5
archer kills Greek hoplite at Corinth now 2/5
archer dies attacking Greek hoplite, GA for Greece
figured only one hoplite, but there were at least two
1200 BC
Corinth is size 3 so I am going to try and take it intact so settler will walk around and settle iron
archer moves north to rest
archer fortifies
settler south and archer north to defend settler
Fort Lugdunum (2) finished archer now building archer
archer heads south to help take Corinth
two elite archers heads south to help take Corinth
1175 BC
Fort Entremont finished archer now building archer
Corinth (2) Alex rushed another hoplite, two there now, going to wait for more archers
1150 BC
Fort Richborough finished barracks now building settler
1125 BC
Corinth (1) looks like he rushed again, will wait another turn have 3 elites in transit so will get a leader with luck
with 4 archers I would normally attack, but I have a settler here waiting and don't want to lose it
1100 BC
archer 4/4 attacked by Greek archer now 2/5, must have rushed that archer
Fort Gergovia (1) finished worker now building worker
Fort Entremont finished archer now building settler
archer to defend Fort Verulamium
Fort Verulamium (1) finished worker now building worker
archer kills hoplite now 2/5
archer attacks and die last hoplite now 2/3
archer kills hoplite now 4/5, Corinth destroyed
Alex gives me Alphabet, Wheel, Polythesim and 25g for peace, he was also willing to give me Sparta instead of the techs but I didn't have any location on it so passed. Now in hindsight I should have taken the city, Sparta is where I placed my FP in the last game. Since it was his second city I expected it to be still in forests.
1075 BC
Mao asks for something I refuse he declares war
1050 BC
founded Fort Leorycantores building worker
Fort Alesia (1) finished settler now building archer
settler heads west to get wheat
Fort Camulodunum (2) finished settler now building archer
settler heads west to get fish or iron
7.1.2 Monarchy (30)
1025 BC
Fort Entremont (4)
1000 BC
Fort Entremont (2) finished settler now building spearman
settler heads east


Despite the major problems and different approach this game is not far off of my original. In the original I had 11 cities and 1 settler, in this one I have 8-9 cities and 3 settlers. This is no doubt also because I built a little more spaced out this time so naturally the game will be delayed by a few turns here or there.
 
I stopped keeping an exact timeline at 1000BC I'm still doing it by hand and its really tediuos with a lot of units.


These were some general thoughts I wrote since 1000BC...

1000 BC
The faster tech pace made any warrior/swordman conquest difficult. That is at least without iron anywhere near the start. I am just settling near iron in a few turns. I decided to take a different approach and one that I usually do not. The extremely early granary seems to have a good effect although I have less cities than I did last game. I have more troops and workers though, and 3 settlers in transit. And archers, seem pretty worthless in general, final upgrade in next age, and the middle age upgrade requires 3 techs, the only plus is that none of them are deadends. Made more useless since two neighbors have effective pikeman with Bronze.
Interesting in that this map doesn't have any particular resource near the capital, horses included. It turns out that I don't even have any horses so archers are the only thing around for some time.

If I were able to take Corinth I would be in a better position, I just hope when it got razed that Alex got the discontent associated with his rushing, the bastard. I have a total of 4-5 elite archers and a leader would have really helped, but with hoplites and mercenarys making a wall to the west there isn't much chance there. I'm not in a good position to attack Caesar anytime soon, but will shortly. Unless a leader comes soon this game will turn out really poor, Japan has been building the Pyramids for some time and if he gets them, they will be out of reach for an extremely long time. Although at this point, the Library looks like a good choice instead since I am so far behind in tech.
I am in the middle on the score, out of the 8 civs that I currently have contact with. I'm missing England and Egypt.
The small area that I have uncovered on the map is humorous, my nearby territory, Greece and some of Rome and Carthage. I'll be doing some more exploring now that I have enough archers to defend my territory.
No luxuries as yet but I will have gems hooked up in the time it takes to road the mountain.

775 BC

During this portion my growth was slow and hence I couldn't really abuse the other civs at all. My tech is way behind. And a few civs have declared war on me (again or still), China among them. However, due to their distance I didn't actually see any of their units until ~550BC. Unless I am in danger I usually maintain wars until I have something to gain. Once I started to catch up around 700BC I started to regain equality with the other civs in maps, tech and contacts. I got most of the techs completely free by renogiating peace. The iroquois took an early lead in score and have held it and will hold it for some time, I am currently #3 in score below the japanese but with a larger per turn gain so will catch them shortly.

590 BC
barbarian uprising
sending a few units north to "activate" them if needed and to check it out

For the last few hundred years there have been no pressing wars and I have begun to build a defense force. The archer have been completely worthless, linked with my slow tech pace I won't be able to quickly upgrade them either. I have been researching monarcy at minimum and will get it in 8 turns. I will then consider speeding up research to get the longbows and then maybe do some conquest.
 
So it looks like Singularity is going for the "Keep the cork in the bottle" strategy of keeping the barbs corked up in the ghetto by building fortress cities at the choke points.

I also looks like the upraising dates are falling in the 600bc to 100bc range. Does anyone have a general summary of where in time the uprisings are falling for everyone and also what the genral approach to preparing for the uprisings may be??

Is anyone trying to set up conditions to harvest the barbs for massive numbers fo elite promotions??

Did anyone use shuttle galleys to bypass the snaky peninsula??

Did anyone found a city on the chokepoint and give it away to an enemy to use as a permanent barbarian cork, while you used your units to go an kill the enemy instead of defending the city??

What impact does lots of barbarian activity in specific locations have on the behavior of the Rival Civilizations in the game??

How can you get the most value out of barbarians even if they are stronger than you may want to deal with.

Do barbarians ever come from ships??

Do barbarians in PTW have more of a "purpose" or mission than in Civ3v1.29 or do you think they may have more of a random component??

How many people saw any early Pictish Warrior barbs at any locations on the map before the GallicSword Barbs began to appear?

GallicSword barbs may begin to appear in 1's and 2's before the Era uprising; did anyone see this and if so when??
 
Cracker: in order to *start* to answer your questions I'll post my next turns (90-120, uprising in turn 96, barb action from turn 111) (I'll answer your questions in more detail later):

725BC (91) - The hurt Roman warrior attacks our city and wins! Drat, and double drat.

710BC (92) - Another Roman warrior comes in our terr. warrior attacks and fails, Sword attacks and wins, phew! Alesia riots :(.

690BC (93) - Our troops destroy Pompeii, and will move to liberate our city.

670BC (94) - Eur. Sword kills Roman archer. Aztec have Republic, we are able to buy it thanks to our GA, but I decline, we don't need it.

650BC (95) - Our Horseman is Elite after killing another Roman archer.

630BC (96) - Gems are online! Word of a massive barbarian uprising spreads! We set things up to reclaim our iron city next turn.

610BC (97) - Our northern cities start walls. Our reg horse attacks gets two hitpoint down of the defending Roman warrior and retreats. Our elite horse attacks, is redlined but wins! (No GL, that would be to much to hope for, but then again you never know). One reg. Eur. sword moves in to defend our town. Vet sword attacks Roman archer and wins. Vet archer follows Roman settler pair. Our Iron is back online. The towns with Barracks switched from horsemen to swords. E. switched to Barracks.

590BC (98) - Everybody has Currency, Construction and Republic. We buy Currency from France for WM and 164. Construction will be researched on our own soon. Republic we don't need. Sell Currency to Egypt for 12 gold (all they have) and TM.

570BC (99) - Nobody wants to sell WM this game, apparantly the AI 'know' how much of the map you have revealed.

550BC (100) - Iroq. warrior softens up the Roman archer for us. Our vet sowrd kills it and is elite now! Establish embassy in Paris with Pyramids due in 30 turns.

530BC (101) - Catapult ready, will move North. E. completes spear, starts settler.

510BC (102) - Our troops move to flood Cumae, it is still very small (size 1) which is a pity, I would like to capture it rather than raze. Lugdunum completes sword, starts marketplace.

490BC (103) - Iroqs raze Pompeii, 5 turns to go in the alliance.

470BC (104) - Iroqs sign peace treaty! Rome will give up their WM and Pisae for peace. Hmm, I have to think about it. Hmm, ok.

450BC (105) - Construction is due in 5 turns on (9.1.0). Start pre-build for Great Wall (yes!), start Walls in Alesia. A settler pair is on its way to the spot where Pompeii was. Another settler will be ready in 2, the next in three turns. We finally see the action in the North. One Vulcano is still fuming. Walls are ordered in Cam. too.

430BC (106) - Switch builds to Swords all over the place.

410BC (107) - Our Golden Age is over. A settler is build in the North, it will move to the second source of Iron.

390BC (108) - The settler that moves up North gets some compony to protect it.

370BC (109) - More units are build ans are moving up North.

350BC (110) - Construction is researched, switch pre-build to Great Wall. Start Feudalism. Buy Monarchy from France for 333g straight. Burdigala is founded on the spot where Pompeii used to be. Settler to prime spot near the river next to the cows, but, hey, Jean tell your warrior to move over, he's in the way! We will have to wait a turn :(.

330BC (111) - Ok, we start to see some action up North. Cataractonium founded. It has a spear, a catapult and a sword defending it. Starts walls.

310BC (112) - Lapardum founded on the river/sea, next to the cows. Our vet horseman kills a barb, our reg sword the next. We will see the AI units marching through our lands trying to get to the barbs. I need to uncork the other vulcano. The Iroqs are starting to get behind. They lack monarchy but will resarch it soon they only offer TM and 6 gold for it. Our army is strong compared to everybody!

290BC (113) - The Iroqs beat us to the Great Wall :(. The neoCartagians complete the Pyramids. Our sword loses to a barb. Get Republic for Monarchy, WM and 44g from the Iroquois. I don't switch govs because I want to concentrate on the barbs from now on, no time for revolts. ;)

270BC (114) - Aha, the barb movement is impressive! I will not put the cork in yet.

250BC (115) - Building as much swords as possible, ordering them North.

230BC (116) - Vet Horseman defeats pictish warrior taking one hp. Fortifies on mountain.

210BC (117) - Horseman gets Elite before falling to three barbs.

190BC (118) - Buy Feudalism for 10gpt, 170 and WM from France, to switch to Sun Tzu and upgrade to pikes.

170BC (119) - Ratae Coritanorum founded. Our Eur sword defeats two pictish warriors.

150BC (120) - Our Eur sword takes out two new barbs, as long as they come in pairs we're ok.

Cut-off point:
We got strong military wise in the end, still no clue whether that's enough. The down side to fighting barbs is: no Great Leaders (= no FP yet). We have a nice set of cities and are still expanding. While not concentrating of researched managed to get not too far behind, we even still got a chance on Sun Tzu's. Normally I would switch govs but 'cos these are the interesting turns I stayed Despot. It is not too bad, Rome would most certainly fall if we turned that way.
 
@CRACKER : Wow ... I learning things just from your questions !!I didn't even think about 95% off the things you've asked, altho they sure make sense.

Sad to say, I didn't keep track of what happened when, in terms of barb activity, other than as mentioned in my notes for the timelines. Let's see: a warrior "popped" pictish warriors from a hut in 1990 bc; 875 bc, noticed a few pictish warriors come=ing south from mountain area's - these were smart enough to bypass spear on hills, well-defended cities (btw, I'm playing PTW 1.14f).

Other than than ... I saw a lot of barb activity on land-mass seperated by "mountain-snake" so I left that alone. The greeks built a city 2N, 1 NE the IRON in the north. That city was absolutely massaracred by barbarians- I think I saw upto 4 or 5 sack the city in a turn - that must have abolutely laid waste to the greek treasury.

For my part, based on seeing "smart avoidance" by pictish warriors, I basically built city, walled, and kept on that. As soon as they had an "open" city from the greeks, I barely saw any of them , they all just abused the poor greeks.

I DO think that the PTW barb's are more intelligent, altho I'm very new to PTW.
 
Originally posted by cracker
So it looks like Singularity is going for the "Keep the cork in the bottle" strategy of keeping the barbs corked up in the ghetto by building fortress cities at the choke points.

Yeah, I did that because I didn't know what timeframe I had from Greece and I entered middleage untill the uprising reached our borders. It was an insurance to secure my northeasterly expansionpattern.

I also looks like the upraising dates are falling in the 600bc to 100bc range. Does anyone have a general summary of where in time the uprisings are falling for everyone and also what the genral approach to preparing for the uprisings may be??

I finished researching monarchy in 730bc, and guessed correctly when I found that all techs could then be traded to get to next era. I wanted Greece with me as a tech partner, so I also knew the barbcamps would explode around that date. I saw the first sign of picts and a lone gallic swordman in 390bc on the other side of the bay of my naval construction town Laupardum. In other words it took the barbarians allmost 350 years to get from the camps in the NE to the peninsula between us and them.


Is anyone trying to set up conditions to harvest the

barbs for massive numbers fo elite promotions??
I am, I built strategic towns to shuttle them to the two peninsulas in the NE. I also recooned that some of my fortified GS would be promoted from my garrison towns in the north.

Did anyone use shuttle galleys to bypass the snaky peninsula??

I had a plan to do this, and produced my first galley around 350BC. It was allmost sunk immediatly though by a squid, and I would never be able to get enough troops across in one turn to withstand the onslaught of the next turn. My next plan was to use my easternmost town north of rome to shuttle a settler and 5 pikemens to the hill on the other side. Once there I would found a town to increase shuttlespeed by unloading them faster. And my next move would be to wipe them completely out to harvest the gold and get as many elite knights as possible.

Did anyone found a city on the chokepoint and give it away to an enemy to use as a permanent barbarian cork, while you used your units to go an kill the enemy instead of defending the city??

Hehe, clever thinking. No, I never thought about that. If I had gifted my town early enough to Carthage I would certainly have had an easy time invading as his economy would be completely ruined and much of his units would be en route to the garrison town. Brillliant plan cracker :D :goodjob:

What impact does lots of barbarian activity in specific locations have on the behavior of the Rival Civilizations in the game??

They where certainly drawn to the region, and where trespassing from a very early date. One of the volcano corks where removed, but the last one remained untill removed it with my veteran GS who subsecuentially got promoted to Elite and gave me a leader in my 2. or 3. elite victory :)

How can you get the most value out of barbarians even if they are stronger than you may want to deal with.

The plan of yours about gifting an exposed town close to them to your future enemy is a very good one. Besides that there isn't much I can think of in ways of capitalizing on it before I have troops who can beat them use that as an elite factory.

Do barbarians ever come from ships??

Nope. There where swarms of barb galleis, but somehow the AI cant use them to ferry the barbarians across... If it did this I would be knee deep in it quite early:)

Do barbarians in PTW have more of a "purpose" or mission than in Civ3v1.29 or do you think they may have more of a random component??

Yes, It's a bit hard to describe it in few words, but 'opportunistic' is a good term. They seem to shy away from tough battles where the RNG is against them. They also are quick to take advantage of undefended workers and pillaging your unpotected city tiles. As the barbs where approaching my city in the NE choke they split in half before the last turn. Some went back north, while others approached me without sacrificing single units on my city. I think it maybe needs either superieor RNG in man to man combat, or superior numbers to just swamp stronger forces who are outnumbered by a good margine. I met a pict quite early who should normally have attacked my warrior on a hill, but instead it went towards the roman roads and workers labouring there.

How many people saw any early Pictish Warrior barbs at any locations on the map before the GallicSword Barbs began to appear?

I just saw the odd pict that was the result of AI civs popping huts in my vicinity. I never popped a hut myself because I deliberatly didnt produce spearmen in the early game. My first sighting of a GS was at 390bc when I saw it on the closest peninsula, at that time there where far more picts there - but there where only GS coming down the last piece of land towards my bordertowns.

GallicSword barbs may begin to appear in 1's and 2's before the Era uprising; did anyone see this and if so when??

Nope.

I took a better screen of my endturn where you can see my build for a coastal invasion of the pictish peninsulas, and also the very long trek the AI barbs had to make to get to our lands.

 
Is it too late to join in?
I've been busy the last couple of days so I haven't been too dilligent to check to see when this game started.
I haven't read anyone's posts except for crackers first post but you'll just have to take my word for it.
If it's going to create a fuss then I'll wait for the next QSC barb rush.
 
Sir Eric: Just get stuck in. You can catch up no probs. I wouldn't worry about reading this thread if I were you. As far as I am concerned it's fine.

Have fun!
 
Dragging my heals a bit because the roof has fallen in at work. Sorry.

I haven't kept a timeline as I just wanted to catch up. Basically, 2 turns into this section I declared war on Rome. Reduced them to 2 cities in around ten turns whilst enjoyin my GA. I then gave them peace for one of their towns, a couple of workers, all their gold and Republic. :). I then turned my attention to Greece. I just couldn't get enough units there in time to war with them simultaneously. Anyway, I am into about the fourth turn of that war, and have taken about half their cities, including Athens and the GREAT WALL. This (for those that have read my posts) is part of my plan for the Barbs.

I have had no great leaders yet, because most of my units were regulars. But I have around 7 or 8 elite UU's now so I guess they will come.

The uprising hasn't happened yet, but my units are gradually working north, and I am keeping the option open to rush walls in the northern cities.

I guess my next post will be the interesting bit.





My savegame is here.
 
Ok, time for some more detailed answers:

Is anyone trying to set up conditions to harvest the barbs for massive numbers fo elite promotions??

That was more or less the plan, altough in practice that turned around into and my troops were trained by the Romans first. As I said in my earlier post it is the wrong way 'round 'cos of not getting leaders.

Did anyone use shuttle galleys to bypass the snaky peninsula??

I did that in the proper game, I had a city on the river and a shuttle moving from town to town to avoid the squids. After a while the english, who had a city amidst the barb settlements took care of the squids for me.

Do barbarians ever come from ships??

No, I have never seen barbs arrive in ships. That's way the cork works. In my game one vulcano was gone, and I let the rivals pass to get a shot. Very entertaining to watch while I was building up my forces.

Do barbarians in PTW have more of a "purpose" or mission than in Civ3v1.29 or do you think they may have more of a random component??

Well I played using vanilla CivIII, the barbarians have not gotten through the choke point yet, so in terms of behaviour it is very hard to tell.

How many people saw any early Pictish Warrior barbs at any locations on the map before the GallicSword Barbs began to appear?

I haven't seen Gallics yet!

Did anyone found a city on the chokepoint and give it away to an enemy to use as a permanent barbarian cork, while you used your units to go an kill the enemy instead of defending the city??

hehe clever! No I didn't think of that. Like I said I have seen a rival city getting raided constantly, but it did not seem to hurt the English very much, they were by far the most rich civ in my game back then.
 
Originally posted by cracker
What impact does lots of barbarian activity in specific locations have on the behavior of the Rival Civilizations in the game??
[/B]

As a guess I think it makes them more wary of getting into wars. I typically will renogiate peace as soon as its beneficial and as long as it doesn't conflict with conquest plans, and in this game I got a lot more than I would normally. However on the same token, it could have just been that I had a lot more to get from the AI this game, in that my tech was really behind.
 
I have played to about 300 AD now. I have all the first tier techs in the new age + Chivalry, as have the AI. I don't recall any notification of a barb uprising.

I have sent GS's onto the penninsula and the barbs have just run away. Not a single one has ventured into the main playing area of the map.

If I fortify a GS on a mountain the barbs run away,
If I place an unfortified GS on a mountain the barbs run away.
If I place a fortified GS on a hill the barbs run away
If I place an unfortified GS on a hill the barbs will run away about 75% of the time.

If I stack 2 or three units on a tile the barbs run away.
If I put 1 GS on a tundra tile it will be attacked by as many barbs as required to kill it.

Consequently I have chased the barbs all along the snake trying to upgrade vets to elites to the extent where it will now take 12 turns to get promoted units back to the scene of the accident. By this time they will be facing knights.

I'm playing PTW, and it seems as if these particular barbs are not up for it.

Any road up, as stated in a previous post I have a "difficulty" to resolve at work and will not be able to devote time to CIV for a few days probably. I probably won't be able to post to this thread again.

Unfortunately I can't deal with crackers pop quiz as the interaction with the barbs has been minimal. The question of giving away choke point towns I can say a little about. The AI built Choke point towns in my real GOTM. The result of this was that I could no longer sell them anything for gpt. As I was rushing culture at the time this hindered my progress in the game.
 
Top Bottom