SGOTM 13 - Gypsy Kings

Updated PPP for T188 only (please let me know if I've missed anything)

Here are my thoughts for the next turn T188(to be played w/i 9 hours hopefully so we know what Great person we are going to get)

Switch to tech drama at 0% (in case we get a great scientist and want to run 100% science with it) Also switch to pacifism has been delayed so philosophy is not as urgent.

CC 3Nets, CF, 2 sci, 1 eng 2 coast 1 scientist (continues with monastery) still gets great person helps CC grow faster

FH Fish, 4coast max growth by working coast and fish while working on the galley. With an eye to 3 pop whip a settler in the near future for the silver or Ivory site on Vicky's land mass.

SM 2 coast, fish continue courthouse
PC 2Nets, Iron Mine, finish axe
MC 2 coast, Clam, Marble continue Moai
BF whip courthouse continue courthouse waiting to whip to maintain rep bonus here (fish, copper, coast afterwards)
FC whip granary continue granary waiting to whip with more food in bin (crabs and plains forest afterwards? coast) If we can't whip the courthouse before the planned switch eventually a worker might be sent up and we can chop a forest to potentially finish the courthouse.

GH switch to courthouse
SR fish, rice switch build back to taoist monastery

New Galley drop off 1 worker on each forest near MC for chopping into Moai, then moves 1 back towards warrior sitting on 3 tile crab island.

Galleys wait, but I will send La C trireme ahead.

Galleys & triremes near nottingham, sail south making sure to note units in Nottingham along the way and ending the turn 2 away from Nottingham

trade copper to joao for silk.

check espionage sabotage values
check tech trades (none possible?)
I assume no gold trades nothing seemed exciting to me.

disband magellan
upgrade archer to C1 and medic1 this turn.
switch ep back to willem (to set up a glimpse of his research in a few turns)
 
Okay played T188

We got the Great Scientist (Darwin :) )

Vicky had an axe and 2 trireme in Nottingham, at the start of T189 she has 3 trireme 1 galley and 1 axe (the galley might be full of archers?)

Willem will trade calendar

upload log
Spoiler :
Here is your Session Turn Log from 220 AD to 235 AD:

Turn 188, 220 AD: Clam Chowder has grown to size 7.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Stone Mountain has grown to size 3.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Golden Hills has grown to size 5.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Willem van Oranje has 50 gold available for trade.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Catapult has reduced the defenses of London to 28%!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Catapult 1 (Paired Clams) has reduced the defenses of London to 13%!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 3 (Paired Clams) (5.00) vs Victoria's Swordsman (7.08)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Combat Odds: 29.6%
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Plot Defense: +13%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (City Attack: -20%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Catapult 3 (Paired Clams) has caused collateral damage! (3 Units)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 3 (Paired Clams) is hit for 23 (77/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 3 (Paired Clams) is hit for 23 (54/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 3 (Paired Clams) is hit for 23 (31/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 3 (Paired Clams) is hit for 23 (8/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman is hit for 16 (52/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 3 (Paired Clams) is hit for 23 (0/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman has defeated Napoleon's Catapult 3 (Paired Clams)!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Catapult 3 (Paired Clams) has died trying to attack a Swordsman!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 2 (Bronzed Fish) (5.00) vs Victoria's Archer (5.49)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Combat Odds: 51.4%
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Plot Defense: +13%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (City Defense: +70%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Catapult 2 (Bronzed Fish) has caused collateral damage! (2 Units)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 18 (70/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 18 (52/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 2 (Bronzed Fish) is hit for 21 (79/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Catapult 2 (Bronzed Fish) is hit for 21 (58/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 18 (34/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Catapult 2 (Bronzed Fish) has withdrawn from combat with a Archer!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman (6.00) vs Victoria's Archer (3.60)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Combat Odds: 94.8%
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Plot Defense: +13%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (City Defense: +50%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (City Attack: -30%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 23 (53/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 23 (30/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 23 (7/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman is hit for 16 (52/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman is hit for 16 (36/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman is hit for 16 (20/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 23 (0/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman has defeated Victoria's Archer!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Swordsman has destroyed a Archer!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman (6.00) vs Victoria's Bernard Montgomery (Archer) (4.62)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Combat Odds: 81.8%
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Plot Defense: +13%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (City Defense: +50%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (City Attack: -10%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (River Attack: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Bernard Montgomery (Archer) is hit for 21 (55/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman is hit for 18 (82/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Bernard Montgomery (Archer) is hit for 21 (34/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Bernard Montgomery (Archer) is hit for 21 (13/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Bernard Montgomery has died in combat!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Bernard Montgomery (Archer) is hit for 21 (0/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman has defeated Victoria's Bernard Montgomery (Archer)!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Swordsman has destroyed a Bernard Montgomery!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Axeman 1 (Fish Hills) (5.00) vs Victoria's Swordsman (3.52)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Combat Odds: 89.1%
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Plot Defense: +13%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (River Attack: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman is hit for 19 (33/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Axeman 1 (Fish Hills) is hit for 20 (80/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman is hit for 19 (14/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman is hit for 19 (0/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Axeman 1 (Fish Hills) has defeated Victoria's Swordsman!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Axeman 1 (Fish Hills) has destroyed a Swordsman!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman (6.00) vs Victoria's Swordsman (3.12)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Combat Odds: 98.0%
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Plot Defense: +13%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (City Attack: -10%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (River Attack: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman is hit for 20 (80/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman is hit for 19 (15/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Swordsman is hit for 19 (0/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Swordsman has defeated Victoria's Swordsman!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Swordsman has destroyed a Swordsman!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Archer (3.00) vs Victoria's Archer (1.56)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Combat Odds: 98.0%
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Plot Defense: +13%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: (City Defense: +70%)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 17 (8/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Archer is hit for 22 (78/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria's Archer is hit for 17 (0/100HP)
Turn 188, 220 AD: Napoleon's Archer has defeated Victoria's Archer!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Your Archer has destroyed a Archer!
Turn 188, 220 AD: You have captured London!!!
Turn 188, 220 AD: Catherine has 70 gold available for trade.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Willem van Oranje has 50 gold available for trade.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Victoria refuses to talk.
Turn 188, 220 AD: You are the worst enemy of Victoria.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Ragnar is the worst enemy of Isabella.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Isabella is the worst enemy of Catherine, Ragnar.
Turn 188, 220 AD: Catherine will trade Calendar
Turn 188, 220 AD: Catherine will trade Cow
Turn 188, 220 AD: Joao II will trade Silk
Turn 188, 220 AD: Charles Darwin (Great Scientist) has been born in Clam Chowder (Napoleon)!

Turn 189, 235 AD: Golden Hills can hurry Courthouse for 2? with 8? overflow and +1? for 28 turns.
Turn 189, 235 AD: London has become healthy.
Turn 189, 235 AD: Willem van Oranje will trade Calendar

autolog
Spoiler :
Logging by BUFFY 3.19.003 (BtS 3.19)
------------------------------------------------
Turn 188/750 (220 AD) [13-May-2011 05:47:36]
Research begun: Drama (16 Turns)
Golden Hills begins: Courthouse (23 turns)
Spicy Rice begins: Taoist Monastery (88 turns)
Archer promoted: Combat I
Archer promoted: Medic I
0% Research: 26 per turn
0% Espionage: 4 per turn
100% Gold: 98 per turn, 653 in the bank

After End Turn:
Charles Darwin (Great Scientist) born in Clam Chowder
Paired Clams finishes: Axeman

Other Player Actions:
Attitude Change: Isabella (Spain) towards Ragnar (Vikings), from 'Furious' to 'Annoyed'

Turn 189/750 (235 AD) [13-May-2011 06:03:38]
Paired Clams begins: Catapult (13 turns)
 
Here is the test game updated to current.

It is accurate, after the first turn of playing with the test, you need to worldbuilder OUT the railroad on PC's iron.

The other mistake I made was not adjusting the size of London before the capture, so it will come out of anarchy in the test game 1 turn early.

The beakers in Philo are off also, we are short in the test game, 332 to 399 in the real game.

Other than that, it should very accurate.

Remembered another thing that I did not address...the units near London. There are the right units, but their individual XP and damage are probably not right.
 
T189-T98 Rough Draft (still working on the war details, the galley movements/chaining, workers and a plan to transport the settler from FH planned)

I'm open to suggested changes for the "finished" details below. I hope to finish the incomplete parts in about 5 hours. Feel free to give me suggestions in the unfinished parts, but I will incorporate what I can from earlier suggestions tonight.

Tech Path
100% on Drama for 2 turns, then on the 3rd turn adjust slider so that Drama is just barely finished.
Then check additional gold required to trade calendar for drama and adjust slider to just get enough :science: so I can trade Drama for Calendar straight up.
Then 100% on Philosophy until finished,
editted
0% on compass afterwards

Civic changes
Planning to set up the switch to caste and pacifism on T199. Need to test if capturing Nottingham, and settling another city will push us to 2 turns of anarchy for 1 civic change.

Religion Changes
Setting up to switch to taoism after T199 civic changes

Tech Trading
Check every turn for new tech trading opportunities.
Check Research Screen each turn to see if AI Civs have completed any techs.
Set up a drama for calendar trade as described above

Other Trade Opportunities and Diplomacy
Maintain current trades
Planning to trade away iron on T198 so we can build warrior MP
I will be looking for happiness resources since we want to grow CC up to pop 11 asap.
Reject "Stop Trade" demands
If we have an excess resource, unload it if we can get some cash
If we have an expired deal for (easiest to check on the F4-"Active" screen by mousing over deals) and they have more income, cancel and try to get more. AIs will normally trade all their excess income for a resource up to about 10 (or more)
Check if there are other deals that can be canceled/reevaluated.
Accept research demands of low cost (<300 ) techs from others
Reject other research demands (but will check with the team if at all possible before doing so)
I'mthinking we accept a demand to go to war with Izzy (but probably AI won't ask since we are at war?) Will reject other war demands

Espionage
Leave espionage on Willem until we get to see his research. Adjust allocation to maintain a view of his research, but put any excess towards Cathy.

Great People
Great Scientist builds academy in CC on T189.

City Builds
CC... I&#8217;m going suggest grow as fast as happiness allows. As long as we have happiness grow at max rate. Once we are at happiness cap, grow at max rate until we are 1 turn away from growing and then slow growth with mines, specialists (scientists first, only engineer if I have too)

Each scientist gives us more than the monastery will, so I don&#8217;t mind delaying the monastery to get a another population earlier.
I'm debating if it doesn't make sense to grow into expected happiness. So run an unhappy pop and still continue to grow if we know happiness is coming soon, for example whip unhappiness is decreasing in a few turns or we are going to settle and get silver soon. (But only grow to a max of 11 pop)

FH..Fish and 4 coast until 6 pop working on galley, then switch to settler, 3 pop whip settler T193, then continue with galley
SM... keeps fish and whips courthouse T191 when it grows to 4 pop, then starts workboat, builds wealth after workboat on T197, then starts warrior on T198 when we can safely give away iron

PC...starts catapult, switches to axe, 2 pop whips axe, finishes catapult, starts courthouse instead of the swordsman mabraham suggested it slow build (since I plan to give away iron on T198, I don&#8217;t think it will be able to finish a swordsman)

MC... continue Moai, then courthouse

BF... whips courthouse on T191 after growing to 6 pop, then starts worker, then wealth/warrior
FC... 2 pops granary T189 timed so it will have 17/36 food in bin the turn after granary is finished, then courthouse

GH... whips courthouse T189, workboat
SR... chop finishes T191, whip monastery T191 grow back to 2 T192, chop goes into missionary, switch to fish and Gmine finish 1st missionary, start 2nd missionary and whip it if 1st missionary fails in CC, then granary. (Haven't test this with the game, so not sure if this plan works or if it is reasonable to whip the 2nd missionary by T199)

London I believe London will be starving and unhappy when it comes out of revolt. I&#8217;m thinking either let 1 pop starve and start a settler and whip it next turn. Or settler and a granary.

Work Boats
GH's workboat heads towards Vicky's lands (and the silver site presumably, possibly the ivory site)

Workers
Strauss and Eiffel time chops into SR&#8217;s builds, delaying them with roads. Finish road on spice, and then both start spice plantation if calendar for drama trade goes as planned. Finish plantation then road towards horses. Otherwise road towards horses before plantation.

Stevenson

Hoover road plains hill while waiting for New Galley to come pick him up, drop him off on FC island, chops the plains forest

Yeltsin

New worker from BF

Navy

War Plans
Planning an attack on Nottingham on T194
Nottingham currently has 3 triremes (C1, 0xp,0xp) 1 galley, and an axe. The galley might be loaded with units.

I want to blockade Nottingham with the 3 triremes this turn T189 (La Couronne which has CombatI moves into the stack this turn. With the coast defense bonus we have favorable odds if Vicky attacks.

I think by T193 we can have 7 mostly healthy units next to nottingham (3 catapults (1CR1Bomb, 1 CR1, 1 0xp), 2 swords (1 Combat1, other CRI, CRII might not be fully healed) and 2 axes (1 with Combat1, other 3/2 xp) (leaving the sword promoted to CombatI, wounded axe, catapult, archer in London) archer is already promoted to CombatI, MedicI.

If the battle goes well I plan take the experienced units to finish York

I want to take the catapult and axe we can have ready to move out of PC on T192, T193 respectively take a 2 or 3 galley chain protected by a single trireme out on a journey to the Iron fort to the east. This will arrive approximately T199-T200.

More details to come (under construction)

Trireme "La Couronne"

Trireme "Paralus"

Trireme "Salaminia"

Trireme ???

Trireme (GH) ???

Galleys Ferry, Argo and Nautilus

Galley "Kon-Tiki"

Galley "New Galley"

Galley from FH??

Stopping/Pausing Conditions

A barbarian spawns in an awkward position that I can't immediately deal with
AI declares war on us
war with Vicky goes badly
Could pause on T194 to assess the assault plan on Nottingham

Checklist every turn before hitting end turn
double check MM and whip timing for each city
check tech trades available
check if and what AI have researched from F4 screen
check for new/better resource trades
check espionage screen for large sabotage production values in all visible AI cities
check if any AI went into war prep mode
check for any barbarians
save the game

While scouting
will put a note that notes the most recent location of barbarians
will put a note that notes the most recent location of all AI units (except naval units)
 
T189-T98 Rough Draft (still working on the war details, the galley movements/chaining, workers and a plan to transport the settler from FH planned)

I'm open to suggested changes for the "finished" details below. I hope to finish the incomplete parts in about 5 hours. Feel free to give me suggestions in the unfinished parts, but I will incorporate what I can from earlier suggestions tonight.

Tech Path
100% Drama until finished,
???% on Calendar for 1 turn (this will allow us to trade drama for calendar from either Cathy or Willem assuming they are not both researching it themselves. I'm not sure how much research we would have to put in to make the trade possible. Does someone want to do testing to see what is the minimum research into calendar that would convince willem or Cathy to trade it for drama?),
100% on Philosophy until finished,
0% on compass afterwards

In the latest test game, Joao wanted Drama+90:gold:. I put 36:science: on and he'd trade it for Drama+65:gold:. Once I had 133:science: he wanted no gold, but this was probably about 20 too many :science:. Since we have :science: multipliers, we want to trade with them, not with :gold:. So find out what the asking price is in :gold: and put about that many :science: on Calendar. Remember that there's overflow from Drama, and that might not be of a useful size to go on Calendar on the first turn after Drama.

Civic changes
Planning to set up the switch to caste and pacifism on T199. Need to test if capturing Nottingham, and settling another city will push us to 2 turns of anarchy for 1 civic change.

I had to settle the silver site, capture Nottingham and capture York before one civic cost 2 turns of anarchy. Note there's no need to sync the switch to Caste and the switch to Paci. Caste should be driven by what we can usefully do in CC, and Paci should be driven by the arrival of Taoism. Remember the five turns of delay between government revolts, however.

Religion Changes
Setting up to switch to taoism after T199 civic changes

Tech Trading
Check every turn for new tech trading opportunities.
Check Research Screen each turn to see if AI Civs have completed any techs.
Set up a drama for calendar trade as described above

Other Trade Opportunities and Diplomacy
Maintain current trades
Planning to trade away iron on T198 so we can build warrior MP

Good.

I will be looking for happiness resources since we want to grow CC up to pop 11 asap.
Reject "Stop Trade" demands
If we have an excess resource, unload it if we can get some cash
If we have an expired deal for (easiest to check on the F4-"Active" screen by mousing over deals) and they have more income, cancel and try to get more. AIs will normally trade all their excess income for a resource up to about 10 (or more)
Check if there are other deals that can be canceled/reevaluated.
Accept research demands of low cost (<300 ) techs from others
Reject other research demands (but will check with the team if at all possible before doing so)
I'mthinking we accept a demand to go to war with Izzy (but probably AI won't ask since we are at war?) Will reject other war demands

Whatever.

Espionage
Leave espionage on Willem until we get to see his research. Adjust allocation to maintain a view of his research, but put any excess towards Cathy.

Yep.

Great People
Great Scientist builds academy in CC on T189.

Yep

City Builds
CC... I&#8217;m going suggest grow as fast as happiness allows. As long as we have happiness grow at max rate. Once we are at happiness cap, grow at max rate until we are 1 turn away from growing and then slow growth with mines, specialists (scientists first, only engineer if I have too)

I found on the spreadsheet that I had to plan quite a few moves in advance. Even working two mines and a scientist we're growing every 3 turns.

Each scientist gives us more than the monastery will, so I don&#8217;t mind delaying the monastery to get a another population earlier.
I'm debating if it doesn't make sense to grow into expected happiness. So run an unhappy pop and still continue to grow if we know happiness is coming soon, for example whip unhappiness is decreasing in a few turns or we are going to settle and get silver soon. (But only grow to a max of 11 pop)

I don't see any advantage to growing unhappy unless we're expecting two units of happiness to arrive and the spacing between them is less than about three turns, which is about how long CC takes to grow.

FH..Fish and 4 coast until 6 pop working on galley, then switch to settler, 3 pop whip settler T193, then continue with galley
SM... keeps fish and whips courthouse T191 when it grows to 4 pop, then starts workboat, builds wealth after workboat on T197, then starts warrior on T198 when we can safely give away iron

PC...starts catapult, switches to axe, 2 pop whips axe, finishes catapult, starts courthouse instead of the swordsman mabraham suggested it slow build (since I plan to give away iron on T198, I don&#8217;t think it will be able to finish a swordsman)

Both fine.

MC... continue Moai, then courthouse

BF... whips courthouse on T191 after growing to 6 pop, then starts worker, then wealth/warrior
FC... 2 pops granary T189 timed so it will have 17/36 food in bin the turn after granary is finished, then courthouse

GH... whips courthouse T189, workboat

Then finish archer.

SR... chop finishes T191, whip monastery T191 grow back to 2 T192, chop goes into missionary, switch to fish and Gmine finish 1st missionary, start 2nd missionary and whip it if 1st missionary fails in CC, then granary. (Haven't test this with the game, so not sure if this plan works or if it is reasonable to whip the 2nd missionary by T199)

Remember to de-sync the chops. First missionary available on T195, and second can be whipped T199 on the spreadsheet on the above plan. If you switch from rice to Gmine on T190, you get the same growth T192, but the missionaries are available on T194 and can be whipped T198.

London I believe London will be starving and unhappy when it comes out of revolt. I&#8217;m thinking either let 1 pop starve and start a settler and whip it next turn. Or settler and a granary.

It does depend how great the food deficit is, which depends how unhappy it'll be. Waiting a turn and whipping a settler will consume four people. If it's happy at size 6 then she'll have enough food to feed those people and can start a granary. An alternative will be whipping a worker/granary/courthouse without waiting, for three population, because 7 population can also be fed if there's not net :yuck:.

Work Boats
GH's workboat heads towards Vicky's lands (and the silver site presumably, possibly the ivory site)

Workers
Strauss and Eiffel time chops into SR&#8217;s builds, delaying them with roads. Finish road on spice, and then both start spice plantation if calendar for drama trade goes as planned. Finish plantation then road towards horses. Otherwise road towards horses before plantation.

I would finish the northern chop first, and have that worker build the whole road on the tile SW of him, while the southern worker finishes his chop and road. Now the northern worker can join the southern building the plantation without loss of movement points, and both can move three tiles and put a turn on a workshop as they move back north. Since we want all these improvements, spend zero worker turns on pure movement, and at worst we delay the access to the spice resource a turn, I think this is best.

Stevenson

Hoover road plains hill while waiting for New Galley to come pick him up, drop him off on FC island, chops the plains forest

I envisaged Hoover going on a boat with the settler from FH to Vicky's lands. I think our need for worker turns there is much more pressing.


Name him.

New worker from BF

Navy

War Plans
Planning an attack on Nottingham on T194
Nottingham currently has 3 triremes (C1, 0xp,0xp) 1 galley, and an axe. The galley might be loaded with units.

I want to blockade Nottingham with the 3 triremes this turn T189 (La Couronne which has CombatI moves into the stack this turn. With the coast defense bonus we have favorable odds if Vicky attacks.

I played this in the test game. We definitely want to blockade two tiles away from Nottingham, on the southern-most tile of her culture. That still cuts Nottingham off from possible iron access. She'll still send at least two triremes at our stack, but we'll have the ability to clean out an injured trireme if we take a loss. Unfortunately we only seem to get 1XP from winning those battles, and even if we win twice, we'll have to withdraw as soon as she has more healthy triremes when we do.

Perhaps we want to lurk three tiles from Nottingham and only blockade when the iron might be due. If we cut the iron T184, and lost the axe T185 (did we?) T185, died T186 and Vicky spent two turns getting two workers there, and then five turns building the fort, iron isn't on line until T192T194. It might get on line T191T193, but cutting the second turn of building an axe is OK for us. so I guess that means we blockade T193 and take it T194.

I think by T193 we can have 7 mostly healthy units next to nottingham (3 catapults (1CR1Bomb, 1 CR1, 1 0xp), 2 swords (1 Combat1, other CRI, CRII might not be fully healed) and 2 axes (1 with Combat1, other 3/2 xp) (leaving the sword promoted to CombatI, wounded axe, catapult, archer in London) archer is already promoted to CombatI, MedicI.

Obviously the incoming axe+cat from PC have to land on the grassland and walk onto the hill to wait for the London stack.

If the battle goes well I plan take the experienced units to finish York

To do this, we want to be sure we have about two galleys near Nottingham when we take it. These guys will do most of the transport and landing of units next to York. With one picking up the settler and Hoover, and two in the chain, there's a spare floating. The trailing galley from the chain heads for Nottingham, maybe via a chain with the settler-Hoover galley (but I do not think there is time for this without delaying the attack on York).

So on T194 maybe some spare units from Nottingham load up on the galley for London, maybe some spare units walk back along the road. Some others heal up in Nottingham and catch the next rounds of the galleys. Depends how much combat we see.

I want to take the catapult and axe we can have ready to move out of PC on T192, T193 respectively take a 2 or 3 galley chain protected by a single trireme out on a journey to the Iron fort to the east. This will arrive approximately T199-T200.

A two-galley chain lands the forces on the hill next to the iron T199. Seems ok timing to me. We can't be ready to attack York for another turn or three yet.

More details to come (under construction)

Trireme "La Couronne"

Trireme "Paralus"

Trireme "Salaminia"

Trireme ???

Trireme (GH) ???

Galleys Ferry, Argo and Nautilus

Galley "Kon-Tiki"

Galley "New Galley"

Galley from FH??

Stopping/Pausing Conditions

A barbarian spawns in an awkward position that I can't immediately deal with
AI declares war on us
war with Vicky goes badly
Could pause on T194 to assess the assault plan on Nottingham

Checklist every turn before hitting end turn
double check MM and whip timing for each city
check tech trades available
check if and what AI have researched from F4 screen
check for new/better resource trades
check espionage screen for large sabotage production values in all visible AI cities
check if any AI went into war prep mode
check for any barbarians
save the game

While scouting
will put a note that notes the most recent location of barbarians
will put a note that notes the most recent location of all AI units (except naval units)
 
I think you should whip the pop off of London in the form of a settler. I think this will be easier than trying to get one to the silver from CC. CC can start working Scientists right now and speed our GPP. I think we will be somewhat limited by when we get the 4 more GP's needed to get us up to Astro/Chemistry.

It would be nice to get a view of York, we may be able to send an axe from London to handle the eastern iron.

If we cut the iron T184, and lost the axe T185 (did we?) and Vicky spent two turns getting two workers there,
We moved onto the iron T184, pillaged fort T185, moved to hill T186, died IBT.
 
I think you should whip the pop off of London in the form of a settler. I think this will be easier than trying to get one to the silver from CC. CC can start working Scientists right now and speed our GPP. I think we will be somewhat limited by when we get the 4 more GP's needed to get us up to Astro/Chemistry.

Nobody's suggested a settler from CC - the suggestion has been a settler from FH, since it's in no real rush for a courthouse and can get a settler whipped soon.

CC should also grow first to the happy cap, then work mines and scientists, because we're doubling the scientist :gp: soon, as discussed several times above. Given that we need to spend some turns growing, we want to do that growth while the scientists are relatively less profitable.

The GScientist plan is something like one each for Astro, Edu, Gunpowder, Chemistry with options for a second on Edu and Chem, or even out to PP and SciMeth if we think we need to go as far as Communism for State Property. Without Pacifism, in my test game GScientists were arriving about every 9-10 turns, so we are definitely in the zone for four+ GScientists in very short order.

It would be nice to get a view of York, we may be able to send an axe from London to handle the eastern iron.

Sure, but with a probable shock axeman around from killing our earlier pillaging axeman, it's hard to do that safely and keep London safe.

We moved onto the iron T184, pillaged fort T185, moved to hill T186, died IBT.

Thanks. I've adjusted my post above.
 
Nobody's suggested a settler from CC -
...right, sorry from FH, I have concerns about moving him safely. She has 4 Triremes right now. It could be an issue.

doubling the scientist:gp: soon
How do you mean? We doubled it with the NE, how are we to add 100% again?
 
In the latest test game, Joao wanted Drama+90. I put 36 on and he'd trade it for Drama+65. Once I had 133 he wanted no gold, but this was probably about 20 too many . Since we have multipliers, we want to trade with them, not with . So find out what the asking price is in and put about that many on Calendar. Remember that there's overflow from Drama, and that might not be of a useful size to go on Calendar on the first turn after Drama.

Okay in the real game cathy and willem want 680 gold for calendar. In the test game Joao wanted 650 gold (reduced I assume since more AI know it in the test game).

In the test game as you noted they would take Drama +90 gold for calendar. So Drama is worth 560 gold to them which is ~702/1.2 by the way. So if the pattern holds true in the real game
they would want Drama + 120 gold (assuming more AI don't learn calendar). The AI seem to value research less than gold by a factor of 1.2. So I would need approximately 144 research into calendar for them to trade it to me.

Anyways this is just interesting. I will adjust the slider on the 3rd turn to just get drama. Then on T192 check the value of drama for calendar trades and put in just 2 or 3 over 1.2*gold required to make the trade happen and trade for calendar on T193. I don't think this slows down the spice plantation since those workers will be building roads after the chops.
 
...right, sorry from FH, I have concerns about moving him safely. She has 4 Triremes right now. It could be an issue.

Yes, but that settler is built on T194, which is the turn we take Nottingham. By now we'll know what the outcome of trireme combat will be, and we've been galley chaining across the PC-to-Nottingham space. That settler only has to make it to Nottingham by sea. After that roads will be faster and safer, I expect.

How do you mean? We doubled it with the NE, how are we to add 100% again?

Sorry, +100%, from Pacifism. It's the same principle as running 0% :science: before the academy. If you can't put your variable quantity (i.e. slider position) to your desired position forever (i.e. 100%:science:), then you should tend to prefer to do so once that quantity gets an extra multiplier. Here, the variable is the number of scientists producing :gp:. We should prefer to grow now, and run scientists after the revolutions, except inasmuch as happiness forces us to compromise.
 
Okay I've been working to flesh out and edit the Rough Draft I posted earlier taking into account the recent feedback up to #1712.

I still need serious work on all the galley movements. I need to screenshot this and play to get a feel of the galley movements. The test game will be very helpful here. I hope to do that after this post, so don't look too closely at the galley plans.

Biggest changes then are I think we can push up the Nottingham attack to T193 instead of T194, several non-critical units wouldn't at full health but I think it makes sense.

And I'm suggesting whipping the galley out of FH and then 2 pop whipping the settler to give me more flexibility with the galleys and gets the settler a turn earlier. This gives me a chance to get the settler and hoover over to vicky a bit faster. It gives me a galley to pick up the worker built in BF, and I think will let me get the galley chain of the 2nd set axe/catapult on its way to the eastern Iron fort. I have to work out the details of course, so the jury is still out on the heavier whipping of FH.


T189-T98 Rough Draft part 2

Tech Path
100% on Drama for 2 turns, then on the 3rd turn adjust slider so that Drama is just barely finished.
Then check additional gold required to trade calendar for drama and adjust slider to just get enough so I can trade Drama for Calendar straight up.
Then 100% on Philosophy until finished, editted
0% on compass afterwards


Civic changes
Planning to set up the switch to caste and pacifism on T198. Mabraham tested the anarchy shift (we can take nottingham and settle silver without increasing anarchy)

Religion Changes
Setting up to switch to taoism after T198 civic changes

Tech Trading
Check every turn for new tech trading opportunities.
Check Research Screen each turn to see if AI Civs have completed any techs.
Set up a drama for calendar trade as described above

Other Trade Opportunities and Diplomacy
Maintain current trades
Planning to trade away iron on T198 so we can build warrior MP
I will be looking for happiness resources since we want to grow CC up to pop 11 asap.
Reject "Stop Trade" demands
If we have an excess resource, unload it if we can get some cash
If we have an expired deal for (easiest to check on the F4-"Active" screen by mousing over deals) and they have more income, cancel and try to get more. AIs will normally trade all their excess income for a resource up to about 10 (or more)
Check if there are other deals that can be canceled/reevaluated.
Accept research demands of low cost (<300 ) techs from others
Reject other research demands (but will check with the team if at all possible before doing so)
I'mthinking we accept a demand to go to war with Izzy (but probably AI won't ask since we are at war?) Will reject other war demands

Espionage
Leave espionage on Willem until we get to see his research. Adjust allocation to maintain a view of his research, but put any excess towards Cathy.

Great People
Great Scientist builds academy in CC on T189.

City Builds
CC... I&#8217;m going suggest grow as fast as happiness allows. As long as we have happiness grow at max rate. Once we are at happiness cap, grow at max rate until we are 1 turn away from growing and then slow growth with mines, specialists (scientists first, only engineer if I have too)

Okay with fur, silk (trade), we can have 9 happy pop in CC. With Silver we can have 11 pop. I think we can settle silver by T199. We can have Spice by T197. I think we can and should max grow CC. If we revolt on T198 I think this means a maximum of 1 unhappy citizen for maybe 1 turn. I still need to play test this, however

FH..T189 Fish and 3 coast GM
T190 2 pop whips galley, fish, GM, PM
T191 settler started fish, coast, GM, PM
T192 settler whipped
T193 courthouse, Fish, GM or coast to get FH to 4 pop to whip courthouse before T198


I think this extra galley and the settler a turn earlier will give me some flexibility Still working out the details.

SM... keeps fish and whips courthouse T191 when it grows to 4 pop, then starts workboat, builds wealth after workboat on T197, then starts warrior on T198 when we can safely give away iron

PC...starts catapult, switches to axe, 2 pop whips axe, finishes catapult, starts courthouse instead of the swordsman mabraham suggested it slow build (since I plan to give away iron on T198, I don&#8217;t think it will be able to finish a swordsman)

MC... continue Moai, then courthouse

BF... whips courthouse on T191 after growing to 6 pop, then starts worker, then wealth/warrior
FC... 2 pops granary T189 timed so it will have 17/36 food in bin the turn after granary is finished, then courthouse

GH... whips courthouse T189, workboat
SR... chop finishes T190, whip monastery T191 grow back to 2 T192, chop goes into missionary, switch to fish and Gmine on T190 to finish 1st missionary a bit earlier, run fish and Gmine on regrowth to 2 pop T192, start 2nd missionary and whip it if 1st missionary fails in CC, then granary. I still need to play test this.

London coming out of revolt on 3 pop whips granary immediately (I think it will be happy enough it will get our rep bonus). Then I think we could 3 pop whip a settler for the ivory site perhaps if the war effort is looking good. If not I think we whip a courthouse here and then maybe the forbidden palace if we can fit it in before the globe theater build is needed.

London can get a settler after the granary whip to the silver site by T200. Perhaps the settler from FH can go to the ivory site if the war effort is going well...

Work Boats
GH's workboat heads towards silver settling site

Workers
Strauss finishes chop into SR T190, moves SW roads T191-3, moves to spice builds plantation finishes T197, moves 3 past SR and workshops for 1 turn
Eiffel T189 chops, T190-1 roads, T192 chops forest into SR, T193 road finishes, builds plantation finishes T197, moves 3 past SR and workshops for 1 turn


Stevenson finishes chop T194, then... New Galley takes him FC to camp 2nd fur and chop

Hoover road plains hills, builds fort on silk if gets bored waiting for Ferry and the settler from FH. Taken over to Vicky's former lands with settler By T196-7? is there looking for work.

Yeltsin finishes chop T194 into Moai, then roads horses until border pop in MC (Moai will help with border pop I believe in time), then pastures the horses

New worker from BF on T196 (could be picked up by new galley proposal in FH and taken over to Vicky's lands after FH galley helps galley chain the settler over to PC and Ferry)


War Plans
Planning an attack on Nottingham on T194
Nottingham currently has 3 triremes (C1, 0xp,0xp) 1 galley, and an axe. The galley might be loaded with units.

Lurk with 3 triremes 3 tiles south of Nottingham and blockade on T193 only if necessary. I think we can take Nottingham on T193.

land incoming axe (promoted to combatI) and catapult (promoted to CRI) from PC can land on the grass on T190, then walk to hill on T191, bombard on T192. 2 swords (one combat 1 ~5.6/6.0) (one unpromoted until learn more 5.3/6.0), axe (combatI promoted ~4.5/5.0) healthy catapult and healthy CR1 Bomb Catapult can arrive on the hill T192. On T193 CR1 bomb catapult finishes the defenses. And depending on units I see in Nottingham I take the city T193 with the CRI catapult ( and healthy no xp catapult if necessary) to soften the target I think I can take Nottingham with slightly hurt units. If somehow Vicky reinforces the city then the units can wait a turn to get almost full health) and I can blockade on T193.

I'm planning on leaving the CR1 sword with 5/4 xp , wounded axe, catapult, and archer in London to heal.


If the battle goes well I plan take the experienced units to finish York

I want to take the catapult and axe we can have ready to move out of PC on T192, T193 respectively take a 2 or 3 galley chain protected by a single trireme out on a journey to the Iron fort to the east. This will arrive approximately T199-T200.

More details to come (still under construction) (Galleys will need serious attention again... I will need to practice and make screen shots for this...)

Trireme "La Couronne" lurk 3 south of Nottingham, then protects galleys ferrying troops to York area
Trireme "Paralus" lurk 3 south of Nottingham, then protects galleys ferrying troops to York area
Trireme "Salaminia"lurk 3 south of Nottingham, then protects galleys ferrying troops to York area

Trireme escorts Kon-Tiki taking 2nd set of axe/catapult from PC to eastern iron fort.

Trireme (GH) protects the homeland (moves over towards PC side just in case the lurking fleet needs reinforcements.

Galleys Ferry, helps galley chain 1st axe/catapult to Nottingham, then comes back and galley chains with galley from FH the settler and then picks up Hoover and galley chains them over to Vicky's land, then follows and helps move troops after Nottingham falls.
Argo

Kon-Tiki moves with trireme south, sets up for galley chain of 2nd pair of
Nautilus galley chains 1st pair of axe/catapult pair
Galley "New Galley" takes warrior on 3 tile island to Fish Hills, come back picks up stevenson and takes him to Furry Crabs, comes back towards SR island to pick up Yeltsin

Galley from FH helps galley chain over the settler, then comes and picks up worker built in BF on T196, hopeful galley chaining him over to Vicky's lands.

Stopping/Pausing Conditions

A barbarian spawns in an awkward position that I can't immediately deal with
AI declares war on us
war with Vicky goes badly
Could pause on T194 to assess the assault plan on Nottingham

Checklist every turn before hitting end turn
double check MM and whip timing for each city
check tech trades available
check if and what AI have researched from F4 screen
check for new/better resource trades
check espionage screen for large sabotage production values in all visible AI cities
check if any AI went into war prep mode
check for any barbarians
save the game

While scouting
will put a note that notes the most recent location of barbarians
will put a note that notes the most recent location of all AI units (except naval units)
 
Okay I've been working to flesh out and edit the Rough Draft I posted earlier taking into account the recent feedback up to #1712.

I still need serious work on all the galley movements. I need to screenshot this and play to get a feel of the galley movements. The test game will be very helpful here. I hope to do that after this post, so don't look too closely at the galley plans.

Biggest changes then are I think we can push up the Nottingham attack to T193 instead of T194, several non-critical units wouldn't at full health but I think it makes sense.


Sounds good. I'm not expecting to see big forces in Nottingham.

And I'm suggesting whipping the galley out of FH and then 2 pop whipping the settler to give me more flexibility with the galleys and gets the settler a turn earlier. This gives me a chance to get the settler and hoover over to vicky a bit faster. It gives me a galley to pick up the worker built in BF, and I think will let me get the galley chain of the 2nd set axe/catapult on its way to the eastern Iron fort. I have to work out the details of course, so the jury is still out on the heavier whipping of FH.

Sounds reasonable.

T189-T98 Rough Draft part 2

Tech Path
100% on Drama for 2 turns, then on the 3rd turn adjust slider so that Drama is just barely finished.
Then check additional gold required to trade calendar for drama and adjust slider to just get enough so I can trade Drama for Calendar straight up.
Then 100% on Philosophy until finished, editted
0% on compass afterwards


Civic changes
Planning to set up the switch to caste and pacifism on T198. Mabraham tested the anarchy shift (we can take nottingham and settle silver without increasing anarchy)

Religion Changes
Setting up to switch to taoism after T198 civic changes

Tech Trading
Check every turn for new tech trading opportunities.
Check Research Screen each turn to see if AI Civs have completed any techs.
Set up a drama for calendar trade as described above

Other Trade Opportunities and Diplomacy
Maintain current trades
Planning to trade away iron on T198 so we can build warrior MP
I will be looking for happiness resources since we want to grow CC up to pop 11 asap.
Reject "Stop Trade" demands
If we have an excess resource, unload it if we can get some cash
If we have an expired deal for (easiest to check on the F4-"Active" screen by mousing over deals) and they have more income, cancel and try to get more. AIs will normally trade all their excess income for a resource up to about 10 (or more)
Check if there are other deals that can be canceled/reevaluated.
Accept research demands of low cost (<300 ) techs from others
Reject other research demands (but will check with the team if at all possible before doing so)
I'mthinking we accept a demand to go to war with Izzy (but probably AI won't ask since we are at war?) Will reject other war demands

Espionage
Leave espionage on Willem until we get to see his research. Adjust allocation to maintain a view of his research, but put any excess towards Cathy.

Great People
Great Scientist builds academy in CC on T189.

City Builds
CC... I’m going suggest grow as fast as happiness allows. As long as we have happiness grow at max rate. Once we are at happiness cap, grow at max rate until we are 1 turn away from growing and then slow growth with mines, specialists (scientists first, only engineer if I have too)

Even at size 10 working four food resources, Gmine, Pmine and specialists we produce +3:food:. Plan before you get too close to a growth.

Okay with fur, silk (trade), we can have 9 happy pop in CC. With Silver we can have 11 pop. I think we can settle silver by T199. We can have Spice by T197. I think we can and should max grow CC. If we revolt on T198 I think this means a maximum of 1 unhappy citizen for maybe 1 turn. I still need to play test this, however

FH..T189 Fish and 3 coast GM
T190 2 pop whips galley, fish, GM, PM
T191 settler started fish, coast, GM, PM
T192 settler whipped
T193 courthouse, Fish, GM or coast to get FH to 4 pop to whip courthouse before T198


I think this extra galley and the settler a turn earlier will give me some flexibility Still working out the details.

SM... keeps fish and whips courthouse T191 when it grows to 4 pop, then starts workboat, builds wealth after workboat on T197, then starts warrior on T198 when we can safely give away iron

PC...starts catapult, switches to axe, 2 pop whips axe, finishes catapult, starts courthouse instead of the swordsman mabraham suggested it slow build (since I plan to give away iron on T198, I don’t think it will be able to finish a swordsman)

MC... continue Moai, then courthouse

BF... whips courthouse on T191 after growing to 6 pop, then starts worker, then wealth/warrior
FC... 2 pops granary T189 timed so it will have 17/36 food in bin the turn after granary is finished, then courthouse

GH... whips courthouse T189, workboat
SR... chop finishes T190, whip monastery T191 grow back to 2 T192, chop goes into missionary, switch to fish and Gmine on T190 to finish 1st missionary a bit earlier, run fish and Gmine on regrowth to 2 pop T192, start 2nd missionary and whip it if 1st missionary fails in CC, then granary. I still need to play test this.

First missionary due T195 per post 1707. I do not think New Galley has time to get Stevenson to FC.

London coming out of revolt on 3 pop whips granary immediately (I think it will be happy enough it will get our rep bonus). Then I think we could 3 pop whip a settler for the ivory site perhaps if the war effort is looking good. If not I think we whip a courthouse here and then maybe the forbidden palace if we can fit it in before the globe theater build is needed.

London can get a settler after the granary whip to the silver site by T200. Perhaps the settler from FH can go to the ivory site if the war effort is going well...

Work Boats
GH's workboat heads towards silver settling site

Workers
Strauss finishes chop into SR T190, moves SW roads T191-3, moves to spice builds plantation finishes T197, moves 3 past SR and workshops for 1 turn
Eiffel T189 chops, T190-1 roads, T192 chops forest into SR, T193 road finishes, builds plantation finishes T197, moves 3 past SR and workshops for 1 turn


Stevenson finishes chop T194, then... New Galley takes him FC to camp 2nd fur and chop


As above, I do not think there is time for this.

Hoover road plains hills, builds fort on silk if gets bored waiting for Ferry and the settler from FH. Taken over to Vicky's former lands with settler By T196-7? is there looking for work.

Yeltsin finishes chop T194 into Moai, then roads horses until border pop in MC (Moai will help with border pop I believe in time), then pastures the horses

OK and we need to plan for a road to these horses too.

New worker from BF on T196 (could be picked up by new galley proposal in FH and taken over to Vicky's lands after FH galley helps galley chain the settler over to PC and Ferry)
War Plans
Planning an attack on Nottingham on T194
Nottingham currently has 3 triremes (C1, 0xp,0xp) 1 galley, and an axe. The galley might be loaded with units.

Lurk with 3 triremes 3 tiles south of Nottingham and blockade on T193 only if necessary. I think we can take Nottingham on T193.

land incoming axe (promoted to combatI) and catapult (promoted to CRI) from PC can land on the grass on T190, then walk to hill on T191, bombard on T192. 2 swords (one combat 1 ~5.6/6.0) (one unpromoted until learn more 5.3/6.0), axe (combatI promoted ~4.5/5.0) healthy catapult and healthy CR1 Bomb Catapult can arrive on the hill T192. On T193 CR1 bomb catapult finishes the defenses. And depending on units I see in Nottingham I take the city T193 with the CRI catapult ( and healthy no xp catapult if necessary) to soften the target I think I can take Nottingham with slightly hurt units. If somehow Vicky reinforces the city then the units can wait a turn to get almost full health) and I can blockade on T193.

I'm planning on leaving the CR1 sword with 5/4 xp , wounded axe, catapult, and archer in London to heal.


If the battle goes well I plan take the experienced units to finish York

I want to take the catapult and axe we can have ready to move out of PC on T192, T193 respectively take a 2 or 3 galley chain protected by a single trireme out on a journey to the Iron fort to the east. This will arrive approximately T199-T200.

More details to come (still under construction) (Galleys will need serious attention again... I will need to practice and make screen shots for this...)

Trireme "La Couronne" lurk 3 south of Nottingham, then protects galleys ferrying troops to York area
Trireme "Paralus" lurk 3 south of Nottingham, then protects galleys ferrying troops to York area
Trireme "Salaminia"lurk 3 south of Nottingham, then protects galleys ferrying troops to York area

Trireme escorts Kon-Tiki taking 2nd set of axe/catapult from PC to eastern iron fort.

Trireme (GH) protects the homeland (moves over towards PC side just in case the lurking fleet needs reinforcements.

Galleys Ferry, helps galley chain 1st axe/catapult to Nottingham, then comes back and galley chains with galley from FH the settler and then picks up Hoover and galley chains them over to Vicky's land, then follows and helps move troops after Nottingham falls.
Argo

Kon-Tiki moves with trireme south, sets up for galley chain of 2nd pair of
Nautilus galley chains 1st pair of axe/catapult pair
Galley "New Galley" takes warrior on 3 tile island to Fish Hills, come back picks up stevenson and takes him to Furry Crabs, comes back towards SR island to pick up Yeltsin

Galley from FH helps galley chain over the settler, then comes and picks up worker built in BF on T196, hopeful galley chaining him over to Vicky's lands.

Stopping/Pausing Conditions

A barbarian spawns in an awkward position that I can't immediately deal with
AI declares war on us
war with Vicky goes badly
Could pause on T194 to assess the assault plan on Nottingham

Checklist every turn before hitting end turn
double check MM and whip timing for each city
check tech trades available
check if and what AI have researched from F4 screen
check for new/better resource trades
check espionage screen for large sabotage production values in all visible AI cities
check if any AI went into war prep mode
check for any barbarians
save the game

While scouting
will put a note that notes the most recent location of barbarians
will put a note that notes the most recent location of all AI units (except naval units)
 
I was playing with the test game, and if it is anything like the real game, the navy combat with Vicky is going to get fierce.

So the biggest problem, when I sent my trireme 3S of Nottingham, she followed with 2 trireme and blocked the galley from unloading the axe and catapult on the grassland to the south of Nottingham. Now we could unload 2 south of Nottingham instead, but in the test game she had an archer move into that location as well. So we were blocked from landing near Nottingham unless we attacked here trireme.

I tried various ways of luring the trireme away from that point.

This is one way that sort of worked. On T189 instead of going south, 2 trireme go 1S of the 1 tile island, La C hangs out 3S of Nottingham and the 4th trireme moves closer and the galleys flee south and other galleys galley chain the axe and catapult east.

With this arrangement, Vicky went 1E of the 2 trireme next to the island. The 2 trireme were then able to move around and join up with La C and the other trireme 2S of Nottingham. These 4 trireme protected the galley that unloaded the axe and archer. These trireme were attacked the next turn, but we have favorable odds on defense. So These trireme could retreat after their job is done, and the land units can take out Nottingham, hopefully killing any wounded trireme in the city.

Other possible changes discovered
-after FC whips the granary on T189. I think it should work the Plains forest so it can 1 pop whip the courthouse by T198
-on T191 BF might want to switch to worker before whipping the courthouse since it will lose the rep bonus and have at least 1 unhappy citizen.

I didn't get too far since I had so many difficulties with Vicky's triremes. I will try to get more details posted early tomorrow in about 10 hours. Hopefully setting up to play by Sunday morning ~36 hours from now.

screenshot shows the situation after vicky's triremes are lured west and then trireme met up with La C and other trireme.
 

Attachments

  • Civ4ScreenShot0091.JPG
    Civ4ScreenShot0091.JPG
    314.7 KB · Views: 64
I was playing with the test game, and if it is anything like the real game, the navy combat with Vicky is going to get fierce.

So the biggest problem, when I sent my trireme 3S of Nottingham, she followed with 2 trireme and blocked the galley from unloading the axe and catapult on the grassland to the south of Nottingham. Now we could unload 2 south of Nottingham instead, but in the test game she had an archer move into that location as well. So we were blocked from landing near Nottingham unless we attacked here trireme.

I tried various ways of luring the trireme away from that point.

This is one way that sort of worked. On T189 instead of going south, 2 trireme go 1S of the 1 tile island, La C hangs out 3S of Nottingham and the 4th trireme moves closer and the galleys flee south and other galleys galley chain the axe and catapult east.

With this arrangement, Vicky went 1E of the 2 trireme next to the island. The 2 trireme were then able to move around and join up with La C and the other trireme 2S of Nottingham. These 4 trireme protected the galley that unloaded the axe and archer. These trireme were attacked the next turn, but we have favorable odds on defense. So These trireme could retreat after their job is done, and the land units can take out Nottingham, hopefully killing any wounded trireme in the city.

Looks like a good strategem to me. Alternatively, we take all three triremes SW onto the loaded galley by end T189. Vicky can't see this tile, so that may set her triremes onto "don't chase mode" (I'll test this tomorrow) and so the unload tile will be free on T190. Then we we don't even have to offer combat on T190, either. I'm all up for killing trireme stacks in harbour in Nottingham... The worst-case scenario is that she does guess to occupy the tile and we have to unload the axe and cat one tile too far south on T190. Then she interposes a unit on the grassland south of Nottingham IBT T190-1 and those units could be out of time.

Other possible changes discovered
-after FC whips the granary on T189. I think it should work the Plains forest so it can 1 pop whip the courthouse by T198
-on T191 BF might want to switch to worker before whipping the courthouse since it will lose the rep bonus and have at least 1 unhappy citizen.

Sounds fine.

I didn't get too far since I had so many difficulties with Vicky's triremes. I will try to get more details posted early tomorrow in about 10 hours. Hopefully setting up to play by Sunday morning ~36 hours from now.

screenshot shows the situation after vicky's triremes are lured west and then trireme met up with La C and other trireme.

Thanks.
 
Okay played thru the test game to T198 and took notes.

Big events, vicky's triremes prevented me from sending Hoover and the settler through Nottingham or even landing them close by. I decided to send them instead to the ivory site.

Vicky got feudalism before I reached York

Cat/Axe sent to go for iron I think would be better off landing 3SW of York and walking in to attack York with stack that walks from London. (we are unlikely going to be able to get galleys safely into London to transport the them)
OR cat/axe don't try for the iron at all but instead add their trireme escort to trireme fleet so we can drop cat/axe and worker/settler near Nottingham instead of going around the other way.

There is the possibility of a ceasefire after we take Nottingham which might allow us to get past Vicky's trireme.

small changes
whipped a courthouse in BF a turn earlier than planned (we won't avoid losing the rep bonus either way, so might as well get the courthouse earlier)

MM details for those curious

I labeled the map with numbers so we can more easily track/plan the galleys as recommended by mabraham

T189
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
100% drama
GS--> academy in CC
CC 3N, CF, rest coast
FH switches coast to GMine
FC whip granary and switch coast to Plains forest (allows 1 pop whip of courthouse on T198)
GH whip courthouse
PC starts catapult

workers
all chop, except hoover roads Pmine

NG picks up warrior on SR island and moves back towards CC
Axe/Cat galley chain with Ferry & nautilus
2 trireme move 1S of island to west of Nottingham
La C stays put
other trireme joins La C
Argo and Kon-Tiki move to "7"

units move into London, except the CR1,ACC catapult who rests

workboat travels east
trireme near CC travels east over the north part of CC's island

PPP checklist


T190
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
100% drama

CC new pop uses coast
FH whips galley, switch to GM, PM, Fish
PC switches PMine to coast and switches to axe build
BF whips courthouse
FC starts courthouse
GH starts workboat
SR switches rice to Gmine

strauss chops forest into SR
Eiffel roads spice (delaying forest chop)
Hoover roads
Stevenson & Yeltsin cont chopping

Triremes met at "9" (1 blockades)
Naut remains at "9" after dropping off axe and catapult
F to 1
A & KT to 4
workboat and trireme continue to travel east
axe and catapult offloaded south of nottingham
Promote axe south of Nottingham to combat1

CR, ACC catapult rests
2 swords (one promo to C1), axe, 0 xp catapult moves towards Nottingham

Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research

checklist


T191
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
adjust research to just finish drama (calculate the OF)

FH starts settler
SM whips courthouse and switches to GMine, Fish
PC whips axe, switches to N, IM
BF worker started (1 unhappy)
SR whips monastery

Strauss moves and roads SW
Eiffel roads and stops
Hoover finishes road
others continue chopping

NG drop warrior off on CC island on its way to other warrior on 3 tile island (see 89,90,91,92, ... for path)
F 1 -> -2
A&KT 4 -> 1
Beta (new galley from FH) -> -7 (waits for warrior and settler from FH)

Trireme and Nautilus flee to 6 after likely combat with Vicky's triremes (hopefully vicky won't follow, but she did in test game and made life difficult later)

axe (C1) and catapult move to hill East of Nottingham
Trireme and workboat continue to move east
CR, ACC catapult,2 swords (one promo to C1), axe, 0 xp catapult moves towards Nottingham

Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research
PPP checklist


T192
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
calendar trade check, adjust research so we can trade drama for calendar start up next turn
CC all excess pop work coast
FH whips settler, works GMine, Fish
SM workboat, Fish, coast
PC IM, Pmine
SR missionary started, Fish, GMine

Strauss roads
Eiffel chops forest into SR
Yeltsin
Stevenson both chop
Hoover builds a fort and stops

Beta waits -7 (for warrior and settler)
NG picks up warrior from 3 tile island moves back towards SR via CC
F-->-4
A-->-1
KT waits at 1
N moves to 4a
Trireme fleet moves to 4a

Trireme and workboat continue to move east

catapult bombards Nottingham
CR, ACC catapult,2 swords (one promo to C1), axe, 0 xp catapult moves onto hill east of nottingham


Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research
PPP checklist


T193
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
trade for calendar
Philosophy at 100%
CC (slowing growth if no extra happiness found), 2 scientists, 3N, CF, 3coast, GM
FH starts courthouse works Fish and coast (should be able to grow to 4 by T199)
(Although a trireme might be in order here if naval battle with Vicky went against us)
SM Coast and Fish
PC 2 Clams
MC citizen to finish Moai

Eiffel road
Strauss road
Yeltsin & Stevenson chop into MC
Hoover boards Argo

CR1 ACC catapult bombards Nottingham.
CR1 catapult attacks nottingham
use best judgement if 0 xp catapult is needed
finish units off with best odd units

NG unloads warrior into CC (will walk over to FH)
Beta -> -4 with settler & warrior (galley changes settler but keep warrior --destined for BF)
F -4 -> -1 with settler
A -1 -> 2 (gets settler and picks up Hoover as it passes thru PC)
KT --> 4a (with axe and catapult)
1 Trireme and Nautilus 4a --> 7a with axe and catapult ***

***There is an option here to take the axe and catapult straight to Nottingham if Vicky's triremes are not scary. The axe and catapult are not going to make it to the iron before I think we can attack York, so I recommend we try to either take them to Nottingham area under multiple trireme protection or take the southern route and offload them 3SW of York

Could explore a ceasefire with Vicky if things go well. This would allow us to get settler and axe and catapult into the fight at York the fastest I think.

Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research
PPP checklist


T194
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
Philosophy at 100%

CC 3N, CF, GM, PM, 2sci, eng (slowing growth)
MC starts courthouse, switch citizen back to coast
SR starts missionary (careful here!! don't let it just switch auto to granary)
check BF with warrior's arrival

Strauss& Eiffel build plantation on spice
Yeltsin roads horse stops
Stevenson boards NG this turn
Hoover is on a boat

Beta-->BF2 w/ warrior destined for BF


F-->2
NG picks up stevenson and waits for missionary to walk on next turn.
Trireme and workboat continue to move east
Other naval movements depend whether or not we took a ceasefire and the route we might have taken

*** healthy units walk to London, use judgement whether to leave in Nottingham to heal or walk over.

Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research
PPP checklist


T195
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
Philosophy at 100%
CC 3N, CF, GM, PM, 2sci, eng
MC works coast instead of Marble?

Beta to BF1 (warrior offloads to BF and does help with 1 unhappy citizen)
NG missionary loads and heads towards CC with stevenson and missionary

Rest of the fleet?
*** healthy units walk to London, use judgement whether to leave in Nottingham to heal or walk over.

Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research
PPP checklist


T196
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
Philosophy at 100%

CC 1 unhappy, max growth
FH 2 coast and fish
BF spy--> coast
London whips granary with no delay

Yeltsin pastures horses
others traveling or plantation

NG missionary spreads taoism in CC, takes stevenson north to FC
Beta picks up worker from BF and drops him into SM for workshopping, beta moves 1NE of SM

Rest of the fleet?
*** healthy units walk to London, use judgement whether to leave in Nottingham to heal or walk over.

*** (axe and catapult could land 3 SW of York this turn if we went this way)
Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research
PPP checklist


T197
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
100% philosophy (should finish most likely end of this turn)

CC 3N, CF, 4 coast, GM, PM (with spices this turn it is happy again)
PC coast instead of PMine
London starts settler

Yeltsin pastures horses
spice plantation finishes
workshop started near SM
others traveling

NG drops off Stevenson on plains forest near FC
Rest of the fleet?
*** healthy units walk to London, use judgement whether to leave in Nottingham to heal or walk over.

Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research
PPP checklist


T198
Spoiler :
go to F5 and check barb and Vick units to make sure I don't miss something
end turn
planned trade away of iron
several whips set up, still might want to delay civic changes until T199
Check espionage on Willem and adjust if have view of research
PPP checklist


Okay I've attached a testgame save, but it isn't quite the same as the above MM details. Almost everything is as it would be in the above plan, but I didn't go back and fix a few mistakes.
-the axe catapult south of vicky's lands went too far and just ended up protecting the ivory site (these units could walk in to York and ready to attack T199 I believe)
-FH worked Gmine when I didn't want it to, so is slow to grow back to 4
-granary in SR has a few more hammers since I forgot to switch to the missionary (and added hammers there with worldbuilding to fix my mistake)

screenshots don't necessary show the galleys and trireme in the right location, but they have the labels and the planned route for New Galley (NG)
 

Attachments

  • sgotm test T198 AD-0370 .CivBeyondSwordSave
    251.3 KB · Views: 31
  • Civ4ScreenShot0092.JPG
    Civ4ScreenShot0092.JPG
    299 KB · Views: 43
  • Civ4ScreenShot0093.JPG
    Civ4ScreenShot0093.JPG
    306.2 KB · Views: 40
We may get a Great General this turn. What will we do with it?

I played through the test game with the plan. Here are some comments

T189
You didn't mention this but don't promote the heavily injured sword in London, he has time to heal on his own.

T190
CR1 Acc cat joins the stack.
Not sure why we are promoting a sword to C1 when there is a 3XP axe with the stack. Promote sword when combat looms.

T192
Queue both SR missionaries now, rather than risk working on the granary

T193
Agree FH trireme if needed
I tried the plan of the SW walk to York, as well as an early move on York. Basically I took any plausible stack as soon as I could. The lake 2N of York is good cover. Despite her getting three longbows, I was able to use all the cats (1 survived) and every unit we had except an axe in London to kill all but one unit in York on T198 or T199 (I forget which). So I think this is good news for the real game, except that she has Theocracy in the real game...
I would probably work no coasts in CC now.
With injured triremes, don't go back to our culture if healing in place is plausible. 6 turns to heal in place is better than three turns there, heal, three turns back.

T194
I guess we'll work the horse pasture, so Yeltsin may as well move there and start the road. Switch to pasture ASAP. Alternative is to road the dye, which we should do if we're not going to work the pasture ASAP.
MC works coast rather than marble (1:food:1:commerce: > 2:hammers: there right now)

T195
BF worker is a touch early, because the jungle near BF has only one turn left to clear (check in real game). Suggest move him onto Beta and dump him in SM. The tile 1N of SM has a few turns of workshop already complete on it.
If we're settling the silver soon, consider sending a defogging unit that way.

T196
Now and all future turns, check all cities to turn off damn spies!
Grow CC if the spice next turn will make us happy again
If we're settling the silver soon, consider sending a defogging unit that way.

T197
Eiffel and Strauss workshop 1N of SR, then wake them up and reconsider next turn.

T198
Eiffel and Strauss workshop 1N of SR, then wake them up and reconsider next turn.
If we are moving a settler to the silver on this turn, stay on the eastern coast, to defog the ice-silver before moving onto the tundra-silver.
 
We may get a Great General this turn. What will we do with it?
I think we make a super medic with it. combat1, medic1 foresterIII


I played through the test game with the plan. Here are some comments

T189
You didn't mention this but don't promote the heavily injured sword in London, he has time to heal on his own.

I won't

T190
CR1 Acc cat joins the stack.
Not sure why we are promoting a sword to C1 when there is a 3XP axe with the stack. Promote sword when combat looms.

okay I will only promote if there is any threat of attack by multiple units

T192
Queue both SR missionaries now, rather than risk working on the granary

sure good idea

T193
Agree FH trireme if needed
I tried the plan of the SW walk to York, as well as an early move on York. Basically I took any plausible stack as soon as I could. The lake 2N of York is good cover. Despite her getting three longbows, I was able to use all the cats (1 survived) and every unit we had except an axe in London to kill all but one unit in York on T198 or T199 (I forget which). So I think this is good news for the real game, except that she has Theocracy in the real game...
I would probably work no coasts in CC now.
With injured triremes, don't go back to our culture if healing in place is plausible. 6 turns to heal in place is better than three turns there, heal, three turns back.
I think it is worth growing CC into 1 unhappiness on T196 and working a few coasts.
I want to flee with triremes so vicky doesn't follow us. Assuming they don't have protection duties.



T194
I guess we'll work the horse pasture, so Yeltsin may as well move there and start the road. Switch to pasture ASAP. Alternative is to road the dye, which we should do if we're not going to work the pasture ASAP.
MC works coast rather than marble (1:food:1:commerce: > 2:hammers: there right now)

okay work coast in MC, the pasture is in the plan

T195
BF worker is a touch early, because the jungle near BF has only one turn left to clear (check in real game). Suggest move him onto Beta and dump him in SM. The tile 1N of SM has a few turns of workshop already complete on it.
If we're settling the silver soon, consider sending a defogging unit that way.

the SM dump of the worker is in the plan sorry if it wasn't clear

Noted silver defogging suggestion, assuming we don't need unit for protection or suicide on longbows.


T196
Now and all future turns, check all cities to turn off damn spies!
Grow CC if the spice next turn will make us happy again
If we're settling the silver soon, consider sending a defogging unit that way.

spies comment noted, CC growth plan is to grow into unahppiness this turn and max growth with expectation of more happiness from several different sources (religion, silver?, ivory? other trades) Will have some time during revolts to get this happiness on line.

T197
Eiffel and Strauss workshop 1N of SR, then wake them up and reconsider next turn.

error here, they are ready to do this T198
T198
Eiffel and Strauss workshop 1N of SR, then wake them up and reconsider next turn.
If we are moving a settler to the silver on this turn, stay on the eastern coast, to defog the ice-silver before moving onto the tundra-silver.
defogging detail noted
 
I could play tonight if there is agreement.

I'm hoping to play out to T193 tonight if at all possible, so that we can pause and discuss options for the assault on York. Ceasefire is a strong option, and we will have to decide how to send the units if no ceasefire is possible.

Otherwise I hope to play in about 24 hours.
 
Top Bottom