RBTS5 - Multiple Personality Disorder

Ok, then. I will pick this up tonight.

Another quiet set. Seeing as we're Philo, we got another GS on turn 2 of my set. Alpha's still no good to us, so I sent him to Barcelona for another Academy (and hired a scientist). Another GMan due in 9: 59% and rising for a GS.

Trained units and whipped a couple of Baray (Madrid and Ondini). Had some at Madrid when I put a couple of turns into a Settler, instead of focusing on Baray-Hanging Gardens

Japan is settling his southern lands (one more city on the way in my set) and he's built walls in Satsuma. Construction has just completed so a couple of cats are lined up and can be whipped soon for 2 pop.

Brought on worker back to the capital for HG chopping. The other is chopping a forest that will be settled on, and then he too can return to the mainland. We can go island hopping:




So a WB is on the way to do so.

Alpha selected as next tech, but no beakers invested yet. It would allow a Philo LB (assuming we get another GS).

lurker comment

Sullla - it sounds like he (sunrise) buried himself because he is missing in our "DMI VIII - The War of Wrath" SG as well. Imhotep said that he received a mail about sunrise leaving our SG... Maybe he just doesn't have the time.

@Winth, and everyone else - Sorry about that. No, I'm not dropping this game, I have however been out of state at a wedding for the past several days. I checked the rosters before I left, but I forgot that Sullla reserved the right to mix up our roster.

As far as my activity level - I can just keep my head about water with work, school, multiplayer commitments, RBTS5, SGOTM 5, and the Apolyton Demogame.....wow. Sadly, the DMI VIII game was my last joined, and I though it would just play out a little different than it has - in order for me to submit quality turn reports there I would have had to go over the limit of my available time.

All that said, Winth does bring up an appealing point about dropping everything - at least then I could play some RB Epics and Adventures for a change.

Ok I'll pick this up tomorrow.

What're our current goals? Any particular techs? Building more cats for the inevitable war with Japan? Settling more? (if there's space)

I would love to go to war against Japan. Better earlier then latter imo as time is needed to rebuild a conquered empire.

Remove a scientist from Madrid for extra hammers for HG.

Stick with Alphabet



Notice a yellow border SW of Lisbon, should be able to make contact if we send a boat as far as possible.

Toku declares in 595AD and sends an unimpressive stack of 3 swords and an archer.

I attack it with 3 axes, killing an archer and 2 swordsmen. I leave the last swordsman alone because I don’t want to leave units in the open.

Meet Peter with the work boat to the NW, he’s considerably ahead on cities and tech.

Meet Ramesses a few turns later. Both of them need CoL. I give it to Ram for Monarchy + gold. Peter currently isn’t offering a worthwhile deal so I keep it from him.

After Alphabet comes in 1 turn before the end of my turnset I think what to go for next. In my opinion it’s a toss up between Calendar and Currency. I choose the former because we have quite a few resources to hook up.

Toku is already willing to do us a peace deal. He wants Priesthood for it though. Techwise, he has Calendar and Archery, but lacks Priesthood, Alphabet and Construction.

I note that Ramesses only had 4 cities. We’ll want to settle the spot next to Lisbon ASAP.

And the turns are over….Toku made no further incursions and we lost nothing. He does have horses connected, but no HBR.

We complete HG next turn.

p.s. sorry I forgot to save some screenshots so you'll just have to imagine it!

Wow, what busy turns! We found two new civs, traded some techs, and found ourselves at war with Tokugawa. Good stuff from Dantski.

I agree with not trading away Code of Laws to Peter until we can get something worthwhile for it. We're going to pop another Great Person in Madrid shortly; if it's a Great Scientist, we can lightbulb Philosophy and open up some more deals. I think Calendar is a good call for now on the tech front, since we can finish it in 10 turns (the same length of time until our next swap!) After that, I'd probably recommend going for Literature and trying to land the Great Library in Madrid. That would be big if we could pull it off, since we're already in Representation and have an Academy there.

I'm a little worried about Peter's size and teching... but if we can take out Tokugawa, we'll have a large continent all to ourselves. That should all us to be more than competitive, even on Emperor. As far as the military side of things goes, I'm liking our situation right now. We took Japan's sucker-punch without any losses, and stand poised to counterattack. The window where the AI lacks Feudalism for longbows is a nice time to attack!



I'm totally unimpressed by Toku's border city defense. We should be able to land at least one city off of him in this war, if not more. I say we go on the offensive, and see how much we can get.

Remember, only TEN more turns until we swap civs again. If you want to get a Baray in cities that lack them, be sure to do it ASAP. Have fun with the turns, Archduke.

Sullla <<< on deck
sunrise089
Swiss Pauli
Dantski
TheArchduke <<< UP NOW

Sullla said:

I'd probably recommend going for Literature and trying to land the Great Library in Madrid

Click to expand...

Not sure if this is possible, I remember Peter has Aesthetics already (maybe Lit too) and could easily end up building GL in the next set of turns as our WB revealed marble (currently unconnected).

Dantski said:

Meet Peter with the work boat to the NW, he’s considerably ahead on cities and tech.

Click to expand...

You would think a philo civ would have a great edge in this game, what with the GPP counter reseting all the time.

Darrell

Things look good, I decide to pay Toku a visit and raze Satsuma. We should establish a channel city there really.

I whip a Baray in Oporto and our two other cities on our main continent, our colony doesn´t manage it in time.

*Picture*

Around 745 AD we meet Darius who is seriously ahead in tech. Not good.
We pop a Great Prophet and without much ado, I establish our first shrine, giving our economy a much needed boost.

I raze Satsuma though with a bit higher looses then I expected. About 3 axeman bite the dust. Our forces are too depleted to press on but watch over the remains of Satsuma.
I loose an axe at 95 % odds against an archer on open field - Screw my bad luck! - soon later.

At the end of my turn Calendar comes in and our two settlers finish construction.

One is at the site of Satsuma and should found a city 1 East of the Rice so we get all the ressources and establish a channel.
Another settler sits in the boat of the island and can establish another city there.

I propose we peace Toku now and establish a bigger army soon now that we cut his empire in two. He got measly defenses but those city defense protective archers still hurt on hills, so I didn´t go for Tokyo.

Is that peace just after the swap or just before the swap. 'Before' would make a nice 'no war negatives' exploit.

TheArchduke said:

We pop a Great Prophet and without much ado, I establish our first shrine, giving our economy a much needed boost.

Click to expand...

It's too bad you didn't get a GS...a Philosophy lightbulb would have solved your tech situation.

Darrell

I agree with Darrell, it's too bad we didn't land another Great Scientist. Oh well, them's the breaks after all. I'm not sure it was worth it to raze Satsuma just for the benefit of establishing a canal city; I probably would have kept the city along with whatever infrastructure it had in place. At least we have a settler ready to replace it.

I'm probably going to have to wait until tomorrow to get to this one. Any suggestions that you'd like to make before then are appreciated. We could, umm, use some help as far as dealing with Darius and Peter.

Normally I agree, but I could be wrong but Tokuwaga is saved under "no building of infrastructure whatsoever". I could be wrong.

There is no way in hell, I would raze a Malinese or a Carthagian one, for instance.

Just be sure to use the two settlers and then decide if we press onwards or make peace and rebuild a bit.

(0) 835AD The first thing I note is that TheArchduke actually only played 9 turns, not 10 on his turnset. Whoops! Well, I'll play 11 then to get us back on track. That means one final turn here before making the swap, interesting...

First things first. What tech to we pursue next? I'd still like to see us land the Great Library in Madrid, and I think we have a shot at it. We can trade Code of Laws for Aesthetics, and at 18 shields/turn (plus chopping) can knock out the wonder in as little as 20-25 turns. Faster than that if we go for Civil Service next and Bureaucracy. Peter's marble is on an offshore island, and with no workers over there, it'll be a while before he can hook it up. Plus, Darius and Ramesses are refusing to trade Aesthetics, suggesting that they're woking on the wonders located at that tech. If they're building THOSE wonders, they probably aren't building the Great Library, at least not yet. Maybe it's silly, but I think we can get this wonder, and I think the attempt is worth it, with a capital containing an Academy and Representation.

So... Code of Laws to Peter for Aesthetics. Ramesses has Literature, Peter has Literature and Drama. Interesting, Darius lacks anything beyond Aesthetics (hey, at least we've not quite as behind in that area!)

Militarily, I'd sure like to capture Nagoya from Tokugawa before signing peace. He has an iron source there that we could really use, plus it would divide his territory even further. I wonder how well defended those southern cities are (?) I think we have enough forces on hand to grab another city, but it depends on what Toku is packing down there. We're also one victory away from a Great General, so I'll see if I can manage to win a battle on this interturn.

We still only have FOUR workers! That's definitely not enough. I'll try and remedy that on my turn. Cities everywhere are configured to max commerce on this last turn before the swap. I also whip a courthouse in Madrid to take advantage of the "free" whip unhappiness.

(1) 850AD As I planned, we defend on the interturn and kill a Japanese chariot with our spearman. (Unfortunately, we also lose an axe in a coinflip battle.) This produces a Great General for our civ! I mop up some of the other Japanese stragglers with our chariots:



Chariots are so much more useful with that attack bonus against axes. I know, I know - that's not exactly a recent change! But when you played as many games as I did back before this game was even released, getting used to the new things can be hard!

OK, everything looks good. Time to make the swap. I roll our leader and get... Wang Kon. Hmm. Although Protective isn't likely to be much of a help, Financial never hurts. We've got a lot of coastal cities, so we should be able to get some good value there. Now for the civ... we pull Rome! Wow, that's a nice fit for us right now. Let's get some Praetorians going... but wait, we don't have any iron! Argh!

Capturing Nagoya, the Japanese city with iron, just went up several priority levels!

As usual, I go through our cities and reconfigure them after the swap. The top priority is to max food in all cities, since the food box empties completely after making the civ swap. This means stripping specialists all over the place, temporarily of course. (Man, the AI absolutely LOVES those crummy spy specialists. Keep an eye on the governors!) We're going to be rather low on production for the immediate future as well - par for the course. Economically, we're now in pretty good shape, researching at a sustainable deficit at 70% science, a little over 100 beakers/turn. We can support more cities economically, so let's go conquer some from Japan! Gotta get that iron, baby!

Our civ after the changeover:



I also founded red dot on the southern island (now named "Rome", in humorous fashion!) and sign Open Borders deals with Peter and Ramesses. Why not, we can use the trade route income. (They're bigger than us, so this kind of deal is actually to our advantage!)

(2) 860AD We lose an axe between turns to a Japanese sword in another coinflip battle. I take out the sword on the following turn, but these kind of losses are not to our advantage. We need to do better than 1:1, obviously...

Found Antium on our desired spot:



Now we've got a good view into Nagoya, if nothing else. A little culturally crowded in this region, if I do say so. We also need to set one city onto missionary duty soon, and just keep spamming Christian missionaries into all our cities lacking them. Oporto might be a good location for that; I think I'll try and begin setting that up right now.

(3) 870AD Seriously, how the hell does the AI do this? Toku goes from having 3 units in Nagoya last turn, to SEVEN units there this turn. Man, sometimes I really miss the old AI that wouldn't go whip crazy when threatened... Well, that might put an end to this war right there. I'll wait another turn and see what they do.

I decided to merge the Great General into Madrid as a super-specialist. That seems more valuable to me long-term than creating a beefed up unit at this point. Maybe use the next one on a Medic III chariot (?) Note that units coming out of Madrid now start at 8XP, thanks to barracks + Ikhanda + Great General specialist.

(5) 890AD Literature discovered, I start us pursuing Civil Service. Never a bad way to go, cliched as it may be in this game. Madrid starts the Great Library, let's cross our fingers on getting it! The only one who can trade for Literature is Darius, and he won't give us anything but Monotheism for it. That's definitely not worth it, so I hold off on the deal for now.

The Japanese are massing for an attack on Antium:



They're coming to us, so we should have good odds here. Let's hope for no wild dice streaks!

(6) 900AD Ha! We clean up!

Axe kills sword.
Spear kills chariot.
Spear kills chariot.
Spear retreats chariot (darn!)
Catapult kills axe (!?) We'll take it!

Four kills and ZERO losses. Time to heal up the survivors for a couple turns, then push on to Nagoya with the axe reinforcements heading from Ondini and kwaDuzka!

One potential MAJOR issue for future turnsets: when we did the civ swap, Toku stopped being willing to sign peace with us. He's back to the "refuses to talk" stage of warfare. This isn't a big deal at the moment, but it could be HUGE in future rounds. Please bear this in mind.

(7-9) Quiet turns, reinforcements on the way.

(10) 940AD Our stack moves out against Toku. At the same time, he has a mini-stack heading into our territory in the north:



Nothing I'm overly worried about, but there's been some minor whipping of units to be safe.

(11) 950AD I kill the chariot threatening kwaDuzka and whip an archer out of caution. With a City Garrison III Protective archer defending, behind 40% cultural defenses, I think we're safe there. Monster stack moves next to Nagoya in the south.

So... our stack is sitting outside Nagoya. That's the end of my turnset. I mean, I played 11 turns already, taking another turn would just be wrong, right? Right?

Must... resist... temptation...

Screw it, I've got to play ONE MORE TURN! Nagoya must fall!

(12) 960AD Toku reinforced the city between turns with a couple more units. But he's still far from having enough to cope with our stack. Let's roll!

Bombard the city with one of our Accuracy cats (defenses down to 4%).
City Raider catapult dies.
Accuracy cat "retreats" (actually won the battle).
City Raider axe dies against axe.
City Raider axe kills archer.
Melee axe kills chariot.
Combat I axe kills sword.
Combat I axe kills spear.
Chariot kills crippled archer.
Spearman kills crippled axe.

And that's it - we take the city!



I immediately stop my turn here, since I've played far enough already. We will have IRON as soon as Nagoya comes out of resistance. I suggest making peace with Toku for now (he'll give us his 40g, if nothing else) since he has two units wandering around in our territory. We can rest for a dozen turns or so, build some PRAETORIANS, and come back for another offensive. Toku still lacks Feudalism, so...

New picture of our territory!



Things are looking up! Don't forget to chop those forests for the Great Library. I'd recommend having Oporto crank missionaries for a little while, since it's a low-potential site that's not good for much else (and we can really use those missionaries for shrine income + free border expansions.) And try to sneak in some more workers while you're at it - I wasn't able to build any on my round. (D'oh!)

http://www.garath.net/Sullla/Civ4/SG/RBTS5/RBTS5-AD-960.zip

Sullla
sunrise089 <<< UP NOW
Swiss Pauli <<< on deck
Dantski
TheArchduke

Lead us on to victory. Let's get some of those legions going!

Sullla said:

I'm not sure it was worth it to raze Satsuma just for the benefit of establishing a canal city; I probably would have kept the city along with whatever infrastructure it had in place.

Click to expand...

There is always the possiblity of using a Fort for the canal, although that grassland tile would be more productive with a Cottage . From the screenshot you know for sure it had a Lighthouse and six population, so it would probably be better to keep it and lose the grassland tile. Without zooming in on the city you can't say for sure if there was a Granary or Barracks .

Edit: Pretty neat Sulla was able to squeeze in two very long post in the time it took me to type this short reply. I think that gives a clue on how he prepares his detailed turn reports .

Darrell

darrelljs said:

Edit: Pretty neat Sulla was able to squeeze in two very long post in the time it took me to type this short reply. I think that gives a clue on how he prepares his detailed turn reports

Click to expand...

Yep, yep. Cut-and-paste is your friend.

Sullla said:

Yep, yep. Cut-and-paste is your friend.

Click to expand...

I see I am not the only person to do that.