GOTM23 Succession Game [PTW]

Sounds like a plan

Anything that gets us to Ansars has to be a good thing.


Ted

By the way, I normally keep a summary journal of each game I play, here's ours so far:

Ancient Ages Recap – SG GOTM 23

Science:
Starting tech Pottery
Starting tech Ceremonial Burial
Trade with Persia (2550 BC) for The Wheel
Hut (3050 BC) for Alphabet
Trade with Spain (1790 BC) for Writing
Philosophy (1500 BC)
Code of Laws (1200 BC)
The Republic (310 BC)
Mysticism (3000 BC)
Trade with India (775 BC) for Polytheism
Hut (3300 BC) for Warrior Code
Monarchy
Trade with India (1500 BC) Horseback Riding
Trade with Persia (3350 BC) for Bronze Working
Hut (2630 BC) for Iron Working
Trade with Persia (470 BC) for Literature
Trade with Egypt (1225 BC) Map Making
Trade with Egypt (3400 BC) for Masonry
Trade with Persia (1500 BC) Mathematics
Trade with Carthage (470 BC) for Currency
Trade with Spain (470 BC) for Construction

City History:
Mekkah (3950 BC)
Medinah (2510 BC)
Diriyah (2150 BC)
Damascus (1910 BC)
Baghdad (1625 BC)
Ridyah (1450 BC)
Jeddah (1425 BC)
Dhahran (1275 BC)
Najran (875 BC)
Kufah (850 BC)
Alexmanistan (470 BC)
Snaga (330 BC)

Military Conquests:
Pasargdae autorazed in 450 BC
Persepolis captured in 390 BC
Bactra autorazed in 370 BC
Tarsus razed in 310 BC
Susa captured in 270 BC
Arbela razed in 230 BC
Antioch ceded in Peace Treaty in 230 BC

Contacts:
Persia in 3450 BC embassy in 1000 BC
Egypt in 3400 BC
Ottoman in 3050 BC embassy in 670 BC
Zulu in 2900 BC
Carthage in 2750 BC
France in 2750 BC
India in 2430 BC
Spain in 2030 BC
Rome in 1450 BC

Wonder building:
Oracle – Zulu - Zimbabwe
Hanging Gardens
Pyramids – France - Paris
Great Library – Romans - Rome
Great Lighthouse – Egypt - Memphis
Colossus – Egypt - Colossus
Great Wall – Ottoman - Sogut

Here is the save


Turn 0 – 30 AD – Wake 2 veteran Swordsmen in Persepolis and send to Gordium – Wake veteran Swordsman guarding Arbela’s ruins and send to Gordium – Wake Veteran and hook up with Arbela’s sword – Wake Anjar Veteran Sword and send to Gordium – Upgrade Warrior1 to Azap – Wake vet Sword & Horse in desert and send to Baghdad – Reset preferences to personal choices
Trade review:
Could get Peace with Ottoman & Persia, but not ready – Zulu won’t talk yet – Republic to Monarchy +$ deals are available – up to 20% luxury to keep Medinah happy - BTW Spain likes us!! - Maybe next turn – ok here we go again

IBT – Spanish troops keep moving through our territory – Hannibal comes calling wants WM swap if we throw in Feudalism, I don’t think so, we swap TM – Egypt/France/Carthage units move through our lands - Spearman with settler defend against BH attack (4/4) – Damascus builds Pikeman starts temple – Riyadh builds Pikeman starts temple

Turn 1 – 50 AD – Wake Riyadh Vet Sword and send to Konya – Pikeman MP in Ridyah – Wake spearman in Riyadh and send to Medinah – move workers to irrigate Medinah goats – Warrior1 heads to Konya – Azap S of Dinyah heads for Konya – Wake Damascus Sword and send to Dahran – Fortify Pike in Damascus – Workers chop forest for Baghdad – Baghdad sent toward Mekkah with sword trailing – Vet Sword defeats Vet Archer (1/4) – Vet Horse defeats Reg Archer and is promoted to elite (3/5) – Vet Horse defeats Reg Archer (1/4) and no Ottoman troops are visible – remaining horse joins Azap
Trade check:
Egypt +Mono/Monarchy (8g) annoyed – swap TM
Rome +Mono/Eng/Monarchy (28g) cautious – swap TM
India +Monarchy (11g) annoyed – swap TM
Zulu won’t talk
Persia even on tech, will trade for peace, but why
France +Monarchy (70g) polite – swap TM
Spain even on tech polite – trades possible – trade TM
Ottoman at war – peace possible but I think we do better

All cities ok – time to move on

IBT – Spain & France move through – Ottoman comes calling – no deals yet, a couple of Zulu troops show up – Medinah completes Pikeman starts temple – Baghdad complete pikeman starts horseman – Kufah completes horseman starts another – Zulu have 2 Impi & 1 horseman

Turn 2 – 70 AD – Send Azap to Kufah – Send horseman to Damascus – Medinah Sword sent to Konya – Medina Pike MP – Azap & horse reach Konya – Sword & 2 horse return to Dharan to heal – Baghdad Pike MP – wake 1 Baghdad spear and send to Aleximanistan – Gang of 4 swords heading for Gordium join horse & sword going the same way – workers irrigate for Najran – another horse reaches Konya – road from Persepolis to Antioch begins
Trade Check – possible Carthage & Spain Republic deals – all else the same

IBT – Lots more troops passing through – looks like the Zulu are interested in Kufah – Dinyah completes Horseman starts temple – France starts Sun Tzu’s – France start Hanging Gardens

Turn 3 – 90 AD – 2 horses reach Damascus – workers flee from Zulu – Warrior1 sent to Kufah – Spearman MP in Medinah – Sword & horse heal in Dahran – workers with escort move to Najran – sword reaches Mekkah – wake workers building road to flee BH – Spear/Settler reach home on the Oasis hill – Veteran Horse wins attacking Vet Impi and is promoted to Elite (5/5) – Veteran Azap kills Vet Horse (2/4) – Spearman reaches Aleximanistan MP – Sword from A-town leaves to barb hunt – Veteran Azap kills Veteran Horse in Konya and it autorazes – not enough to convince Ottoman yet horses head for Antalya – swords to Urskador
Trade Check: No changes – Republic trades still there
Need to hire a clown in Persepolis – Checked by moving slider to max we can afford we get Monotheism in 26 turns instead of 28 – need for 20% luxuries is hurting

IBT A Spanish sword kills threatening BH – Impi attacks Azap and loses, Azap promoted to elite (2/5) – Makkah builds Azap – starts another

Turn 4 – 110 AD horses sent to Dharan then on to Antalya – foot troops to Urskador – Settler founds Fustat starts temple Spearman MP in Fustat
Trade Check: Peace with Zulu (no extras either way) – Trade Republic to Spain for Worker + 80g + WM – Peace with Ottoman getting Monotheism + WM + 21g – Trade Republic to Carthage for Monarchy + WM
Research Chivalry – able to hire clown in Medina and lower lux slider – Chivalry now due in 17 – Bank 245 (-9gpt) – with peace switch Azap & Pike to Horseman – also switch walls to temple

All in all a pretty good turn

IBT
More foreign units (lots of settlers) heading east – Xerxes asks for peace – but I refuse – Damascus builds temple starts horseman – Dhranan builds a horseman starts another

Turn 5 – 130 AD – Who’s next is the question? After looking at who doesn’t like us and the military strength – the winner is Egypt – Foot troops heading for Byblos & Asyut – mounted for Lisht & Avaris
Trade Check:
Swap TM with Egypt (annoyed tech even, 39g)
Swap TM with Rome (annoyed +eng, 2g)
Swap TM with India (annoyed –Mono, 3g)
Swap TM with Zulu (furious even, 10g)
Swap TM with France (polite –Mono, 30g)
Trade Silks + Spices to Carthage (polite –Mono/Eng/Feudal) for Dyes
Trade TM with Ottoman (furious even, 0g)
Trade TM with Spain (polite –Monarchy/Mono/Feudal, 0g)

IBT
Spanish Sword kills BH – Spain & Ottoman sign peace – Persia moves troops to cut off assault force – Medinah builds temple starts horseman (fire clown) – Baghdad builds horseman starts another – Carthage building Hanging Gardens

Turn 6 – 150 AD – Swordsman kills BW and disperse village – Vet Sword kills Reg Archer (1/4)
Trade Check:
Zulu & France now +eng – no other changes

IBT
Lots of settlers moving and BW dies attacking French spearman – Mekkah builds Settler starts pikeman – Zulu building Hanging Garden

Turn 7 – 170 AD – Troops move on assigned path – settler sent to old Konya spot – Spearman escorting 4 workers roading to new site – Horseman kills Persian Archer (3/4) – Attack force in place (final Persian turn)
Trade Check:
Egypt/India now with Eng
Trade Monotheism + WM + 25g to Spain for Engineering

IBT – A couple of Zulu move into territory (3 impi & 2 archers) – Diriyah builds temple starts pikeman – Palace Expansion # 4 – Ottomans building Hanging Gardens

Turn 8 – 190 AD – move pikeman & warrior to Kurfa (to greet Zulu in case) – Vet Swordsman loses attack on Vet Spear (1/4) – Vet Swordsman loses attack on Reg Spear (3/3) – Vet Swordsman kills Reg Spear) – Vet Horseman kills final spear and Gordium is ours and Persia is gone – 6 foot in place & 7 on the way – 7 horse in place and 2 on the way
Trade check:
No changes – not happy with Zulu troops – 16 turns left on peace, let’s see what happens now.

IBT
Settlers keep heading east – Zulu move around cities, but nothing bad (yet!!) – Damascus completes horseman starts pikeman – Damascus has border expansion – Baghdad builds horseman starts another – Riyadh builds temple starts horseman – Jeddah completes horseman starts temple – Alexmanistan completes horseman starts temple – Palace Expansion # 5

Turn 9 – 210 AD – Divert 4 ground units (2 swords/1 pike/1 Azap) to welcome Zulus – Jeddah horse sent to Damascus – Damascus horse MP – A-town horse moves to cover workers – Baghdad horse moves to cover workers – Wounded Gordium liberators heal in town – Gordium horse sent to Antioch – Warrior3 moves to Riyadh
Trade Check:
No changes – We’re the richest – even (or better) on tech with all

IBT
No real action just lots of troops moving – I don’t like the what the Zulu is up to – Makkah builds Pikeman starts another – Medinah builds Horseman starts pikeman border expansion- Dhranan builds horseman starts another – Khurasan builds Barracks starts pikeman – Carthage building Sun Tzu – Spain building Sun Tzu

Turn 10 – 230 AD – Well it’s looks like I made it – we’re at peace (for not much longer I bet) – Chivalry is due in 15 turns – were even on tech – have 16 vet horsemen ready to become Ansar Warriors (if we can find the bucks) – Makkah pikeman MP – Medinah horse to Makkah – Zulu welcoming party fortifies on iron – road to new city site is done. Rome has a settler next to spot (I hope he doesn’t steal it) – Swordsman reaches Furstat
Final Trade Check:
Egypt – Annoyed – 14g – even on tech – swap TM - Republic
Rome – Annoyed – 47g – even on tech – swap TM - Monarchy
India – Annoyed – 12g – even on tech – swap TM - Republic
Zulu – Furious – 0g – even on tech – swap TM - Republic
France – Polite – 48g – even on tech – swap WM - Republic
Carthage – Polite – 35g – down Monotheism & Engineering – Monarchy
Ottoman – Furious – 5g – even on tech – Swap TM - Republic
Spain – Annoyed – 50g – even on tech – Swap TM – Republic

We are strong military compared to all

Histograph:
Arabia 573
Rome 490
Egypt 470
France 454
Zululand 383
Ottoman 362
Carthage 335
India 306
Spain 241
Persia 220

I'll post a little bit of analysis tomorrow.

Got it

Looks like I'll have a breather


Ted

Pre-flight checks... OK

Pre-turn
Persepolis fires Clown
Makkah, Madinah, Dhahran switch to Market
Increase Research spending to 40% (11 turns @ -20gpt)
Hawk WM - making 58gp

Press button
Lots of AI units strolling through our territory
Basra Walls - Barracks

1 - 250AD
Workers concentrate on roading to bring in more gp
Sword fort Fustat
Hawk WM for 8gp

IBT
Kufah Horse - Worker (zero growth)

2 - 260AD
Workers road...
Aden founded - Barracks
Increase Research to 50% (6 turns @ -46gpt) We should be just able to meet the cost by hawking WM every turn
Hawk WM for 12gp

IBT
Rome asks for RoP - I give it, not wanting to provoke anyone for a few more turns
Diriyah Pike - Horse
Damascus Pike - Horse
Baghdad Horse - Market

3 - 270AD
Pike fort Damascus
Pike fort Diriyah
Horse fort Baghdad
SoD heads for Riyadh
Hawk WM for 11gp

IBT
Spain starts Hanging Gardens

4 - 280AD
Workers road...
SoD fort Riyadh
Hawk WM for 14gp
Increase Research to 60% (3 turns @ -59gpt with 175gp in the bank)

IBT
Egypt starts Sistine Chapel (Theology)

5 - 290AD
Madinah grows to pop 11 - hire Taxman
Workers work...
Send a couple of Pike to Nakkah as there's a Sword on the doorstep
Hawk WM for 8gp
Egypt has monopoly on Theology

IBT
Susa Temple - Barracks
Kufah Worker - Horse

6 - 300AD
Research 50% (1 turn @ -47gpt)
Workers work...
Hawk WM for 11gp
Egypt still has monopoly on Theology

IBT
Discover Chivalry - Invention

7 - 310AD
Workers work...
Research set to lone scientist (Gordium)
We're only making 44gpt but there are 2 Markets coming online before my turns end and a couple more later. There are 4 Ansars in production so I'll try to finish my turns peacefully and leave upgrading to the next player.
Hawk WM for 7gp

Tech Status
Rome down Chivalry
India down Chivalry
Carthage down Monotheism, Engineering & Chivalry
Carthage down Chivalry
France down Chivalry - up Theology & Invention (they must have discovered Invention and traded with Egypt for Theology)
Zulu down Chivalry
Spain down Chivalry
Egypt down Chivalry - up Theology & Invention
We could get Invention, a Worker & 11gp from France in exchange for Chivalry but I think it better to hang onto Chivalry and don't want to lower the price of Invention.

IBT
Makkah Market - Ansar
Sirpebidah Temple - Lib (cultural pressure on Toledo)
Rome starts Leonardo's (Invention)
Rome starts Sistine (Theology)

8 - 320AD
Workers work...
Damascus switches to Market
Diriyah switches to Market
I just had a sweep rounf our core cities and most of them are now working at least one unroaded, unimproved tile so we need to fit a round of workers into the production schedule.
Hawk WM for 10gp
Rome is now down Chivalry - up Theology & Invention

IBT
We seem to have some units in Carthagian territory

9 - 330AD
Workers work...
Hawk WM for 10gp

IBT
Rome wants Chivalry for Theology - buy his WM for 1gp instead
Madinah Market - Worker
Khurasan Pike - Worker
Egypt starts Leonardo's (Invention)

10 - 340AD
Pike fort Khurasan
Workers work...
Trading left for next player

AI Status
Egypt - Republic, annoyed, down Chivalry, up Theology & Invention, 5gp
Rome - Monarchy, annoyed, down Chivalry, up Theology & Invention, 8gp
India - Republic, annoyed, down Chivalry, up Invention, 1gp
Zulu - Republic, annoyed, down Chivalry, 8gp
France - Republic, polite, down Chivalry, up Theology & Invention, 35gp
Carthage - Monarchy, cautious, down Monotheism & the rest, 26gp
Ottoman - Republic, furious, down Chivalry, 0gp
Spain - Republic, annoyed, down Chivalry, up Invention, 63gp

Notes
We desperately need to improve our roads and tiles. I've done what I could but more is needed.
I hung onto our Chivalry monopoly so we should have an extra edge in the upcoming wars.
There's 220gp in the bank and we're adding 70gpt.
The next player can start upgrading the Horses and look for targets. Personally, I think I'd take on India. They're weak, have Ivory & Wines and we might get luck with a GL to build the FP in Madras or Delhi.
I' researching at lone scientist (the unhappy citizen in Gordium) as I think we'll be able to beat any techs we need out of the AI.

No screenshot as little has changed. The save is > here <

I will be unable to continue running this game. TedJackson, could you please see that it stays on schedule?

I posted my reasons here .

I am truly sorry I am unable to continue. I wish you well and good luck.

Sorry to see you go CF but I understand your reasons.

OK team, I should have an easy job running this as you all seem to be doing just fine


Ted

I should reinforce that you all seem to be doing well and enjoying the game plus getting a lot out of it.

Best wishes and thoughts to ControlFreak and our thoughts go out to you. I can still remember when you were ControlFreakarabi.

TedJackson, mak sure you PM me if there is anything you or anyone else would need.

Thanks for the kind words of encouragement & the offer of assistance Cracker.

I'll be sure to get in touch towards the end of the game to ensure I deal correctly with the scoring issues.


Ted

I wrote this on my laptop during a very boring HR presentation this morning. I just read the message from CF and must admit I've felt the same way recently My wife and son are in San Francisco for two weeks for family birthdays (I had to work and was saving vacation time for the holidays) and my evenings are spent with Civ. Hopefully I will get filled up during the remaining days and will throttle back play in November. I also just read TJ's turn log and while I think India is a good target, my choice for Egypt/Zulu (outlined below), might be a better one. By the way nice work with the science slider. I rarely sell my WM's, I'll have to try that in other games.

Below are my thoughts on this game as it ended last night:

I was thinking about this on my drive in this morning and if we go after Egypt and Zulu, we’ll be using a 4 attack factor (Ansars/Azap) versus a 2 defense (Chariots/Spear/Impi) as neither of them have any iron sources. Completing the circle through Spain, France and Carthage would net us the entire western world. We should try to get through this cycle quickly or else we’ll be facing muskets. Once our first Ansar wins, we’ll be in a golden age and we should probably then concentrate on getting as much military (Ansar/Azap/Pikemen) as possible built during those 20 turns. I propose we start with an Ansar attack on the Lisht and an Azap attack on Asyut. Ansars would then move on to Avaris and meet up with the Azap force in Byblos. Using the Ansar speed to collect the smaller cites and the Azap power to take the larger ones, Egypt should fall very quickly. Also pikemen will be needed for MP duty. We should probably depend on pointy-stick research for the near future and use our cash for horse & sword upgrades. I don’t think we’ll need to build any workers as there should be quite a few slaves joining our current workers. We will need a few settlers to fill in for any razed cities. Temples should be built first in captured cites to fill in territory gaps.

Comments??



=========================================

To ControlFreak,

I wish you the best and hope you're able to happily move forward with your life. As an aside, my wife and I have been discussing some sort of earn your Civ time arrangement, like 1 hour exercise = 1 hour civ / 2 hours chores = 1 hours civ, etc.
Give that some thought. I've tried to limit my forum time to lunch and breaks while playing only after 10pm on weeknights. This last week has been an exception, since the family is away.

Deny

Denyd,

Zulu have Iron SW of Ngome and NE of Intombe (both connected) but you're right about Egypt, they have no Iron

So they would make an ideal training ground for our vet Ansars, hopefully promoting a few to elite along the way.

If that's the way we go then we might as well attack Carthage or Zulu next as we won't want to turn around and march all the way to India.

On further inspection Carthage only has 1 Iron - Theveste is founded on it. That would seem to make them second on the 'Hit List'


Ted

They must have hooked it up recently. I tried to buy peace them early in my turn set with Iron for gpt deal and they refused, but they were willing to peace without any concessions instead.

I agree with you as to the Egyptians. I hesitate a little on Carthage only because they'll make a per turn deal with us. I think if we challenge the Zulu to leave, we'll get a war. I worry a little about the Ottoman at our back. I wouldn't be too surprised to see them jump in to any wars we get into. I've been thinking a deal involving Invention & Chivalry might get the Romans in our side to keep the Ottoman busy.

I'd also like to find a way to get to France before they start getting Musketeers in quantity.

Who's up???

Denyd,
I was thinking:
A) Egypt, Carthage then Zulu (coming round to France & Spain to take the West completely)
B) Egypt, Carthage then Ottoman (puhing on to India to take the middle of the map).

Both options have merits & drawbacks and it will depend on how quickly we can take out Egypt. Either way it'll be a lot of fun

Roster
jimmydean --> Up now
denyd --> On deck
DaveShack
TedJackson


Ted

Did you skip me? I was expecting to find myself "up now" and see that denyd posted at 11:40 PM or so, and then TJ picked it up just an hour or so later at 12:40 AM or so (just after midnight) the next day.

Dave,

I just realized you're right. I thought that you'd played between my turns and Ted's.

Since JimmyDean hasn't said got it yet, why don't you jump in here and have him follow when you've finished. I probably won't be able to play tomorrow night, so would likely delay my turn until Friday night.

Deny

Sorry, I've been pretty much passed out for the last half day from excessive alcohol consumption following the red hot chili peppers concert I was at last night. I won't be able to play for at least 12 hours, so if you want to skip me, no problem.

Hi JimmyDean,

We don't need to skip you, TedJackson played early so I need to catch up. You'll be after me, and then we're back on schedule with denyd next.

btw... got it

My apologies everyone,

I obviously had a major brainfart & leapt into the fray too early

So DaveShack you're Up now followed by jimmydean next. Then we'll fall back into normal order.


Ted

Ted, no problem...

Here is a log of the 1st 5 turns. In position to start hostilities with Egypt. I have an abnormally early meeting at work tomorrow so need to finish tomorrow night, hope that's OK.

Preturn

Nothing needs changed, pressing enter

IBT

Lots of settler stacks moving around
Madinah completes worker, starts ansar
Alexmanistan completes temple, starts pikeman
French building Sistine Chapel (theology)

Turn 1, 350AD, 110g+67gpt, Invention in 36

3 Bagdhad workers move to build a strategic road to Dhahran w/horse
Move 5 more workers to a roaded tile for movement next turn. Bagdhad
won't grow for around 10 more turns (needs Aqueduct) so workers better
used elsewhere.

Fort pike on small stack outside Asyut
Upgrade 4 vet horses to Ansars in Riyadh.
Move part of the stack on iron toward Asyut. Realized after doing this
that maybe they were there to dissuade Carthage from attempting a sneak
attack + pillage, will see what happens IBT.

IBT

Indians building Sistene Chapel
Several foreign troops withdraw, we probably passed through a threshold
for the strength ratio.

Turn 2, 360AD, 117g+67gpt. Forgot to hawk wm, need to remember that this time

Workers work, move one of the swords from the iron back to it, back to 2 units.
Foot troops continue congregating at Asyut.

Egypt has Theology, Invention, 54g, lacks chivalry.
Zulu same, 4g
France same, 9g
Ottomans have 2g, lack chivalry.
Carthage have 33g, lack Monotheism
India has 3g, Theology, Invention, lack chivalry
Rome has 7g, Theology, Invention, lack chivalry
Spain has 3g, Invention, lack Chivalry
Hawk WM for 8g, now have 125
Upgrade 2 more vet horse to Ansar
Move 2 elite horses out of the Riyadh stack to keep from accidentally upgrading

IBT

Lots of aimless AI movement
Makkah produces Ansar, starts another
Snagha produces barracks, starts pike (30 turns)
Khurasan produces worker, starts pike (10 turns)

Turn 3, 370AD, 72g+64gpt, Invention in 34
Foot to assembly point near Asyut
Upgrade 1 horse
6 Ansar head for lower Egypt (Lisht, Buto, Avaris)
Spain would buy spices for 4gpt (guess our rep is coming back?)
Egypt would buy spices for 3gpt
No further changes in trading situation

IBT

drat, persepolis riots -- haven't been tracking that hired taxman
Jeddah produces temple, start pike (15)
Anjar produces temple, start barracks (40)
Zulu building sistine chapel

Turn 4, 380AD, 84g+62gpt, Invention in 33
Ansars, elite horses advance
Hawk WM
Upgrade 1 horse in Damascus

IBT

Damascus completes market, starts Ansar
Bagdhad completes market, starts Aqueduct
Riyadh completes Ansar, starts Pikeman
Palace expansion

Turn 5, 390AD, 97g+78gpt (markets), Invention in 32

upgrade horse
Position ansars for Egypt war (9 ansars, 2 elite horse on station)
10 mixed foot on station at Asyut

Trade check, tech situation unchanged
Ottomans lack iron
India lacks horses
Egypt lacks iron
Hawk WM

At this point I'm stopping for the night, have a much earlier day than
usual at work.
The save

Looking good so far. Hopefully you'll have a productive war, and the GA should help production.

Do we want to use the GA to build infrastructure (markets, temples, libraries), or do we use it to just pump ansars out? I think the ansar are only 60 shields, so we can probably get several cities producing them every 3 turns. If we're lucky, we'll be able to produce 2 a turn from our cities, which will help replace the ones we lose.