Patch Thoughts?

Hammer Rabbi said:

when i loaded the game through steam, my game read that it was "updating". i thought it was the patch. although, now that you mention it, Ottoman and Japan didnt try to pillage a single tile. that could have been a clue for me, haha.

oh well. bummer. wish there was a date for the patch in the notes (unless I didnt see it).

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There is - "sometime this Fall".

I thought it would go live on the 24th, i saw it somewhere in there.

EDIT: Nevermind. I guess I was hallucinating.

Buccaneer said:

There is - "sometime this Fall".

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That could be at the beginning of the Fall or end of it. Fall is Autumn right? These American terms still confuse me a bit.

I hate vague release dates.

I really like the pillaging changes, Denmark just became much more interesting to me.

Yeah, this is definitely going to make Immortal+ a LOT harder, especially against Monty and Alex. I'm not looking forward to defending all of my farms while letting those dang hoplites get +25 HP. Oh well. Just means I need more ranged units.

I wonder if we'll be able to bait the AI into bad positions by creating improvements in strategic locations. Would be funny to see a horseman unit pillage a farm next to your city only to be taken out by spearmen and CB's.

Looks like a great patch. I am SO GLAD the spinning map problem is FINALLY fixed.

I still wish there was more diplomacy. I'd like to be able to say to an AI, 'stop attacking that CS or I will DOW you'. And then not get a big diplo hit for protecting an allied CS.

If you can't stick up for your allies....

Fixed an issue where citizen management focus on Production (and possibly others) could lead to starvation.

Haha Finally

Oh yeah and austria is finally fixed

Socratatus said:

That could be at the beginning of the Fall or end of it. Fall is Autumn right? These American terms still confuse me a bit.

I hate vague release dates.

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It has to be vague release dates because it is not ready yet. Too many people in the gaming world wants a specific date and when that either comes and goes or the game is released too early, then the screaming starts anew. All releases should be ready when it's ready and not before. Personally, I would prefer that it was announced during the last phase of testing and upon going gold.

By the way, Fall is Autumn which means anywhere between end of Sept. to end of December. With all of the rebalancing, I hope they continue to test the snot out of it and release it only when it's good enough.

Buccaneer said:

It has to be vague release dates because it is not ready yet. Too many people in the gaming world wants a specific date and when that either comes and goes or the game is released too early, then the screaming starts anew. All releases should be ready when it's ready and not before. Personally, I would prefer that it was announced during the last phase of testing and upon going gold.

By the way, Fall is Autumn which means anywhere between end of Sept. to end of December. With all of the rebalancing, I hope they continue to test the snot out of it and release it only when it's good enough.

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With the last major patches, we didn't get detailed notes, like we got today, until right before release (in case they change) therefore the changes may be imminent - or maybe thats wishful thinking.

At least here in the US, we tend to think of fall as anytime between September and October, and usually not into November. Otherwise it would be the Holiday Patch!

I have a feeling it will be here within 4 weeks.

kamex said:

With the last major patches, we didn't get detailed notes, like we got today, until right before release (in case they change) therefore the changes may be imminent - or maybe thats wishful thinking.

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Good point. We hadn't heard anything the past 2 months and the patch notes were quite extensive.

I'm really hoping a lot of things really were fixed but AI diplo doesnt make as much sense as I thought it would. I was playing Korea because I didnt see any mention of fixing the Hwacha bug so I thought Id test that out

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It was mentioned that the 200% vs. cities promotion will no longer be retained on upgrade. It was phrased as a general change, indicating that that's how it's currently coded, but the only unit affected is the Hwach'a. So, yes, it is being fixed.

I rage quit when Japan and Greece joint dow'd me and took 2 of my cities in 4 turns. I'm going to give it another try and see what happens, but I was a bit too excited to think it was "great" now. Im sure the other conveniences will be really nice but this patch is quite large in what they fixed. It will take a while to see many of the fixes in action.

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The patch has been announced - it hasn't gone live yet. So you're playing the same old G&K, not post-patch G&K.

OmniPotent42 said:

Yeah, this is definitely going to make Immortal+ a LOT harder, especially against Monty and Alex. I'm not looking forward to defending all of my farms while letting those dang hoplites get +25 HP.

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You think that's going to be a patch (no pun intended) on Immortals? Granted AI Darius is somewhat less aggressive, but the Immortal rush just became even stronger.

AI Attila might actually have battering rams survive long enough to take cities, though.

I wonder if we'll be able to bait the AI into bad positions by creating improvements in strategic locations. Would be funny to see a horseman unit pillage a farm next to your city only to be taken out by spearmen and CB's.

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We haven't been told how reliably the AI will pillage, just that it will sometimes do so. I doubt it will actively look for particular tiles to pillage. I hope the AI more reliably pillages citadels, though.

I still wish there was more diplomacy. I'd like to be able to say to an AI, 'stop attacking that CS or I will DOW you'. And then not get a big diplo hit for protecting an allied CS.

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Saying "You'll pay for this" and declaring war within the next few turns already has this effect - at least, you won't get the hit with all other civs.

Okay, Denmark is now the best military civ, more movement than all the other civs, and 25+hp healed PER movement point since they can pillage without any movement cost, and you can choose which units get healed as well.

PhilBowles said:

You think that's going to be a patch (no pun intended) on Immortals? Granted AI Darius is somewhat less aggressive, but the Immortal rush just became even stronger.

AI Attila might actually have battering rams survive long enough to take cities, though.



We haven't been told how reliably the AI will pillage, just that it will sometimes do so. I doubt it will actively look for particular tiles to pillage. I hope the AI more reliably pillages citadels, though.



Saying "You'll pay for this" and declaring war within the next few turns already has this effect - at least, you won't get the hit with all other civs.

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Immortal+ has nothing to do with Persia - it's shorthand for the Immortal/Deity difficulty levels.

Thoughts: Like everything, but need Piety to be balanced a bit better, it's too split in focus between culture and faith.

Think a Portugal DLC is coming (offshore expansion fix, Great Admiral placement improved and prize ship balances) and probable Kongo with them.

Well there's the obvious two exploit fixes with Rationalism and Starving cities.

There's the less obvious exploit of RAs getting fixed. I know it will slow down the game at higher difficulties, I just wonder how much it will slow down the AI. I'm sure they got overflow, heck probably more than I do, but they also don't take take paths that intentionally produce a ton of overflow.

I would have loved to have seen some religion tweaks. Piety doesn't "really" need a buff, it's just getting a religion should go to the people who are actively investing hammer and gold into getting it up, not bumping by luck into people who built a whole 1 shrine and got lucky because of a mix of Pantheon and Exploration faith.

Edit: To be clear on this point. I think that both the amount of random faith (CS/Ruins) AND the post pantheon faith should be looked at or simply just changed or removed (Desert Faith and Stone Circles being by far the worst offenders). Perhaps also look at the whole pantheon cost thing too (perhaps making it a fixed slightly higher amount) so there is some measure in how standard getting a pantheon.

There's a subtle patronage buff I rather like. Mixed with the RA "nerf" which will slow down the pace of games it might add some good value to other policy trees.

Pillaging buff I like. G&K was a little rough to any melee approach to the land game.

Everything else I don't mind other than the "fall" release.


Oh and Maddjinn, I call shenanigans on you knowing a lot of these ahead of time! That or someone at firaxis watches to your LPs. Battleships losing the city bonus and Ironclads losing 5 strength. Good changes mind you, but you call those almost word for word in your Carthage LP.

MadDjinn implied that he had some inside connection with Firaxis at the beginning of his Carthage LP, so I wouldn't be surprised if he did indeed know some of the changes in advance. Maybe he even suggested them.

They nerfed Happiness from religion and mercantile city-states! That's a good change. Sadly, they did nothing about Ceremonial Burial and actually made Peace Loving work, so the two biggest offenders are still there.

The new Faith-based national wonder is interesting.

Anyway, I see a lot of good single player changes, but absolutely nothing to fix multiplayer or mods. So, I'm kind of disappointed.

Where are these patch notes?

Buccaneer said:

Ummm....that patch will not be out for a while.

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Watch it come out on the last day of Fall.

Patch notes are here for anyone who is asking http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=476110