The Immortal Pericles

Immortal Standard Pangea. Sorry for all the threads, but I'm trying to get back to my old level of play and would love to get all the help possible! Plus, some activity would be nice on the forums again, right?


Thinking to move the scout 2S2W to see the blue circle, if not, SIP looks good.


Thinking Agri->Mining->BW for now. Will probably change depending on surroundings.

I'm sort of thinking to go for GLH, I shall see next turn if we have any AI that are on the coast to determine priority.

Agree with your suggested moves. Doesn't look easy, but depends a lot on the surroundings. I don't think GLH is very good on pangaea. With Pericles, Oxford is pretty good.

SIP looks bad. 5 plains, 6 forest, no river, not much food. Hopefully there is more seafood.

Well, it's not that bad. +9 with a lighthouse, +7 without one. 1NW is an option if it doesn't kill seafood, but obviously delays the clam a lot.

Okay, moved scout and nothing good over there.

I think SIP is in order, correct?

Pretty sure both 1NW and go agri-AH and SIP, go agri-min-BW are fine.

Rough start. I see tundra to the South and jungle to the North. The only is in the sea.

Despite good traits, Pericles isn't one of my favourite leaders. I never know what to do unless there's some marble nearby...

GLH could be ok if there are potential island cities. I guess you need to explore some more while picking off agriculture & mining and hope for the best. Are you going to open with a work boat? It'll take 10 turns on this start. Good luck!

Yes, I opened with work boat->Worker.

10 turns in now. Situation isn't looking too good. I better have horses or copper nearby. Stalin to the north (exact city location marked) and Darius to the West (approx. location).

I thought worker first was obvious, clam is just too weak to put 30 into this early.

2nd city 3W of capital I think.

sampsa said:

I thought worker first was obvious, clam is just too weak to put 30 into this early.

2nd city 3W of capital I think.

Click to expand...

Worker wouldn't have any power tiles to work apart from rice which made me delay it. Anyway, looking like it is going to be a tough uphill battle from here.



I had initial thoughts of settling the gold, but I'm leaning against that because of Stalin diplomacy and maintenance.

I think you're right about settling 3W for city 2. I put in some potential city sites. I think GLH actually may be important for this poor start. I literally have no future commerce sites..Looking at the F9 settings on the second turn, at least 3 AI have coastal starts so GLH could be a risk.

You can consider 1 NW if you feel like a gamblin' man . Extra early and you will probably be able to work the clam soonish anyway due to the tundra clue. Moving away from map edge is attractive too.

TheMeInTeam said:

You can consider 1 NW if you feel like a gamblin' man . Extra early and you will probably be able to work the clam soonish anyway due to the tundra clue. Moving away from map edge is attractive too.

Click to expand...

I'm already 30 turns in. Unless I assume you're talking about something that isn't the first turn? I went for SIP. I JUST realised 1NW would have been a coastal so I could have still gotten the clam. Oops One of the more tougher Imm games that I have played so far already; it's looking relatively tough.

Revent said:

Worker wouldn't have any power tiles to work apart from rice which made me delay it.

Click to expand...

Maybe you should mine your hills ? It does seem better than farming green tiles with a happy cap @5.
Especially the hill 1NW of your cap should be mined before you settle the sheep+fish tile. Then the city can get a workboat over 6 turns to improve the fish.



I understand TMIT was talking of your settling location. 1NW. That gets you a faster start and an easier time expanding up north.

Up north :
You should unfog the tile 2W of the gold. Gold + food makes for a good city location. If there isn't a special, you should consider claiming the gold from the northern riverside (claiming copper as well ?).

You've explored quite a bit already and can (probably) see most of the land you'll be able to settle peacefully. From this you can also guess where future borders would be.
I think it's a good time for you to consider the longer game.
What can prevent you from winning ? How to react ? What's a possible path to victory ?

I would fast be building settlers here. You want the gold/copper gems location. Plus if you can block Russians to rice/clams. The key site is the stone one for mids. That mixed with libraries could make or break your game here.

The sites near your capital can be grabbed later. Make sure to fog bust the areas up north. I would even consider whipping a fast 2nd settler. Get techs for writing and masonry soon before your economy collapses.

Gumbolt said:

I would fast be building settlers here. You want the gold/copper gems location. Plus if you can block Russians to rice/clams. The key site is the stone one for mids. That mixed with libraries could make or break your game here.

The sites near your capital can be grabbed later. Make sure to fog bust the areas up north. I would even consider whipping a fast 2nd settler. Get techs for writing and masonry soon before your economy collapses.

Click to expand...

BornInCantaloup said:

Maybe you should mine your hills ? It does seem better than farming green tiles with a happy cap @5.
Especially the hill 1NW of your cap should be mined before you settle the sheep+fish tile. Then the city can get a workboat over 6 turns to improve the fish.



I understand TMIT was talking of your settling location. 1NW. That gets you a faster start and an easier time expanding up north.

Up north :
You should unfog the tile 2W of the gold. Gold + food makes for a good city location. If there isn't a special, you should consider claiming the gold from the northern riverside (claiming copper as well ?).

You've explored quite a bit already and can (probably) see most of the land you'll be able to settle peacefully. From this you can also guess where future borders would be.
I think it's a good time for you to consider the longer game.
What can prevent you from winning ? How to react ? What's a possible path to victory ?

Click to expand...

Thank you guys for the comments! I really do appreciate multiple people inputting and giving advice.
Played another 20 turns. I whipped warriors into settlers, then grew the city on a warrior before whipping again. Well, I hope I did it right! Settler is currently on the way to claim Rice Clam Gems city. After that I think I'm gonna go for the stone city.

Question: Is it worth settling ON the stone to save a couple of turns to get Mids. Going to chop it out in the same city or shall I just improve it?

Long term plan: It looks like I'm squeezed off in the corner with only one bit of land that can be cottaged and that land has no food source. I'm thinking Mids and GLH to keep my economy running. Stalin is going to be a problem, so I want to take him out SOONER rather than later.

Tech Plan: I'm never too sure about this. I always do Cuirs but with this little land and most of it being bad land it's tough. CS beeline and construction and use mace+cats to war. Not too sure really. Tips welcome



Also, I found out who my other AI are by accident On the diplomacy screen, it says that Wang Kon is the worst enemy of Stalin and Shaka. Darius is the worst enemy of Isabella!

Thank you all for the input! Please do continue if you can

Ok, getting boxed in and out-teched is a way to lose on such a start.
Setting up a block to the north is a valid reaction.
Alternatively, you could have rushed with Axemen.
The rush has the more upsides but is also the riskier route.
Blocking off land is safer but will delay your development (harder to develop a stretched out Empire than a compact one).

--> Catapults now seem the earliest unit you can use to break out (maybe optimistic ?).
Depending on how much you focus on research, expansion and wonders, they may not be a valid option. (The more wonders you target, the more cities you found, the harder it will be to use an early unit.)
--> Macemen are conceivable.

Try and get a feeling of how many cities you want / will have by then.
It will be that much easier to plan an invasion.


To develop your land, some stakes are competing.
a) if you settle clams/rice/gems where you are, you'll need a 3rd city to complete your northern block
b) Sailing will be much needed to set up trade routes (conveniently enough, it will also grant you foreign trade routes)
c) Stone is very far away (--> Sailing) and doesn't have food. Is it worth sending an early settler over there ? How would that affect the development of your Empire ?
I'd consider claiming it in the 3rd ring of a city (starting on a Library... still would take 35+ turns to grab).
d) Gems are jungled. That means you want to enter the Classical Era sooner than later (^^) to unlock them. Going for land grabs, however, will delay your research, while Sailing is a detour.


If I were in this position, I'd fully play the "settle in your face" game (and maybe build a few archers/axes when they are affordable and Stalin gets offensive units).
--> finish scouting Stalin's border
--> settle a 3rd city over there to complete the block
--> backfill "leisurely", starting with copper/fish/sheep, and trying to find a balance between research (unlocking gems) and expansion (the earlier the cities are settled, the better)
--> possibly invest in a wonder in Athens

Once you can Open Borders, you'll also need to look for the remaining AIs,
And it may be worth it to check those islands around you.

And you'll have to keep an eye on your worker count
Yes, that's a lot, that's the strain of such land grabs

Unfortunately, it did not go as planned!


Few turns after settling Clam Rice Gems, Stalin took the city that was meant to block. Also, Clam Rice Gems has almost crashed my economy, really need that sailing now to do its wonders with TR's. Tempted to go for GLH and Mids to keep me going for war. More importantly Mids because I have no cottageable land.

Consider this, settling Athens the way you did :


2040 BC, 2 cities block.
You may find your development has been too slow (starting with workboat on 1F2H instead of worker, for example)
It may have been too greedy on your part to go for a coastal 3rd, rather than an inland city.

That said, my inclination on such a map would involve connecting the copper as fast as possible.

I tried the map, its hard. Had a city spot stolen by barbs:

I agree the mainland isn't very appealing, Bhavv, but it is land you'll need at some point, right ? Was it the better choice to let Stalin expand to 9 cities ? That seems dangerous.

You've got 7 cities yourself, which is quite good, and the GLH, which is strong,
But Stalin... Stalin may be tough to take down, now...

... unless you plan to go a way around him and start by invading Persia ?