Shosone Questions please?
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vivalamexico
Prince
1. Any
2. Spam & hitn'run
2. Spam & hitn'run
ixias
Warlord
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The Shoshone are a fantastic Civ in that they are very flexible. You get to work the best tiles right from the start because of their UA, you can spam Pathfinders and get some very nice ancient ruins, and then continue onward. They don't have a preference as to which Victory Condition you go for, but can do well with any.
As for the Commanche Raiders, they're very good for getting through the front lines and knocking out weakened units. The Shoshone can use them for a late-game war push, or for defense in their own territory (which is further enhanced by the UA)
Overall, the Shoshone are one of my favorite Civs because of their hyper flexibility and ability to adapt.
As for the Commanche Raiders, they're very good for getting through the front lines and knocking out weakened units. The Shoshone can use them for a late-game war push, or for defense in their own territory (which is further enhanced by the UA)
Overall, the Shoshone are one of my favorite Civs because of their hyper flexibility and ability to adapt.
Fabio1701
King
agree. goodciv for a wide empire with lots of space between cities. raiders help guard that wide space easily as well. completely abuse the pathfinders, build lots to get every ruins there is as you can choose the bonus and they are as good as warriors when killing barbs. only downside is that they upgrade through the scout path, but if you choose the new technology upgrade in a ruin they can switch over to the archer path.
with regards to policy, they can do everything. if you want to try a religious policy start, the choice in ruins to give you early faith can help boost that start and the tech you need to get temples fast.
danaphanous
religious fanatic
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They are extremely flexible if you spam a few early pathfinders. I regularly get 6-8 ancient ruins and it jump-starts my culture and gets me an early pantheon which leads to a religion. It also grows my early city quickly and gives me some free composite bowmen and techs early. From this early starting point you can go for any victory but I find them fun for domination.
They are one of the best civs for early-strike I've found. My last game I wiped out Ethiopia using the free composite bowmen upgrades years before anyone else had them and before turn 80. I preemptively attacked his capital while it was just getting started. It's very hard to do this without the advantage of something like the bowmen so they are probably the best for very early wipe-outs like this.
They are one of the best civs for early-strike I've found. My last game I wiped out Ethiopia using the free composite bowmen upgrades years before anyone else had them and before turn 80. I preemptively attacked his capital while it was just getting started. It's very hard to do this without the advantage of something like the bowmen so they are probably the best for very early wipe-outs like this.
VicRatlhead5199
King
The Comanche Rider is one of the most lackluster UUs in the game imo. I guess they need to be that way since the pathfinder and UA are so good. I wish they got the survivalism I promotion like they do in the Conquest of the New World Deluxe scenario. It's not a huge buff but it would make them a little more unique and fun to play.
That being said they are good at setting up flank bonuses due to the extra movement and like all cavalry are a great compliment to artillery. Build 4-6 of them and swarm enemies. Try to get as many flanking bonuses as possible before attacking enemy units. I think their promo carries over so they could be pretty cool with the Autocracy lightning warfare tenant.
I went order when I played them. Resettlement and their UA worked great together for late game settling. I haven't tried them with Autocracy yet.
That being said they are good at setting up flank bonuses due to the extra movement and like all cavalry are a great compliment to artillery. Build 4-6 of them and swarm enemies. Try to get as many flanking bonuses as possible before attacking enemy units. I think their promo carries over so they could be pretty cool with the Autocracy lightning warfare tenant.
I went order when I played them. Resettlement and their UA worked great together for late game settling. I haven't tried them with Autocracy yet.
#1 All; the civ is in the God tier when played by a human unless you've turned off city ruins.
I think the main line of thought is to select a Cultural ruin first and never ever pick maps or reveal barb camp.
reddishrecue
Some dude on civfans
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The Comanche riders and the mobility promotion allows for upgrade in the future of mobile units such as land ships and armors. If you combine artillery and Comanche riders, you can easily defend yourself from any unwanted warmongerers.
redwings1340
Emperor
You found a use for resettlement??? That's awesome. Do you think this is actually viable to be worth it so late, or were you just trying something different?
That tenant has always seemed awesome to me, but I've also felt like it comes too late. I feel like it needs to be in late exploration or something to be really viable.
reddishrecue
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What about the other civilizations and their bonuses? Won't any other civilizations who have their uniqueness make them suitable for any victory condition as well?
budweiser
King of the Beers
Not as fast a Shoshone. They are one of the most 'front loaded' civs. You can customize your start any way you want given the choice of what to pick from a hut. This can get you up and running very fast.
No, Shoshone are actually overpowered even if you turn off ruins their crazy land grabbing ability is super OP. It gives them limitless tiles to choose from when they found a new city which gives them a head start in producing, growing or getting gold, whichever they decide to work.
This ability also allows them to trap other civs easily and devastate them with no effort other than placing a city near the target.
Excellent at war, excellent at expansion, excellent at economy, production and growth. With ruins on, how about a turn 3 composite? Instant population growth, Culture for a super early settler, a free tech!!! Super crazy mega OP.
reddishrecue
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Yeah, I guess you guys are right given the fact that the Shoshone ua gives so much land in the intial start and then more resources from the excess land grabbing start. Very good civilization indeed. It almost seems like if this civilization was the future of an old civilization which is why ruins give pathfinders the ability to choose the bonus. The only thing about the scout is that it is built a lot faster than the pathfinders which has more hp like the warrior. I don't know about the long building time of the pathfinder because you can build 1 or 2 scouts easier when you build one pathfinder. You get to explore more land when you build 1 or 2 scouts than 1 or 2 pathfinders at the same time.
I beg to disagree.
Weird bycicle flying objects make arties crying!
And they are not very far of dynamite.
Not even pointing out too how far off are AA guns in the tech tree.
So the cav/arty is a very powerfull combination of course, but its window of opportunity is not very very long.
I agree that the Shoshone are a very strong civ. I hesitate to call them "OP", because there are a lot of strong civs in the game, and overall game balance is very good, even if there are distinct tiers of strength.
I'd also agree that they CAN win any victory type, and their strength helps towards this. So in answer to:
"1. Which victory conditions are they suited for?"
The answer is indeed, all of them.
However the victory type they are BEST suited for is Domination. Reasoning is as follows:
1) Boosted early borders means aggressive landgrabbing and earlier than normal border tensions with neighbours. This is a small factor, but has a tendency towards earlier wars.
2) They have two UUs and no UB. This is a small factor, as neither of their UUs wow in warfare as they stand. Still, any civ that has two UUs is normally one that is best served going to war (with the possible exception of those with non-aggressive GP UUs, like Venice).
3) Pathfinders upgrade to Composite Bowmen. This is the big factor. Pathfinders are too strong to not immediately have 2 or 3 of them. Controlled ruins means you can get CBs earlier than anyone in the game. This means you utterly dominate early warfare. Not using this in a war is a great way to waste your potential. You can't quite do a 6-CB rush without CB tech (well, i'm sure its possible, but its not something you'll usually attempt) but two or three CBs when everyone else is on tiny cities and warriors and maybe archers will easily win you a capital or two.
Once you've started early warmongering, the easiest path to progress to is Domination, though to be honest it sets you up well for most victory types. A relative lack of late game advantages means as the Shoshone you want early warmongering rather than late warmongering to be your decisive game phase.
In answer to how you use comanche raiders, I'd say "as an afterthought". Don't bother beelining them, as they're not game changing, but when you get them they're a nice minor bonus from the baseline.
I'd also agree that they CAN win any victory type, and their strength helps towards this. So in answer to:
"1. Which victory conditions are they suited for?"
The answer is indeed, all of them.
However the victory type they are BEST suited for is Domination. Reasoning is as follows:
1) Boosted early borders means aggressive landgrabbing and earlier than normal border tensions with neighbours. This is a small factor, but has a tendency towards earlier wars.
2) They have two UUs and no UB. This is a small factor, as neither of their UUs wow in warfare as they stand. Still, any civ that has two UUs is normally one that is best served going to war (with the possible exception of those with non-aggressive GP UUs, like Venice).
3) Pathfinders upgrade to Composite Bowmen. This is the big factor. Pathfinders are too strong to not immediately have 2 or 3 of them. Controlled ruins means you can get CBs earlier than anyone in the game. This means you utterly dominate early warfare. Not using this in a war is a great way to waste your potential. You can't quite do a 6-CB rush without CB tech (well, i'm sure its possible, but its not something you'll usually attempt) but two or three CBs when everyone else is on tiny cities and warriors and maybe archers will easily win you a capital or two.
Once you've started early warmongering, the easiest path to progress to is Domination, though to be honest it sets you up well for most victory types. A relative lack of late game advantages means as the Shoshone you want early warmongering rather than late warmongering to be your decisive game phase.
In answer to how you use comanche raiders, I'd say "as an afterthought". Don't bother beelining them, as they're not game changing, but when you get them they're a nice minor bonus from the baseline.
reddishrecue
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The great war bombers, can own this cav artillery combo then. The aa can counter airplanes, that's known. what I'm saying is that the Comanche and their mobility promotion can be upgraded to landships or armors even to have that extra mobility promotion.
The Shoshone are definitely top tier OP. This game is no where near balanced. In a competitive/fair play game, something like 40% of the civs have to be banned in order to get a balanced game. That's a bit ridiculous. Balance in this game is an absolute joke civ wise. Some of them are absurdly strong while others basically have no abilities in 80% of situations.
Top free win Civs: Spain, Attila, Shoshone, Babylon, Inca, China, Arabia, Mongolia
Other Crazy Civs: Poland, England(Longbows), Egypt(Chariot spam), Russia(Strategic Balance), Aztec(Crazy Growth), Korea
If you got rid of all these civs or toned them down significantly the game would be a lot more fair and balanced. I don't recommend buffing the other civs to match them due to the game getting out of hand with crazy abilities.
If you play with good players who know how to capitalize on OP traits these civs here are all ridiculous assuming you can use their ability. Obviously Aztec are not good if you don't get a river and Egypt is not OP if you don't spam chariots.
