FfH2 0.40 Changelog

Annex said:

I think people are looking for ways to nerf GotN, not make its construction more of an advantage.

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My suggestion was intended to replace how GotN works now, not to be an addition to it. As it stands now, you can set your sliders to zero for a few turns and crank out loads and loads of mercenaries, having them serve as the mainstay of your military. It makes it especially easy to invade another continent: capture the first city and immediately recruit a stack of mercenaries to defend it against the initial wave of counterattacks.

If, by contrast, the GotN only produced one mercenary unit every 5? 8? 10? turns, it would serve only as a supplement to your main military force, not be the core of your military. That's what I was thinking. Maybe to balance it, you could have it go obsolete after a certain late-game tech was researched.

But then they wouldnt really be mercenaries, unless it cost you gold for each one that was built.

Can't you just limit the GOTN to being able to make a max of one mercenary per turn? Still more effecient than the traditional rushing of troops, and you could combine rushing and mercenary buying if you need a fast army, so the wonder still gives you an edge, just not quite so much as before.

Blakmane said:

Which is what traditionally mercs have been used for =)

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Yeah, I fully agree with you. I'm just pointing out the mechanic would be exploited if made in a way that took gold after victory.

Kael has updated the first post: mercenaries will be costing 180gp instead of 120gp.

32. A unit always gets +1 xp for exploring a lair, regardless of the other effects ([NWO]_Valis).

Heh looks like a Christmas wish was granted HO HO HO

Kael said:

31. Expansive trait grants +100% to Settler build rate.

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Thank you.

I'm having a feeling that the 100% bonus might be a bit much, especially with Jonas.
Consider having a Warren, the 100% boost, and being barbarian so not as many dangers in the wild for a lone settler to worry about.

I'm not sure how much the 100% boost will be most of the time, probably more like 50%, and almost none in a food only city.

But Jonas badly needed the boost imo compared to Sheelba given that he offered 2 rather mediocre traits compared to her 2 solid ones as far as i remember. (as did most other Leaders with Expensive compared to their non-expansive counterparts for their civ, if any.
Now Falamar will play really differently from Hannah with really getting millage from Trade routes and many scattered coastal cities. Without her being strictly better in basically any imaginable circumstance.
Cardith finally gets Settlements cheaper and gets up the needed hubs faster.)

Most (all?) leaders with expansive in their respective civs seem weaker than other leaders of their civ (if present).

Maintenance is still a hard limiter to extreme expansion... (and Animals are still a serious enough problem to usually catch a few unescorted settlers. Has been that way the last time i played the clan at least. Which is quite a while ago already...)

Only for Rohanna i can see any! serious potential for any danger (because the civ is allready very neat and her other trait is stellar already.) if you take the stronger leader as a basis for acceptable power. (but still Tasunke should play differently enough to not be shoveled aside by that change.)
But i doubt that it will be a real problem even there.

Also it might seem like a solid temporary trait for adaptive. (or Perpy for that matter. )

I like it.

Sadly the Sidar will get seriously nerfed in 0.40/Ice so far. But it is understandable.
For most of the changes at least (most notably the werwolf thing but also the scrapped Buildings that grant free XP.)
Perhaps if a few additional good wonders will come along that might even it out a bit.

Yeah, the more I think about it I feel like having a settler prod boost on expansive will work out nicely, the question is how big it should be, 100% might work. And yeah, all those leaders you mentioned needed a boost, and I think this might make all those civs have leaders who play slightly different. Its going to be more fun playing an expansive civ now for sure.

Defensive strike appears to make archery overmatch most early game, city attacks, axeman for instance.

As a player you can now use mixed bow and close combat stacks very effectvly against the ai, unless it is taught how to do the same there could possiblly be problems.

If the AI has Archery i see mixed troops rather regularly. (And i find Archery to still be a very expensive tech. Overall still seems like the latest base Tier 2 Unit.)

So this might work out to help the AI more than it does the player. (at least on defending cities. Which is how they have been used mostly. Cannot really comment on the way it will matter for other areas until i test it.)



(If of course you don't play on the highest difficulties and it makes you beat the game easier on your usual difficulty, ramping up the difficulty a level or two might be the better "fix" .)

The AI tend to be good at building archers though.

Blackmantle said:

Maintenance is still a hard limiter to extreme expansion...

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What about further boosting expansive and let it reduce number of city maintence? You're supposed to expand, after all...
@Blackmantle yeah, you're right- although I seriousley doubt Thessa ever getting over the top

I doubt that whould be neccesary.
There are very easy ways around that if you really need (like city states). Sure those options have (sometimes rather hefty) drawbacks (like near inability to sensibly make war for anything but the shortest campaigns). But they should have. Also that might infringe on organized trait to much.

Lets try it out first. 100% already seems like a very hefty boost. (and some of the leaders like Rohanna might get over the top if you still go further.)

Also it doesn't limit overall expansion. Just the speed at which new cities can be planted without going bankrupt...

Blackmantle said:

If the AI has Archery i see mixed troops rather regularly. (And i find Archery to still be a very expensive tech. Overall still seems like the latest base Tier 2 Unit.)

So this might work out to help the AI more than it does the player. (at least on defending cities. Which is how they have been used mostly. Cannot really comment on the way it will matter for other areas until i test it.)



(If of course you don't play on the highest difficulties and it makes you beat the game easier on your usual difficulty, ramping up the difficulty a level or two might be the better "fix" .)

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A fortified archer is likly to be the unit that ends up defending in any combat, so he not only has the defensive strike but then throws the first strike in before comming to grips, this double wammy makes archery rather powerfull, not agaisnt it mind you, just trying out the maths in my head. A archer in a city and dug in just become a very tuff nut to crack.

Archers start with 10 average D-strike damage, 20 max. A level 1 axeman nulls the average damage and cuts the max damage by 60%. A level 5 axeman nulls the max damage.

Basically, opening an attack by sending a well promoted axeman in first will play out in .40 just as it does now, unless the AI starts making drill-specialist archers, which would have their drawbacks.

As for the expansive buff: If it's anything like BtS, this bonus only multiplies the hammers that go towards settlers, the food doesn't get the bonus. So it's not as big as it sounds.

Settler boost might make expansive a truly worth while build. It only ends up being about a 30% increase in most cases because it won't effect the food bonus to prod. Might make Fail-Omar a little more on par with Hanna the Iritated.

I edited the new expansive trait to try the effect for Jonas and it is quite cool. If you build your city on a plains hill and use a wooded plains hill (which isn't really uncommon) you can start with a settler and finish him in 20 turns which can be quite an advantage. Clan of Embers can't anyway do much the first turns except building warriors and goblins. An early second city on the other hand can be a big boost for military and growth. And if you concentrate on settling finally the soldiers you get by your worldspell are useful. Furthermore if you research targeted in the direction of festivals for markets and of cartography for city states you will have a much bigger empire than any human player can have on turn 100 without conquering. If you combine this with conquering you can easily afford it by pillaging improvements and plundering enemy cities. All in all a cool idea that opens some new strategies.

Guild of the Nine could enable a national wonder for all players which is, essentially, a branch of the guild. Having built the branch, that player may now summon mercs just like the original builder. The nation with the headquarters would get various bonuses that are appropriate. Don't feel like I really need to go into detail as there are so many equally good options there.

Edit: Better yet, make it work like a standard building. Call it a mercenary guild or whatever. The wonder simply creates that building in all your cities. Still quite powerful, as you can summon them into newly conquered cities, but no longer utterly unbalanced as anyone can use them for defense.