Diplomatic Effects of Denouncing, Spying, and DoFs

Unfortunately, the espionage screen suggests that the game includes some form of cassus belli or similar justifiable denunciation mechanic. No such thing exists. The AI views your denunciations or DOWs and the spying events that bring up these options to be two completely unrelated phenomena. Being that this is the case, I wish the programmers didn't include the option to denounce or DOW after catching a spy. After all, you can always denounce or DOW them after receiving the notification without the meaningless prompt. Why suggest that there is some relationship between denouncing and spying with a prompt?

Moriarte said:

Yes, you might become unfavorable with some, but in this particular case, so will he. A lesser price to pay if you want to teach someone a lesson.



And you know this how? Care to give example? I used UN example because no one would stand up and say such thing out loud in the UN, knowing no one is going to take him seriously. There is media for such things.

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I know it because I used Logic.

When two nations don't like each other they accuse each other of all sorts of crap in an effort to make the other look bad.

When two nations are friends; accusing the other of a crime would be taken more seriously by independent observers because you would seem to have no alterior motive for making a false accusation.

Dogmouth said:

Unfortunately, the espionage screen suggests that the game includes some form of cassus belli or similar justifiable denunciation mechanic. No such thing exists. The AI views your denunciations or DOWs and the spying events that bring up these options to be two completely unrelated phenomena. Being that this is the case, I wish the programmers didn't include the option to denounce or DOW after catching a spy. After all, you can always denounce or DOW them after receiving the notification without the meaningless prompt. Why suggest that there is some relationship between denouncing and spying with a prompt?

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Yes, agreed, it is quite misleading, but that being said like discussed above I wish there would be a connection. Or maybe we just need two different things: A "denounciation" which you can only use if person actually did something "bad" (as warented by some specific list) - in terms of real life mechanics, think of it as something you have proof of. And then another option, call it "miscredit" or whatever, which you can use unprompted - in terms of real life mechanics, think of it as claiming something without proof. The latter could even be a part of the espionage system.

The important difference between these two should be that denounciating someone should not give you negative influence with third party civs, particularly not if you denounce a friend (although it will of course give you negative influence with him). On the other hand, miscrediting someone should have a chance at backfiring at you - depending on the third party's relationship to you and the other civ, they may be more or less likely to believe you (people who are friendly with you and hostile with them will be more likely to believe you), but if they don't believe you, it will give you a negative influence, even more so if you try to miscredit someone you have a DoF with. If this was part of the espionage system, spy level could also influence your chance of them believing you.

Adsin, such accusation can be viewed as an attempt to gain favorable relationship with a country (civilization), which isn't involved in the conflict, and since there is no proof, but rather accusations only, people are open to doubt such announcements. Hence, i can understand why developers didn't go as far as connecting espionage and denounciations directly in a current game model.

I agree, Kasper, in some cases unconditional support is what you can expect from a third party in a conflict, which can be dependent on various factors, like relationship status, religious connections and such. Personally, i like this idea.