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45°38'N-13°47'E;14283971 said:

I haven't checked the code but I suppose they are different depending if you're using Realistic Corporations or not.

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So it is either <iCorporationMaintenanceModifier> or <iRealCorporationMaintenanceModifier>, right?
In that case with RC it's easy to have corp.maintenance reach 0%, so I don't think it is a problem if its possible without it also. Having the right combo to reach 0% that still has other downsides one has to face.

Zeta Nexus said:

So it is either <iCorporationMaintenanceModifier> or <iRealCorporationMaintenanceModifier>, right?
In that case with RC it's easy to have corp.maintenance reach 0%, so I don't think it is a problem if its possible without it also. Having the right combo to reach 0% that still has other downsides one has to face.

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I check the code and I'll let you know for sure

I am thinking about a new future civic category: Affinity like in Civ BE.
Zlatko is already working on something like this in his mod, so maybe I would borrow things from him.

The idea is this:
This category don't come to play until Trans-Human era. Your base civic is No affinity that has no affects. The 3 choices would become available at about the same time, maybe at the same tech. They would unlock different units and building, give diplo bonus with civs running the same affinity, penalty with those of a different and none with No affinity.

Harmony:
Perfection through gene-manipulation. Cloning. Terraforming. Gene-manipulated war-beasts. Psionics. and bonus.

Supremacy:
Perfection through cybernetics. Mechs. Robots. Cyborgs. Nuke resistance. bonus.

Purity:
Perfection through traditions. Culture. Religion. Martial arts. Great Person bonus. Xp bonus.

The issue is that it comes very, very, very late. At that point, you've won the game. Affinities "work" in Civ:BE because the whole shtick of the game, from turn 1 is all about Affinities.

Besides, I reckon that they're permanent; so when you choose Purity, you're forever rolling with it, something that can't be quite simulate in the Civics system, as far as I know.

Tolni said:

The issue is that it comes very, very, very late. At that point, you've won the game. Affinities "work" in Civ:BE because the whole shtick of the game, from turn 1 is all about Affinities.

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Yes, I am aware of that and disturbs me the most: lot of work for little gain

Besides, I reckon that they're permanent; so when you choose Purity, you're forever rolling with it, something that can't be quite simulate in the Civics system, as far as I know.

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It doesn't have to be the same.
If most of the bonuses would come from buildings, you would lose them when switching to an other.

Zeta Nexus said:

I am thinking about a new future civic category: Affinity like in Civ BE.
Zlatko is already working on something like this in his mod, so maybe I would borrow things from him.

The idea is this:
This category don't come to play until Trans-Human era. Your base civic is No affinity that has no affects. The 3 choices would become available at about the same time, maybe at the same tech. They would unlock different units and building, give diplo bonus with civs running the same affinity, penalty with those of a different and none with No affinity.

Harmony:
Perfection through gene-manipulation. Cloning. Terraforming. Gene-manipulated war-beasts. Psionics. and bonus.

Supremacy:
Perfection through cybernetics. Mechs. Robots. Cyborgs. Nuke resistance. bonus.

Purity:
Perfection through traditions. Culture. Religion. Martial arts. Great Person bonus. Xp bonus.

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I have mixed feelings about it. In general I like the idea. I definitely wouldn't like it for the entire game, but restricting it to Transhuman should be OK and possibly spice up a bit that era. There's the problem that it looks a lot of work since you should add units, buildings and so on and that might break the near perfect equilibrium Vokarya has worked on. And it looks that AI wouldn't know how to use it properly without adequate dll programming which sounds like another big task that I'm not willing to face, to tell the truth. Long story short: nice concept but probably not worth the effort unless you release something half-baked.

Edit: oh, and while current advanced civics could make it to the main mod, this one would not: I don't think everybody would like it, even among those who like your advanced civics.

As I mentioned it would be a future project - I'm not doing it now, just speaking of it -and would probably be a separate module. The goal would be to motivate players to hang on till the end of the game where they can virtually choose a new civ
Locking a civ into one of these affinities could done by setting a longer anarchy period so you can't just flip from one to the other that easily.


An other "scenario module" I have in mind could be called: Civilizations before Us
HORIZON ZERO DAWN Trailer gives the atmosphere what it would contain: Still starting in the ancient era and slowly discovering pieces of an ancient and advanced civilization; killing wild robots for science bonuses and other stuff

Edit: oh, and while current advanced civics could make it to the main mod

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I think it's too late to join the team. Vokarya has declared that he is close to finish his scheduled jobs. Anyone joining you would only delay publishing finale version
So I stick to my original plan: When AND2 is finished start a new project of AND3

Zeta Nexus said:

I am thinking about a new future civic category: Affinity like in Civ BE.
Zlatko is already working on something like this in his mod, so maybe I would borrow things from him.

The idea is this:
This category don't come to play until Trans-Human era. Your base civic is No affinity that has no affects. The 3 choices would become available at about the same time, maybe at the same tech. They would unlock different units and building, give diplo bonus with civs running the same affinity, penalty with those of a different and none with No affinity.

Harmony:
Perfection through gene-manipulation. Cloning. Terraforming. Gene-manipulated war-beasts. Psionics. and bonus.

Supremacy:
Perfection through cybernetics. Mechs. Robots. Cyborgs. Nuke resistance. bonus.

Purity:
Perfection through traditions. Culture. Religion. Martial arts. Great Person bonus. Xp bonus.

Click to expand...

For such a concept to be implemented at its best, you'd have to turn it into a mechanic on its own and rework the transhuman era to play at its fullest with it. Anything else would not be doing it enough justice, I'd say. Plus, not everyone would be up for it, me included.

I think it's too late to join the team. Vokarya has declared that he is close to finish his scheduled jobs. Anyone joining you would only delay publishing finale version
So I stick to my original plan: When AND2 is finished start a new project of AND3

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But as for the advanced civics being surgically inserted into the main mod itself, I'm all for it. Even if I have to wait a little bit more to get my fix!

thegreekweegee said:

For such a concept to be implemented at its best, you'd have to turn it into a mechanic on its own and rework the transhuman era to play at its fullest with it. Anything else would not be doing it enough justice, I'd say. Plus, not everyone would be up for it, me included.

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Okay, it's still just brainstorming.
It's low on my to do list and if I am ever going to do it, it will be a separate module.
However I do have in mind to rework or expand the trans-human era.

But as for the advanced civics being surgically inserted into the main mod itself, I'm all for it. Even if I have to wait a little bit more to get my fix!

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I am working on that fix and hope to publish a version on next week.

In the meanwhile here's a little info of the changes I plan and currently testing:

Changelog:
=========

NICE.

I can barely contain my excitement!

EDIT: Why 0.33 per Magistrate? I'd prefer it if it were 0.5 , because fractions of 3 don't translate well in Civ4...

Ohh, just noticed it...

thegreekweegee said:

NICE.

I can barely contain my excitement!

EDIT: Why 0.33 per Magistrate? I'd prefer it if it were 0.5 , because fractions of 3 don't translate well in Civ4...

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Actually that is 0.34 (just a typo). Assigning 3 citizens to magisters slots can put off an angry citizen. A lawyer, a prosecutor and a judge goes into the pub and

I am close to release an update. Till that a little sneak peek

New guild buildings from VIP mod:

Random loadscreens:

Zeta Nexus said:

Ohh, just noticed it...

Actually that is 0.34 (just a typo). Assigning 3 citizens to magisters slots can put off an angry citizen. A lawyer, a prosecutor and a judge goes into the pub and

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But aren't lawyers worse than Satan?

I am close to release an update. Till that a little sneak peek

New guild buildings from VIP mod:
View attachment 408522View attachment 408523
Random loadscreens:
View attachment 408524View attachment 408525

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One question tho: how will slave markets work, now that slave camps have been axed? Back to how they were?

thegreekweegee said:

But aren't lawyers worse than Satan?

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"I have a deal for you to solve all your problems."

The idea is that legal representation eases unrest.
Maybe a Great Diplomat should also get a +1 or +2 , right?

One question tho: how will slave markets work, now that slave camps have been axed? Back to how they were?

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Yes, as it didn't work as I wanted.
...or you have different experiences? Could you ever make a deal for slaves?

Zeta Nexus said:

"I have a deal for you to solve all your problems."

The idea is that legal representation eases unrest.
Maybe a Great Diplomat should also get a +1 or +2 , right?

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That'd be awesome.

If Great Doctors were a thing, that'd also be awesome.

Yes, as it didn't work as I wanted.
...or you have different experiences? Could you ever make a deal for slaves?

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The AI actually gives slaves as a resource for free! However, if they change from slavery to serfdom/guilds/what have you, the deal's off and you have to find another partner. It was a pain to have to remake deals again and again, as the AI seems to change its civic choices based on RNG, more than anything.

thegreekweegee said:

That'd be awesome.

If Great Doctors were a thing, that'd also be awesome.

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I don't want a new great person. Vokarya had a lot of work with balancing points. Adding a new great person would require a lot of points adding reassigning. And anyway, in my point of view a doctor is a scientist, so a great doctor is a great scientist

The AI actually gives slaves as a resource for free! However, if they change from slavery to serfdom/guilds/what have you, the deal's off and you have to find another partner. It was a pain to have to remake deals again and again, as the AI seems to change its civic choices based on RNG, more than anything.

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So it didn't work as intended. But I'm open to suggestions if you have any...

Zeta Nexus said:

I don't want a new great person. Vokarya had a lot of work with balancing points. Adding a new great person would require a lot of points adding reassigning. And anyway, in my point of view a doctor is a scientist, so a great doctor is a great scientist

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Works for me.

So it didn't work as intended. But I'm open to suggestions if you have any...

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Nah, stick with the roll back. It's for the best.

What on earth is Michael Rosen doing in this thread?

Arakhor said:

What on earth is Michael Rosen doing in this thread?

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Dunno, maybe he plays Civ4 too?

Here are some of my ideas I have posted here earlier in January/February:

Zeta Nexus said:

Haw about later techs unlocking some civic building(s) for despotism?

Secret Police

• 0.3/population
• +3 local rev. stability
• -33% war
• +1free spy
• a free promotion for espionage units

I think a maintenance lowering building would be useful also compete with Monarchy's supremacy in this area. Any idea?

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Zeta Nexus said:

I have 2 more building ideas that could make despotism more attractive (for you, not your citizens )

Labor Camp

• 1 free slave
• 5 slave slots
• 0.25/population
• city need 15% more to grow
• 2 with Liberal or Emancipation

Auschwitz (national wonder)

• 3 free slaves
• 10 slave slots
• +3 for slaves
• -1 population in all cities

EDIT: Okay, that was bad idea.

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I dismissed the idea of Auschwitz for it being a taboo. However it would be good to increase the of slave specialists to make them useful. The only way I know for this is by buildings (a national wonder probably). Any ideas?

Don't overuse the Unhappiness/pop mechanic; it restricts city growth more than it should.

Like Supreme Court is a national wonder for more democratic civilizations, Secret Police could be a national wonder for Despotism users, potentially providing some kind of bonus to security bureaus? For maintenance reduction, Monument of the Dictator fills that niche already.

Now, for Labor camp? Shunt the Slave bonuses there; only caveat is if you want all cities to enjoy them, they have to build the labor camps.

Oh, and I'd put Mind Control Center to Hive, and rename it as something else, like "synchronization center". Or make a new building for it?

But the main problem is, Despotism, compared to the likes of Monarchy and Republic, can be summed up as "just some military and espionage bonuses", while Monarchy has a sexy maintenance reduction and no unhappiness in capital bonus (and infinte nobles with relations bonus isn't too bad!), and Republic having that... monstrosity that has me glued in it to the end of time. Democracy feels like a poor Republic knock-off, and I'd rather go to Monarchy, if I had the choice. Also, Monarchy feels too specialized for the Medieval era; again, Republic wins again, damn the maintenance penalties. Democracy served as a cute little middle ground compared to Federation when it was in gov't, but with the latter moving to territorial governance? Feels like that unnecessary extra. Despotism and Democracy feel too underwhelming compared to Monarchy and Republic, and Monarchy needs a more generalized bonus set to not become less attractive by tech progress...

...welp, I rambled here. Sorry. Point I was trying to make is, Despotism needs a little buff without the addition of buildings, Monarchy wouldn't be hurt by replacing all those specialized bonuses with something more generic, and while Democracy is meant to be Republic-lite for larger civs, I find myself to just stick with Republic anyway despite the crushing maintenance costs. Maintenance costs and high upkeep are all it has, anyway, and I have a lot of money to spare once I finish developing my cities.

Once you release your new version, I'll try fiddle with the civic bonuses and nerf Republic, while "generalizing" Monarchy and buffing Despotism in a more straightforward fashion. Maybe make Democracy not seem so underwhelming if I can. If you like what you see, you can include the changes, and if you wish so, I can do more tweaks, one civic group at a time.