[SCENARIO] Feudal Japan - Sengoku-Jidai

Sweet! I'm working on Shin Sengoku Jidai 1.1 now, but I guess I'll just play this just a bit longer... Just a while... Can't stop yet...

Anyhow, thanks for giving the upward thumb for my release. I'll get it more spin of my own in the next version. But now, I'll play this... Just a while longer...

What exactly has changed in the new version? BTW it still seems to be dated Oct 14th. Is it the right download?

is this warlords or vannila

s.c.dude said:

is this warlords or vannila

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Warlords

Ambreville said:

What exactly has changed in the new version? BTW it still seems to be dated Oct 14th. Is it the right download?

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Yes, it is the correct download - I just edited the download page.

What's changed are some bugs and balance issues - resources, starting positions, there are now 11 playable clans, some costs have been re-jigged, etc. The main change would probably be the new custom unit graphics.

Andrew_Jay said:

What's changed are some bugs and balance issues - resources, starting positions, there are now 11 playable clans, some costs have been re-jigged, etc. The main change would probably be the new custom unit graphics.

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Gotcha. Yes, it does seem to run more smoothly. Great job!

is this scenario up to date with the new warlords patch?

First post here and sorry if this is going to be a bit long winded. I like this period very much and even the early foundations for what happened in the region. I have lived in Tokyo and Seoul for the past 15 years. If this post is misplaced here, please delete it. My thought was that folks interested in this scenario might be interested in an expanded scope.

It would be interesting to think about expanding the scope of this scenario to cover the period from around 200 BC and ending in 1600 AD. It would be nice to cover the interaction between China, Korea and Japan, particularly since the first 1,000 years or so incorporates a lot of interplay in culture, religion and warfare in the region. I guess it would be more of a mod rather than a scenario. I would love to try to do this but I am really just a player without any skills in programming or modifications.

Why cover this period? In China, from the year 200 BC you have the rise of the Han Dynasty, with transitions to the later Jin Dynasty (265 AD), then the Sui (581 AD) and finally the Tang (618 AD). Meanwhile, during that time in Korea you have the demise of the old Choson Kingdom with the rise of the three kingdoms of the Goguryeo, Baekche and Shilla. The Goguryeo beat back the Sui, but later collapse when squeezed between Shilla in alliance with the Tang. Just prior to this, the Baekche Kingdom is more or less wiped out after taking it from both Goguryeo and Shilla. However, Baekche is important in terms of the tie to Japan. In Japan during this time Japan starts out very quiet. You have the initial development and transition from Yayoi to Yamato (covering from around 200 BC to 250 AD), and, you could include the Kofun period which runs you up to around 700 AD. This transitions to the Asuka/Nara period which you can link to the collapse of Baekche in Korea and the cross relationship in terms of culture. By the Nara period, Japan has a degree of national cohesiveness and the emperor system is more or less fixed.

In terms of culture/religion, Shinto and Shamanism are the mainstays in Korea and Japan at first. Buddhist winds blow through China and never really take hold, ending up with a strong footing in Korea by 500 AD. It's from there that it moves on to Japan (thanks to the strong interaction with Baekche) and the construction of the first major Buddhist temple in Japan during the Asuka period. Confucianism instead becomes a mainstay in China, ending up surplanting Buddhism in Korea in 1300 and never making it to Japan. Japan and Korea manage to allow both Shintoism and Shamanism to co-exist with Buddhism (although in Japan, there is more of a conflict between the two both for culture dominance and military support). Zen, starts out in Korea but really finds a "market" in Japan particularly over the next several hundred years; Japan's forms of Buddhism, modified by Zen, become more important politically and militarily than in Korea.

Things in the region are more or less stable until the rise of the Mongols by the 900's, taking control of China and exercising vassalage over Korea. In Japan, the Nara period transitions to Heian with greater interchange with China. The next major really major event in terms of interplay is the Mongol attempted invasion of Japan (1281) and the later weakening and decline of expansionism. This allows the rise of the Choson Dynasty in Korea (around 1300), which interestingly enough chucks out Buddhism as a national religion and adopts Confucianism (although Buddhism stays around as a non-favored religion. During the rise of the Mongols, Japan transitions to the Kamakura period, with the increasing power of local lords over the imperial system and the creation of the non-imperial shogun style leader. The Kamakura period ends in the early 1300's with the free style interclan wars for the next 300 years. It's during the last 50 years of the period where you run from Oda Nobunaga to Hideyoshi to Tokugawa. In the 1590's, Hideyoshi decides it's time to take China but does Korea instead. The Chinese, more or less asleep for most of this period, provide some assistance to the Choson Kingdom.

The interplay during the entire period has a whole lot of "what ifs." It seems the kind of thing that would be fun to create something out of, including scripting some of the major events. Again, I really apologize for the terribly long post, but I find the interrelationships here very fascinating. If anyone has any interest, I would be willing to help out as much as I can.

Erm, I loaded the mod up on warloads, and tried playing a scenario, only wbquicksave showed up, so I clicked on that, I could only choose Louis XIV and then when I clicked play, I started in a water tile and the resulting map looked nothing like Japan. This is probably my error, and I was wondering how I could fix it.

Anthraxus899 said:

Erm, I loaded the mod up on warloads, and tried playing a scenario, only wbquicksave showed up, so I clicked on that, I could only choose Louis XIV and then when I clicked play, I started in a water tile and the resulting map looked nothing like Japan. This is probably my error, and I was wondering how I could fix it.

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In your "Mods" directory there should be a short-cut to launch the game directly (either that, or load the file from the "Sengoku-Kidai/Public Maps" folder).

I'm really sorry about this part of the scenario - I never did find the correct way to get a mod/scenario to load like the official Warlords scenarios.

Finally got a chance to play my own scenario the other day

I thought I'd share a brief After Action Report.

It was an interesting game, I choose Mori, giving me a fairly sheltered start position. I quickly took Hiroshima and the other town to the west. As soon as I got my first new military units (Yari Samurai) I attacked Toyotomi, my immediate neighbour. That didn't go so well - especially when they became a vassal of the leader, Hojo (who already had vassalised Imagawa, Usuegi and Oda) - but I eventually took their cities (and Oda's) and made peace with everyone.

With a period of relative peace, I worked on taking those three Ikko-Ikki cities on the island of Shikoku, developing my economy, and improving my relationship with Chosokabe and Shimazu on Kyūshū. However, Chosokabe got dog pilled by everyone, and while they were a pretty good friend, they weren't that good a friend I threw myself into the war before anyone else could make any gains - especially because this was a clan right on borders. It was over quickly and painlessly.

While keeping Shimazu 'Friendly', I looked to continuing my military build-up started with the previous, brief, campaign. My next target was Takeda - who had leap-frogged over Tokugawa territory to take Kyoto and had just built the Shogun's Bakafu (diplomatic victory) in Edo. With our shared borders and my new defensive pacts with Data, Shimazu and Tokugawa, our relations were very poor. Around the same time Christianity came into my territory and I briefly converted to see if I couldn't push Takeda even further - it worked and it was a four-on-one war

I take Kyoto in a very bloody conflict - the first turn saw everyone involved getting at least one Warlord Great Person (it's a constant 30 XP for each in this scenario). Even better, at the conclusion of the war which left Takeda with three cities I was able to make Tokugawa a vassal - rather impressive considering that they were the fourth largest clan (behind myself, Hojo and Date).

What followed was a period of massive military build-up (the tech tree had been researched and almost every city was fully improved). Takeda and I continue to compete in elections for a new Shogun - even though they were in a distant third behind myself and Hojo.

I guess Hojo wasn't too happy about being left out and went to war with Takeda to take Edo and the Bakafu. That drew nearly everyone in once again, and I participated on Takeda's side which allowed me to pick up their cities after they had been taken by Hojo, including Edo. Then, partway through the war, I won the diplomatic victory.

Andrew, this looks like a SUPERB mod/scenario, but I can't run it.

Like some other people have posted on this thread, when I either load the mod and try to load the Japan map -- or when I load directly from the map in the Public Maps file -- I experience a string of problems and the scenario won't run.

Specifically, the game loads to the leader selection screen, but it only allows me to play Tokugawa (the green player). The game then tries to load, but the map remains black and blank and I immediately get a message saying that "I have been defeated."

I suspect that I, and the other people experiencing like problems, are doing something fundamentally and very simply wrong, and that the fix is pretty easy. Certainly others on this thread seem to run the Sengoku mod with no trouble. For your information, I am running a fully patched version of Civ IV and a patched version of Warlords.

So, Andrew, if you or anyone else could shed some light on the problem I'm having, hopefully suggest a fix, I'd really appreciate it. I would love to play this great mod.

Thanks in advance,
Dan

Andrew, great mod that captures the wonderful flavor and color of the Civ 3 Shogun-era scenario.

I can only load it going through "My Computer" etc. I can't seem to put up a desktop shortcut.

Regardless, thanks for making my Civ 4 experience much more enjoyable.

About loading the scenario, I can only apologise to everyone. I don't know what the problem is, but for some reason I could never get such a simple feature to work.

So yeah, you will have to load it through the "WorldBuilderSave" file in Warlords/Mods/Sengoku-Jidai/Public Maps

dandavis92277: are you sure that you have the file directories right? When I finished the scenario I personally deleted my own files and installed the download - which worked fine for me, and apparently most other people.

I'd suggest trying it again - delete all of the Sengoku-Jidai files you have and try unzipping the download into your mods folder again. Select "unzip here", rather than "unzip to Sengoku-Jidai", which would give you an extra layer of folders: "Warlords/Mods/SengokuJidai/Sengoku-Jidai/Public Maps" (which you don't want).

The folder structure you want is:

Warlords
.Mods
..Sengoku-Jidai
...Public Maps
...."Sengoku-Jidai.CivWarlordsWBSave"

This is really fun to play. Great job by the way.

For the future, I believe there is a bug with one of the barbarian cities I captured. Shoot, now that I've closed it, i can't remember any names, but I started as the orange clan on one of the western most islands, with the green clan (I believe their city was oda) and a few barbarian cities. I captured one, Fukuoka? I think, it had iron. However, it treated everything as if it were a settler or worker, putting all food and production towards building it, but never growing beyond size one. So even though i was building an archer, it never grew. Just an FYI.

I'm going to play some more, maybe start up north.

Are you sure it was everything?

The initial archer and spearman units (Ashigaru Archer and Yari Ashigaru) are supposed to be built with food.

Ahhh, I cannot be sure now. If I see it again I will check and let you know.

Hi, this mod looks great and I really want to play it, but I keep running into the same problem. Everytime I load up the mod, it immidiately says that I've been defeated and the game ends.

Any idea what I'm doing wrong? I made sure to install the mod in the warlords/mod/SengokuJidai folder and made sure there wasn't an extra layer. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Great mod!!
I just finished the game via domination using Hojo.


Some suggestion:

-Aquebuiser needs more balancing, pretty useless now. It comes too late, can only be built by christian cities AND only has Str 8 (same as samurai). I would expect a unit that comes so late in the game and comes with so restricted condition to at least have some usage. I am not building any of these as I don't see their advantages over the lower tier Samurai.
Maybe jack up his str to 10 or more, or give them more bonus VS melee/archer. Maybe loosen the requirement of Christian city? Speaking of Christian, I don't see any other use of this religion other than being able to build Aquebuiser... hmm

-Great general is pumping out like mad, due to the linear birth rate. I am not sure if this is a good idea, when u get too many of them, their value diminishes. I would prefer a slower birth rate or even an exponential birth rate.


-Endgame snowball effect.
The game is fun from the beginning till mid-game, after that when my empire reaches a big enough size, ~8 cities , the rest of the game is just mopping up the other AI. Since the AI don't expand and goto war with each other much, by the time I got a decent empire, they are still owning 3-4 cities each.
Also, once all techs has been research, we could just switch to 100% wealth and these can be used to rushbuy every single build. Resulting in a landslide production boost.
is not useful as happiness is not a problem, see the following point:
I know that this aspect is difficult to fix, right now I have no idea yet...


-Happiness no problem.
Happiness is a challenging and fun problem... in the early game tho. Once my empire expand to a decent size and is able to secure enough happiness resource + happy boosting tech/civic, happiness problem extinct. War weariness is not a problem at all in my game.
The larger your empire is, the better...this totally counter the civ4 concept. There should be some form of penalty for larger empire, citizen unhappy, maintanence killing the empire etc.


-Barb ships are annoying. They appear randomly and destroy my fishing boat. Not sure if their existance aid the gameplay.


-This is just personal preference
3D Tokugawa clone I personally prefer an unanimated 2D leaderhead



Things I liked:
-The Map. Nicely done, resources/tree/forest nicely placed.
-The units..
-The city improvements
-The music



All in all, very good mod! good job

looks great! has anybody tried this as a multiplayer yet?

Fantastic mod--I don't know if anyone else has said this in another post, but one problem (or maybe it was intentional?) is that it seems almost impossible to win via diplomacy. Everyone loved each other (and was annoyed with me) for the entire game--EVEN WHEN THEY WERE AT WAR WITH ONE ANOTHER!!
I actually asked two AIs who were fighting a protracted war how they felt about the other, and both were pleased. Even when I allied with one of them, they were still more annoyed with me!

Still, a great scenario (one of my two favorites that doesn't require any other mod, which is a weakness of many of the current scenarios--the other fav is pirates). Loved it--won at Prince with Tokugawa. Please make more, and thanks!