TSG126 Results and Congratulations!

A list of the submissions for this game is here for your viewing

The list is compiled by fastest turn victory and by score.

TSG 126 was the Austrian Emperor Domination game.

Congratulations goes to:
bc1 with a turn 172 (1120 AD) win
anakin.del with a turn 196 (1360 AD) win
WackenOpenAir with a turn 210 (1500 AD) win

High score awards go to:
Nufro with a score of 7727
DeoB with a score of 5958
CatGarfield with a score of 4761


There were 263 downloads with 28 entries and no exclusions for this game.

Congratulations to the trophy winners and to all who played this game and participated in the discussions.

Interesting. This goes on to show that the speed bonus ratio is pretty simplistic, approximating to linear:


Not sure if it's different for higher difficulties? If should be, IMO as quick games require a lot more skill at Deity/Immortal.

As is, even I could get the highest score *and* get a 1% bonus, duh. And I can tell you right now, my skill level is not half that of the folks from the top winners section.

we have only recently started publishing score results. not many have shown that to be their preferred competition angle yet. the numbers may grow though but it remains to be seen. thanks for taking an interest in it.

HR

The real problem with competing with high score is the amount of time it takes to play a game that attempts to maximize score. There are 2 ways of doing it, either win extremely quickly in ancient era on small map, or attempt a total domination game and fill the map with many cities that translates to high population score. In that case, games can take more than 10-20 hours if you micromanage and many don't have that much time to spend on a single game. My experience is that past 300 turns, it is almost always better to play as close as possible to turn 500 winning the specified VC.

i think it will take many players to learn how to optimize score. our little Civ5 world here at CFC never seemed to really demand score-based competitions that i can remember. but it is something 'new' for them to strategize around. some might find it entertaining a few times to try and maximize score.

but yes, it can be a much longer game if you go to t499 micromanaging every step of the way. i think i still dont have my Time VC achievement yet, haha.

No kidding, check out my 29-hour iron butt journey there. And someone else clocked 31 hours, I think...

Score is a more or less random formula. Instead of playing the game, you would be playing the formula.

Is it the game score algorithm ? Then it's not random at all and you can reach the 20K if you feel like wasting your life managing 150 cities. It's interesting to look at but trying to optimize it is not very fun.

The staff of the Civ3 GOTM introduced and kept changing their own formula.

Ribannah said:

The staff of the Civ3 GOTM introduced and kept changing their own formula.

Click to expand...

This is ancient history, please let us leave it that way. Civ3 does not apply to Civ5.
Thanks.

There was a high score Deity GOTM with max turns set to 250 some time ago, I thought that was a pretty cool concept. Standard sized maps are just too big for 400-500 turn games with 15000+ points. Having a turn limit makes it playable and I think it can really test your ability as both a warmonger and a builder.

vadalaz said:

There was a high score Deity GOTM with max turns set to 250 some time ago, I thought that was a pretty cool concept. Standard sized maps are just too big for 400-500 turn games with 15000+ points. Having a turn limit makes it playable and I think it can really test your ability as both a warmonger and a builder.

Click to expand...

As someone who has close to zero time to play this game personally, I am all for a 250 turn time game. The first 150 turns don't take that long, its turns 150-250 where you have troops all over the map keeping your lands safe where the turn times are atrociously long. I can't imagine turns 250-500 above King difficulty, I did it once on prince when I first discovered the sacred sites strategy and had far more time to play this game. I lost, a time game, on prince, to greece of all people, because I had no idea that the tourism counter doesn't start until you meet someone and I didn't find him until close to turn 200. Sacred sites doesn't work that late lol. Man have I come far since those dark days...

My PC cannot handle the masses of units that appear on Deity after turn 250 or so. I have no choice but to finish sooner than that.

nufro said:

Interesting. This goes on to show that the speed bonus ratio is pretty simplistic, approximating to linear:

Spoiler :

Final Score = CEIL(Score * Max Turn / Victory Turn)

Not sure if it's different for higher difficulties? If should be, IMO as quick games require a lot more skill at Deity/Immortal.

Click to expand...

The formula you quote is used to convert your base score to a final score if you are victorious, giving you a fast victory bonus. But that doesn't explain how the base score is calculated. I believe your base score uses a weighted sum of territory, population, wonders and technologies, and maybe more elements - and includes a factor for difficulty level.

Correct, all I wanted to understand is how "valuable" a score medal is compared to a speed achievement. And my personal conclusion is, not very

The weighed base score formula is more meaningful, but only so much. It's based on the metrics that cause AI reprisals, which in turn are coded assumptions of proximity to victory. And as the best players here show, those assumptions are far from perfect as some of the great victories seen here are very fast and fairly low score. Rendering the "adjusted" score for those completely meaningless.

E.g. bc1's base score for this one was 1106 and the adjusted score was 3252, after a turn 172 victory. My score was 7650 (7727 adjusted) after a turn 499 victory. The reason I went for the score victory is that the speed victory wasn't achievable for me -- I understood that when I dragged past t.220.

What score could he achieve if he went all the way to turn 499, leaving one meaningless capital around and growing all the cities instead? My bet is that his could have been at least double mine. Then, the speed bonus formula is 4x off; it should be hyperbolic, not linear.

At the higher difficulty, things are completely out of whack. Consider anakin.del's turn 127 Cultural Deity figures: base 640, adjusted 2560. Even less than a t.172 Domination win on Prince?? This win easily deserves a 30k adjusted score, in my mind, 12x off.

Sorry for the wall of text, I get carried away sometimes...

Score games can go in the 15-20K range on standard if you play to T530 and maximize it by spamming cities.

530? Why did I think it ends at 500?

It defaults to 500 turns at Standard speed.

Mistake then.

I'm not sure that somebody who gets a 200 or 225 win on deity is necessarily gonna do as well in score as someone that played out a wider slower game. They could very well be in no position to expand militarily vs established AI.