Venice discussion

Hm, I guess I was thinking Astronomy or one of the later Naval techs rather than Optics. So, yeah, get Writing, get to Optics and Bronze Working (if possible) and bulb IW, etc...

What would be VERY nice is if you could somehow get to unlock the Galleass with the bulb from the Library, but IIRC they removed that capability with G&K, more or less.

But yeah, most certainly going to go with a puppet empire with Venice.

InsanelyApple said:

I want to see when Enrico is defeated (you destroy his empire), he starts walking away, walks into something, and falls overs! (Because he can't see where he is going)

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Hey watch it with the blind jokes, a blind person may be reading these forums.

You guys are being incredibly offensive. The clear lack of insight is unnecessary and you best cut it out for the foreseeable future

this whole train of conversation is incredibly shortsighted. try and see things from their point of view.

This looks like reddit, I can see why this might be fun, but can we try and make this look less like reddit?....

No need to blind ourselves with the sight pointless clutter.

sukritact said:

This looks like reddit....

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Fixed for ya

Enrico Dandolo looks like the greatest leader ever.

Gucumatz said:

Fixed for ya

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Look again!

cybrxkhan said:

Enrico Dandolo looks like the greatest leader ever.

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I wonder how they make his eyes look in the leader scene...

But yeah, playing as Venice is going to be way different, I mean I don't think I've ever even puppeted a city before (just because of the lack of control)

kingchris20 said:

I wonder how they make his eyes look in the leader scene...

But yeah, playing as Venice is going to be way different, I mean I don't think I've ever even puppeted a city before (just because of the lack of control)

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When you play Venice, you have to see things from a different perspective.

cybrxkhan said:

When you play Venice, you have to see things from a different perspective.

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See! This is the sort of this that has to stop appearing!

kingchris20 said:

I wonder how they make his eyes look in the leader scene...

But yeah, playing as Venice is going to be way different, I mean I don't think I've ever even puppeted a city before (just because of the lack of control)

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Really? In >2000 hours of gameplay I could probably count the number of times I annexed on my fingers and toes. Annexing is a slightly better option since G&K (because of the yield penalty) but still a very rare choice for me (because SPs and national wonders are more worthwhile).

I always puppet any conquered cities, it's a good way to earn extra science and GOLD.

I can tell you this, Venice IS going to be a monster of a civ after all, and quite frankly I stay within 5 custom cities by default anyway, but it is also the first time I will have to go beyond my ICS-sprawl expansion (built cities only within 3 tiles of another city).

sukritact said:

See! This is the sort of this that has to stop appearing!

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I cant watch this anymore

Louis XXIV said:

The Huns don't have other cities because there were no other Hunnic cities. There were other Venetian cities, so there's no reason not to give them a city-list to account for two Venices in the game.

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Sure they could. I just don't know if they'll do it

We will see it anyways (Man, I didn't want to pile onto that joke, it is really lame after all, can't you see?)

kingchris20 said:

But yeah, playing as Venice is going to be way different, I mean I don't think I've ever even puppeted a city before (just because of the lack of control)

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Really? Not even for the turns until it comes out of resistance? For me, it's necessary to puppet sometimes as you can't stomach all those annexed cities right now anyways. Of course it's the right thing to annex them eventually, but not at the start. My rule of thumb is to annex cities as soon as they reach 10 population and I've enough money to rushbuy the happiness buildings (or now in BNW send trade routes to build them quickly).

No Canal unique building??

I wonder what happens when your capital gets captured. Do you get to annex one of your cities and make it the new capital? Do you run an empire consisting entirely of puppets like some sort of Illuminati? Do you just lose instantly?

The UA actually sounds pretty cool...especially on an Earth map.

mitsho said:

Sure they could. I just don't know if they'll do it

We will see it anyways (Man, I didn't want to pile onto that joke, it is really lame after all, can't you see?)



Really? Not even for the turns until it comes out of resistance? For me, it's necessary to puppet sometimes as you can't stomach all those annexed cities right now anyways. Of course it's the right thing to annex them eventually, but not at the start. My rule of thumb is to annex cities as soon as they reach 10 population and I've enough money to rushbuy the happiness buildings (or now in BNW send trade routes to build them quickly).

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That makes sense, I don't guess I really ever understood the concept of puppeting. I always just take the happiness hit until they come out of resistance and get the courthouse built. I just want to decide what is built from the get-go. I'll have to read up on puppeting.

A few issues I've thought of

The first has been mentioned:

Harald B said:

I wonder what happens when your capital gets captured. Do you get to annex one of your cities and make it the new capital? Do you run an empire consisting entirely of puppets like some sort of Illuminati? Do you just lose instantly?

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Also, it seems as though Venice cannot win domination; what happens when you conquer a capital? You can't raze capitals, and Venice can't puppet or annex cities. Taking over capitals for domination: impossible

Venice has enormous drawbacks for diplomatics: Many votes come from city-states, but as Venice's only way to grow is to poppet city states, amount of city-states in the world diminish. Can puppeted City-states count as votes anyway?

OCC challenges mostly ended in cultural victories, because having a tall empire had its benifits then, but with culture victory revamped, it seems as though here too wide civilizations have a head up front.

Science Victory is also close to impossible, because you would have to get a bunch of city-states bought with Merchant to get the science that the other extremely wide civs have in the game due to number of cities. I don't think you could get enough Merchants efficiently while making sure:
a) Venice isn't loosing too much food from specialists
b) great scientist points can still be made for the tile improvements
c) citizens are still used to make the production needed for science buildings and defensive work (OCC often fall victim to wide cities if they don't concentrate on defence)

Lastly, I wonder, how will you protect all your lands, because city-states will surely not be crowded all around you. The city-states you buy will end up beng a ways away from you, and if your empire is spread out too much:
a) its hard to defend your lands
b) many civs get mad at you for taking their lands

Im sorry if I have brought up points made already, but these things really make me wonder about Venice and how the civ will work out.