SGOTM 14 - Kakumeika

Sun Tzu Wu... waiting
mabraham... wating
Tachywaxon... waiting
Walter_Wolf... waiting
Kaitzilla... UP NOW
frogdude... on deck
bcool... in the hole
shulec... waiting
 
comments in blue
  • most cities are building Wealth, some having just finished other builds. We can run at about 50% and finish Music in 2 turns, so we should build less Wealth and do more important things, like a NEpic in GPfarm and some lighthouses in our coastal cities. It is inconceivable that the AIs can tech Music in one turn, so we are not in such a hurry we should be giving up on important builds
    I think the wealth building is just a place holder for the next person, but I agree we should build less wealth build the things mabraham suggests
  • we do have a "-1 you traded with our worst enemy" penalty on the western witches
  • both southern and western witches have MC (but not East, unlike what Tachy has said)
  • both northern and west witches just finished researching a tech, so we do not know what they have started yet
  • eastern witches are about to finish HBR
  • we have two other spies and our missionary in position to move to Trojan Horse. James Bond still has only 30% fortification bonus.
    yes unfortunately the spy produced in washington should have been sent to Boston to rack up stationary bonuses for a potential steal of monarchy or something else in the future
  • we have started to improve ivory and some calendar resources - but we should stop improving the incense and do something else, because the incense takes twice as long to build on desert
    I agree and we should improve the spices near the capital before putting a cottage on a river plains tile.
  • we have spent five worker turns building roads to Trojan Horse that we don't need for our spy travel
    I disagree. We needed at least one of these roads so a spy can dash in on the same turn that a spy steals a tech, so we can start the stationary bonus 1 turn earlier. The road on the grass hill isn't a complete waste, since that might be our tile in the long term and that worker is in position to jump in and help gems city now. And I suggested that micro/build priority for that worker
  • our galley is still in Silver City
    I think the galley just finished. I think tachy sacrificed this build for currency and then music a little bit. Reasonable sacrifices, although yes it would been nice to have the galley finish earlier if at all possible. A late galley here is worse than part of a lighthouse.
 
We needed at least one of these roads so a spy can dash in on the same turn that a spy steals a tech, so we can start the stationary bonus 1 turn earlier.

My memory of testing I did a long time ago was that the stationary bonus does not accrue if you move to the tile and skip remaining movement points.... oh now I remember... spies have 1 movement point, not two :blush: I was expected we could move from our culture using two movement points.

So we do want at least one of those roads for spy travel :)
 
Summary of the recommendations for PPP in the future

Based on what we have learned from about the complexity of the game and Tachy's latest experience with her turnset... Going forward I suggest the following process for our turnsets.

  • Post a "got it" as early as you can after the previous player. If you don't think you will be able to produce a PPP and play within 3-4 days time, please pass your turn. If you wait more than 24 hours to communicate with us, we will give the save to the next person.
  • Post a rough list of goals you think we want to accomplish in your turnset as quickly as you can.
  • Put up a "basic" PPP that details the tech, diplomacy plans (including resource trades) and intended responses to common demands or events, civic changes, city builds (not micro but what you expect each city to build), war preparations, espionage, great people plan (production and intended uses), worker goals (not necessarily what they do each turn), unit goals/intended destinations, stopping(pausing) conditions, and an end of turn checklist. Please try to do this as quickly as possible and at least before 24 hours after you posted a got it.
  • Detail only the micro (city tiles workers, worker moves) for any city you deem critical for your goals in the turnset. Or that other team members want more details for. Use your best judgment on how much detail you want to put into other aspects of the plan.
  • After ~24 hours after the initial PPP is posted, post another PPP that incorporates the feedback that you agree with or the majority of the team agrees with. And post, with as much notice as you can, when you intend to play.
  • When you reach a stopping point (or pausing point) please post screenshots and other information other players would need to make an informed decision to the forum and wait up to an hour if you can for others to give you feedback on the decision.
 
Tachy also had a good recommendation for the future to reduce clutter on the forum...

If you propose a tactic or trick and it can be tested or confirmed using the test game, please check to make sure your tactic or trick works in the test game before proposing it to the group.
 
Tachy also had a good recommendation for the future to reduce clutter on the forum...

If you propose a tactic or trick and it can be tested or confirmed using the test game, please check to make sure your tactic or trick works in the test game before proposing it to the group.

Not everyone has enough time to do this. I recommend this if people have time, but if not, please still make the suggestion, someone else may be able to test it.

Tachy, you have noted that you and bcool are having correspondence about the SGOTM outside the thread (I believe yus said email.) If you guys are talking strategy, can you please put these communications in the thread. If it is non-strategic banter, then please disregard.

P.S. Nice turnset Tachy!
 
Not everyone has enough time to do this. I recommend this if people have time, but if not, please still make the suggestion, someone else may be able to test it.

Tachy, you have noted that you and bcool are having correspondence about the SGOTM outside the thread (I believe yus said email.) If you guys are talking strategy, can you please put these communications in the thread. If it is non-strategic banter, then please disregard.

P.S. Nice turnset Tachy!

If you can't easily test it, but think the contribution is valuable by all means let us know. Please give us some idea of how confident you are about the tactic/strategy if you can't test it however.

I'm guilty of cluttering up the thread, so I will at least try not to suggest things I can't test myself.

All relevant information exchanged with Tachy by email has been and will continue to be reproduced here.

edit: oh and exchanged by email: :goodjob: tachy :)
 
Not everyone has enough time to do this. I recommend this if people have time, but if not, please still make the suggestion, someone else may be able to test it.

Tachy, you have noted that you and bcool are having correspondence about the SGOTM outside the thread (I believe yus said email.) If you guys are talking strategy, can you please put these communications in the thread. If it is non-strategic banter, then please disregard.

P.S. Nice turnset Tachy!

Yes, that was a fault of mine that began when the server went down and I wanted to speed up my turn-set, so I had to use that way of communication.
Believe, nothing is so secretive and additional to the trade of Calendar, Currency for Construction, Monotheism plus 80 gold.
 
Not everyone has enough time to do this. I recommend this if people have time, but if not, please still make the suggestion, someone else may be able to test it.

This recommendation is somewhat self-whipping for taking a whole page (and a half) about tech overflow. I should have tested it, then the decision would have been much faster.
There is a problem though...nobody tested what I advanced too. That is why I tested it out because SunTzuWu post about patches made me nervous.
 
Well done Tachy, that was a complex turn set!

Some observations on the current game position at start T115:
  • most cities are building Wealth, some having just finished other builds. We can run at about 50% and finish Music in 2 turns, so we should build less Wealth and do more important things, like a NEpic in GPfarm and some lighthouses in our coastal cities. It is inconceivable that the AIs can tech Music in one turn, so we are not in such a hurry we should be giving up on important builds
  • we do have a "-1 you traded with our worst enemy" penalty on the western witches
  • both southern and western witches have MC (but not East, unlike what Tachy has said)
  • both northern and west witches just finished researching a tech, so we do not know what they have started yet
  • eastern witches are about to finish HBR
  • we have two other spies and our missionary in position to move to Trojan Horse. James Bond still has only 30% fortification bonus.
  • we have started to improve ivory and some calendar resources - but we should stop improving the incense and do something else, because the incense takes twice as long to build on desert
  • we have spent five worker turns building roads to Trojan Horse that we don't need for our spy travel Edit: duh, yes we do want one of them because a spy unit has only one movement point. Somehow I thought they had two
  • our galley is still in Silver City

Thank you, mabraham. I was too exhausted and advanced into the night to make a summary right away.

About all city wealth, there is no much cities running wealth, when a build was finished, I simply put wealth as standard response. The next player will make changes as it is not irreversible. In reality, only 2 side-cities builds wealth for a short period and Isengard for 1 turns (was T114).

Normally, I should play T115 as my PPP said it in the title, but I prefer let Kaitzilla takes the flame. Civ was taking too much time in my nights. :crazyeye:
 
Fake Ragnar/Wicked Witch of the East has now Spices. By cancelling free pigs and then make the trade we liberate our spices for trade. Nonetheless, I am bit against it but it is a suggestion.

Where are all the barbs in the hub, I did encounter any. That behavious is similar to Archipelago map.

If you are patient, shulec, you will see the end of my turn-set, more or less at least. I don't know yet if I have to complete T115. That is okay, shulec.



Where are all the barbs? That is a good question.

The scouting done up to T115 indicates a broken wheel map as Tachywaxon mentioned earlier. None of the regions appear to connect to each other so far except through spoke merging right before the central wasteland area. My best estimate is that constant scouting of the central wasteland by 8AI is preventing barbs from spawning as they should.

Heroic epic will not be built any time soon. :blush: If we want it, that barb city up near Elizabeth is looking tasty. Perhaps a swordsman who lets a catapult bomb the city defenses to 0% can attack, promotion heal to medic, attack following the catapult, rest and heal up, attack again to get 8xp.
 
I think we have to decide if we want to start gearing up for war in Kaitzilla's turnset. I think if we do, we should go almost all out in our preparations.

It will be difficult to do this and organize a trip to the barb city near Elizabeth I think. Since a catapult and a sword and a galley would need to be built and likely would be there for quite some time. I think I would rather whip up an army without the HE and use the sword, catapult, and galley to get a bigger army to the eastern witches.
 
Broad Goals for T115-T125:

Finish Teching Music in 2 turns.
Trade Music to West Witches for Metal Casting+best 2nd tech
Steal Theology in 2 turns.
Revolt to Organized Religion+Slavery in 1 turn.
Revolt to Taoism in 1 turn.
Tech Paper T119-T125
Bulb a good chunk of Education, don't bulb Compass
Spend 6 turns mass spreading Taoism.
Cities that get Taoism whip more Missionairies.
When 3 Missionaires are walking and no more can be whipped, whip forges



Capital whips a marketplace after whipping a forge, then purely grows to work all cottages again while building military naturally.

I am torn whether to cottage or farm Marble City. Any thoughts?

GPFarm will probably spend this turnset building National Epic.



Workers build Calendar resources and mines, then connect all 9 cities to Culture Bridge with roads when enough good tiles are completed to keep whipping cities occupied during the war starting around T130-T135.

While the rest of the empire waits for the Taoism/Forges wave, they build lighthouses, settlers, and scout chariots. I want 2 more cities in our empire. One a few tiles north of our capital, and Whale City who can steal Gem Citie's Seafood. Gems City will have plenty of food resources, and Whale City can be a good whipping post later on with Sheep and Seafood.



I Want to send our Great spy down Mansa's spoke to scout Monty's land. I want our scout chariot to explore Ghenghis' land and those mystery mountains. I want a 2nd not-yet-built scout chariot to explore Elizabeth's land and assist the first scout chariot with those mountains. I want a 3rd not-yet-built scout chariot to explore the South Witches land. I want the scout workboat up north to keep trying to circle around the edge of the map establishing trade routes.


We are shaping up to be friends with North and West Witches. East Witches are practically useless to us diplomatically with their closed borders, and South Witches are hated by East/West witches. I will continue to snub South/East Witches and try to build relations with North/West Witches.

What is the status on our begging? Who have we begged and when did we do it?
 
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