How to fix unhappiness?

PawelS said:

I meant that if it were possible, it would decrease the unhappiness (which is what this thread is about).

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I thought puppets generate the same amount of unhappiness as regular cities, just less than conquered ones. But from the video we've seen, after creating puppet from 2nd-level city, happiness actually grew. So without seeing actual buildings inside it we can't say for sure.

I really hope final civilopedia will contain exact numbers, not just "more" and "better".

stealth_nsk said:

I thought puppets generate the same amount of unhappiness as regular cities, just less than conquered ones. But from the video we've seen, after creating puppet from 2nd-level city, happiness actually grew. So without seeing actual buildings inside it we can't say for sure.

I really hope final civilopedia will contain exact numbers, not just "more" and "better".

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Only Annexed Cities add additional Unhappiness over the normal Unhappiness from a city and its population, this has been confirmed, it says as such in the Unhappiness tool tip too, Puppet Cities thus give the same Unhappiness that Normal Cities give.

12agnar0k said:

Please stop using 2 as "to or too", it should only ever be used as two.

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12agnar0k said:

Their would be no point in turning a normal city...

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Dude, don't yell at people for grammar mistakes if you're going to make them yourself. Their should be There.

12agnar0k said:

Only Annexed Cities add additional Unhappiness over the normal Unhappiness from a city and its population, this has been confirmed, it says as such in the Unhappiness tool tip too, Puppet Cities thus give the same Unhappiness that Normal Cities give.

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If it's true, it doesn't make much sense to cerate puppet cities, especially when you have the tech to build courthouses.

I'd say the #1 thing you'll need to do to control unhappiness as a warmonger is planning. You should know well in advance that you wanna hold a city you plan to take and plan accordingly for happiness, rather than just be on a rampage of destruction randomly deciding whether to take or puppet cities as you conquer them.

I like how the new mechanics should affect warmongering. I don't think it'll stifle conquest, but it'll require a more balanced approach and be a little more involved than just spamming units and rolling.

Louis XXIV said:

Dude, don't yell at people for grammar mistakes if you're going to make them yourself. Their should be There.

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Dude, it isn't the grammer that is the issue, it is the use of jargon/lingo instead of actually using the proper words (or at least attempting to); or using an obsecure phrase when a standard phrase has already been determined. Though I admit that in a forum such as this not everyone has been exposed to the game material and so chastising them for not using something they may not have read is not very helpful. Simply pointing out the "better term" in a helpful (not critical) manner is probably best.

12agnar0k said:

Please stop using 2 as "to or too", it should only ever be used as two.

*Mutters to himself in the corner, damn kid's, confusing this old man*

Schuesseled Explained the various ways of increasing your happiness.

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12agnar0k said:

Oh okay, well.... the term "Very Unhappy" can be used to describe that rather than "Unhappiness level 2", Its the term used in the official community Happiness feature.
[...]
It would be less confusing if people didnt make up terms for things that already have them.

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I can't help but noticing, that this is the second time that you are slightly criticizing my posts because of abbreviations you obviously don't really understand.

In Contrast to "REX", which is a well known term in the CIV-community, there is no "official" community-abbrevation for a "very unhappy" Empire in CIV V. This will emerge over time.

My "unhappiness penalty 2" was a direct response to Schuesseled's post:

Schuesseled said:

Correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not, i'm just being polite) but doesn't unhappiness penalty 2 prevent the building of settlers.

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This is by the way the post you mention to be as an explanation of "the various ways of increasing your happiness".

Even the OP speaks of "levels" of unhappiness:

remconius said:

At the first level of unhappiness , growth is slowed. At the second level also military receives a combat penalty.

Let's say you are at war and running at first level of unhappiness and you annex an enemy city (you really want it). This pushes your civ into level 2

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So PLEASE, read the posts in a thread attentively, before you critisize me. Or even better: read a lot in this forum and learn existing abbrevations before you start to flame others because your lack of knowledge!

@remconius: Sorry, I didn't want to spoil this thread, but it is now the second time that 12agnar0k is trying to instruct me. First time was for using a well known abbrevation in this community.

PawelS said:

If it's true, it doesn't make much sense to cerate puppet cities, especially when you have the tech to build courthouses.

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Everyone seems to miss the original restriction placed by the OP: before the end of the turn. Such a mistake is probably best fixed via a reload though being able to convert any annexed city to a puppet (on the same turn at least) would allow you to figure out the effect of annex/puppet without it being a permanent change. Being able to extend that to anytime would make sense since you cannot rush a courthouse and thus you would have many turns of weakened troops while you get courthouses in place.

Pretty much every other solution, except to buy buildings and trade for resources, requires preconditions that are likely to not be in place (e.g., choose an SP, garrison a unit, use a great artist).

Personally there should be few/no easy ways to correct unhappiness. During a war you should almost ALWAYS make puppets of captured cities and wait until after the war to incorporate them as full cities.

Louis XXIV said:

Dude, don't yell at people for grammar mistakes if you're going to make them yourself. Their should be There.

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That's not a grammar mistake, it's a spelling one.

Well, it's a spelling mistake if using 2 for too is a spelling mistake as well (or using two for too).

Another way to increase your happiness would probably be to ...
play at a lower difficulty level.

Louis XXIV said:

Dude, don't yell at people for grammar mistakes if you're going to make them yourself. Their should be There.

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No one asked you to police my grammar, and I wasn't correcting his/her grammar mistakes, I was asking them not too use that as an acronym, slightly different, but anyway, they weren't in the first place.
P.s I wasn't yelling at anyone, In fact I didn't utter a word.

2 ways 2 get happiness include becoming friendly with one or even 2 city states that have one or even 2 happy resources, and also 2 go out and get another happy resource using a Great Artist 2 culture bomb a happy resource that is no more than 2 tiles away from your border. These 2 ways work, just be careful you dont run in2 2 much happiness problems or else your people may become way 2 unhappy! Sorry I just had 2 use some 2's.

Schalke 04 said:

I can't help but noticing, that this is the second time that you are slightly criticizing my posts

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Actually my post was aimed at the first person to use the term (though I didn't say as much, merely left a universal request irrelevant of User Identity, however the fault was obviously the person who started using the acronym), which would be Schuesseled, who I can be freely appalled at for whatever reason I wish, for he is 10 minutes my junior and thus I am vastly more important, obviously.

So please don't accuse me of not reading the thread or signalling you out as I wasn't.

Toodle Pip,

......

Now if we can get back on track, It would be helpful if people used the "OFFICIAL" term as used by 2kGreg, but so long as everyone understands whatever term is used I have no problem, the fact that it wasn't understood says otherwise, such as with the REX acronym, if you wish to shorten your words to decrease time spent typing, your responsible for any lack of understanding of others reading, so if you do not wish for people to understand anything you type that's fine, but don't expect them not to complain about it.

As I was saying time to leave the Grammar & Acronym arguing alone now, it has been explained what was meant by the unexplained acronym, and onto the correct topic.

PawelS said:

If it's true, it doesn't make much sense to create puppet cities, especially when you have the tech to build courthouses.

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Not true, you may be at -9 unhappiness if you puppet the newly acquired city, if you annex a newly acquired city you will become very unhappy, this will result in a combat and growth penalty till you build that courthouse, what if the mighty army of Ghandi is knocking on your door, would it not be better to puppet the city instead of having your empire destroyed after loosing your army, you can always annex it later when you can afford to become very unhappy or won't become very unhappy due to increasing happiness to begin with.

Puppet cities will be very useful to keep happiness levels in the positive.

In fact I can put it in another context, have you heard of the short term loan websites, like "wonga.com", well on one of these TV ad's they say
"wonga.com should only be used for short term financial solutions and should not be used as long term financial loans."
Think of Puppet states as a short term loan website, sure not annexing will save your unhappiness accumulating, but in the long term, annexing will have this unhappiness removed whilst the Puppet States lack of control is not good for long term planning, as such you may very well want to only use it for the short term whilst still conquering new cities so you don't get a -50% combat penalty, but in the long term, switch to annexing so you get control over production.

12agnar0k said:

In fact I can put it in another context, have you heard of the short term loan websites, like "wonga.com", well on one of these TV ad's they say
"wonga.com should only be used for short term financial solutions and should not be used as long term financial loans."

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Too right it's not suitable for long-term loans! It's 2689% APR typical! It should be a last resort for "short term financial solutions" - a slightly more attractive option than selling an organ.

12agnar0k said:

Not true, you may be at -9 unhappiness if you puppet the newly acquired city, if you annex a newly acquired city you will become very unhappy, this will result in a combat and growth penalty till you build that courthouse, what if the mighty army of Ghandi is knocking on your door, would it not be better to puppet the city instead of having your empire destroyed after loosing your army, you can always annex it later when you can afford to become very unhappy or won't become very unhappy due to increasing happiness to begin with.

Puppet cities will be very useful to keep happiness levels in the positive.

In fact I can put it in another context, have you heard of the short term loan websites, like "wonga.com", well on one of these TV ad's they say
"wonga.com should only be used for short term financial solutions and should not be used as long term financial loans."
Think of Puppet states as a short term loan website, sure not annexing will save your unhappiness accumulating, but in the long term, annexing will have this unhappiness removed whilst the Puppet States lack of control is not good for long term planning, as such you may very well want to only use it for the short term whilst still conquering new cities so you don't get a -50% combat penalty, but in the long term, switch to annexing so you get control over production.

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So puppet cities will typically exist only for a short time, I hoped they give some long term benefits too...

PawelS said:

So puppet cities will typically exist only for a short time, I hoped they give some long term benefits too...

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I think you could use them in long-term as well. For exaple if you're targeting cultural victory.

Is it confirmed that puppet cities are not added to the culture cost?

I think this new use of "unhappiness to limit conquest" will work well as a game mechanic; but how realistic is it historically? Did many rulers (both ancient and more modern) have to stop their conquest due to "unhappiness" from annexations?

I know that game-play should come first, but historical realism (even in it's most abstract representations) is imporant for immersion.

Marshall Thomas said:

I think this new use of "unhappiness to limit conquest" will work well as a game mechanic; but how realistic is it historically? Did many rulers (both ancient and more modern) have to stop their conquest due to "unhappiness" from annexations?

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The term "unhappiness" could be quite wide. Look at the Rome, for example. At some point they were unable to expand further without losing control on some of their provinces.