Aqueduct math

M

mrddt

Chieftain
Joined
Jul 9, 2015
Messages
52
City with population 7
Food 42.98/51 +17
No food percentage modifiers

Aqueduct should carry over 40%. So, next turn it should be (51 * 0.4) = 20.4 + (42.98 + 17 - 51) = 8,98, in total 29.38. But it's 25.98 awaits in a food pool. Where's my 3.4 food?

Does anybody know how it's calculated? Thanks!
 
When the game says Aqueducts carry over 40% of the food over, it means that 40% of the food used to make the citizen is carried over into making the next.

It works similarly to building. If you finish building something and you go over the required production, it's added to the next thing. If you have 90 production on a 100-production building, and you produce 25 production per turn, next turn you'll finish and start off with 15 production on your next building.

Any food that isn't eaten by citizens (A.K.A. Excess Food) is called Growth, and the amount of Growth you have determines how fast your citizens are created. So if you have 10 growth for a citizen in a city with an aqueduct, when that city's population increased, the next citizen will start off with 4 growth points from the start, which in essence means your city's population grows 40% than a city without an Aqueduct. Aqueducts have no affect on how much Food or Growth you actually produce.
 
@mrddt, can you post screenshots of your food tooltip one turn before growth and one turn after? When I've tested this, I've found a rounddown function on the aqueduct food computation, but nothing like the 3.4 food you describe (should round down the aqueduct food bucket in your case to 20 (from 20.4), giving you 28.98, rather than 29.38). See http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=12311554#post12311554
 
mrddt said:
City with population 7
Food 42.98/51 +17
No food percentage modifiers

Aqueduct should carry over 40%. So, next turn it should be (51 * 0.4) = 20.4 + (42.98 + 17 - 51) = 8,98, in total 29.38. But it's 25.98 awaits in a food pool. Where's my 3.4 food?

Does anybody know how it's calculated? Thanks!
Click to expand...

It's maths, not math.

Moderator Action: It's math in the U.S. And please don't post just to correct other folks' grammar or diction -- you need to add something substantive to the discussion.
 
I have read on the forums and seen in primevalciv's production focus trick video that food does not carry over the next turn after growth in the way that hammers do. If I understand it correctly, excess food after a city grows is discarded. It is my understanding that this is why you should enable production focus if you are microing citizens. The new citizen can contribute production but not food on that turn, due to the order in which items are processed in between turns. Please correct me if I am wrong, but this is how I understand the mechanic.
 
That is correct, but that only applies to the food that would have been generated on that turn by the newly created citizen (assuming the citizen were to be assigned to a food tile). Food produced on that turn by pre-existing citizens does carry over.

Since the newly created citizen's food output is ignored (strictly speaking, never computed by the game engine), and the newly created citizen doesn't have to be fed (i.e., in addition to not producing any food on that turn, the newly created citizen also doesn't consume any food on that turn), the production "trick" is to set things up so that the newly created citizen is automatically assigned to a tile that produces something other than food (preferably hammers, but could be gold, culture, science or faith). However, it is important that you shift the new citizen to a food tile on the next turn (assuming you want to keep growing), because the citizen will start consuming food on the next turn.
 
Ah, thank you for the info! So apparently the OP actually does have a discrepancy that isn't accounted for. Regarding the production focus trick - yes, don't forget to shift your citizens the next turn. I sometimes intentionally ignore this trick because I will forget to shift the tile that the new citizen is working for seven or eight turns. It's kind of a bummer when you are trying to max out growth and shoot yourself in the foot by working sainai for 20 turns.
 
mrddt said:
City with population 7
Food 42.98/51 +17
No food percentage modifiers

Aqueduct should carry over 40%. So, next turn it should be (51 * 0.4) = 20.4 + (42.98 + 17 - 51) = 8,98, in total 29.38. But it's 25.98 awaits in a food pool. Where's my 3.4 food?

Does anybody know how it's calculated? Thanks!
Click to expand...

Was the Aqueduct built BEFORE the city reached population 7? To use a more extreme example, if you finish an Aqueduct at 99/100 food to grow...you'll start at 0.4 food extra next turn from the Aqueduct. Not 40.
 
Browd said:
@mrddt, can you post screenshots of your food tooltip one turn before growth and one turn after? When I've tested this, I've found a rounddown function on the aqueduct food computation, but nothing like the 3.4 food you describe (should round down the aqueduct food bucket in your case to 20 (from 20.4), giving you 28.98, rather than 29.38). See http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=12311554#post12311554
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I can't. I'm playing via GMR and I didn't save save-file of that turn :( Unless I can recover it somehow?..
But I'm 100% sure with the numbers, since I wrote it down
3.4 is the difference between expected and actual. It's 3.4 food less than expected. If there rounds down, then it's even 3 food less than it should be.

LordBalkoth,
Aqueduct was finished 1 turn before city has grown to pop 8. So, I would get (51 - 42.98) * 0.4 = 3.21 but I got much more than that.

Also, does anybody understand what this guy was saying?
Any food that isn't eaten by citizens (A.K.A. Excess Food) is called Growth, and the amount of Growth you have determines how fast your citizens are created. So if you have 10 growth for a citizen in a city with an aqueduct, when that city's population increased, the next citizen will start off with 4 growth points from the start, which in essence means your city's population grows 40% than a city without an Aqueduct. Aqueducts have no affect on how much Food or Growth you actually produce.
Click to expand...


So, we don't have an answer yet, right?

I start thinking that caravan might be involved... Caravan is keep bringing food, maybe it have something to do with Aqueduct?
 
That's might be it:
Aqueduct was finished 42.98/51.
42.98 * 0.4 = 17.192
Rounding down to 17 + 8.98 (excess food) = 25.98 (exactly how much is in food pool after growth).

But then it makes no sense. If Aqueduct will be finished at 10/100, than you'll get 4 food from Aqueduct instead of 40?
 
Instead of creating a new thread, maybe the experts can explain the growth numbers for Mecca and Venice in the screenshots.
The numbers for terrain, buildings and food trade routes are correct. The same thing for the modifiers.



 
mrddt said:
But then it makes no sense. If Aqueduct will be finished at 10/100, than you'll get 4 food from Aqueduct instead of 40?
Click to expand...

Might be a bug for just the population when the Aqueduct is "finished?" Definitely seems odd.

Tatran said:
Instead of creating a new thread, maybe the experts can explain the growth numbers for Mecca and Venice in the screenshots.
The numbers for terrain, buildings and food trade routes are correct. The same thing for the modifiers.
Click to expand...

Mecca...

48 + 15 = 63 from the city. Temple of Artemis makes that 69.3. Trade routes make that 87.3.

87.3 - 58 consumed = 29.3 excess.

29.3 * 1.4 (Tradition bonuses plus religion bonus) = 41.02 total.

I can do Venice if you'd like but I think what was throwing you off is Temple of Artemis and the fact it affects BASE food rather than EXCESS food (and why it's such a good wonder).
 
@LordBalkoth
Thanks for the explanation. I indeed misunderstood the ToA effect.
 
Temple of Artemis and the fact it affects BASE food rather than EXCESS food
Click to expand...
OMG! Every day I learn something new! Is there anything else in the game that affecting BASE food, not EXCESS food?
Thanks!
 
ToA and the Aztec's Floating Gardens building are the only things in the game that provide a base food percentage bonus. Everything else applies to net (or excess) food.
 
Yep, which makes them extremely powerful. ToA is much better than Great Library and also (unless OOC, maybe) much better than Hanging Gardens...problem is it comes so early when you need to be making settlers.
 
LordBalkoth said:
Yep, which makes them extremely powerful. ToA is much better than Great Library and also (unless OOC, maybe) much better than Hanging Gardens...problem is it comes so early when you need to be making settlers.
Click to expand...

what is OOC?
 
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