Jotnar - Giant Civ for Fall from Heaven. Download Here.

How about Ogre Adept/Magi/archmagi as a disciple/arcane line?
Minotaur: replaces Mercenary.

Maybe other unique mistical units avaliable at special techs/religions?
Ideas:

Talos, a bronze giant. Requires bronze working + some advanced tech.

Leviathan with OO religion.

Nephilim (angel-like giants, descendents from fallen angels), replacement for crusaders with Order religion.

Gaians, the spirits of Earth, earth giants, replacement of Thanes of Kilmorph with RoK. Typhon as hero with RoK.

Echidna as a hero with Malevolent designs. It has a very minor chance to spawn a monster when the spell "mate" is cast, the spell is avaliable when the echidna is at the same tile as Typhon (spawnable monsters: hydra, Giant Lion (like Nemean lion), Chimera, sphinx, ladon (serpent-like minor dragon), cerberus, Orthrus (Not Orthus :), a two-headed dog and a doublet of Cerberus)). The spell should be unavaliable for a few turns after being cast and should consume a living unit on the same tile).

Gog and Magog as heroes. Probably built together/given by a world wonder (like the 3 giants' wonder)


By the way I get 3 errors when I load the mod (about obelisk, gypsy wagon and something else).




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So, I've found all the errors. 1) You should change BUILDINGCLASS_OBELISK to BUILDINGCLASS_MONUMENT in Jotnar_CIV4BuildingInfos, you should remove DRAGONSHIP (used twice) and GYPSY_WAGON from the list of unused units in Jotnar_CIV4CivilizationInfos; 2) Your monument UB is not used, to change it go to your Jotnar_CIV4BuildingInfos and under <Buildings> add
Code:
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_MONUMENT</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_OBELISK_JOTNAR</BuildingType>
                </Building>
 
So, I've found all the errors. 1) You should change BUILDINGCLASS_OBELISK to BUILDINGCLASS_MONUMENT in Jotnar_CIV4BuildingInfos, you should remove DRAGONSHIP (used twice) and GYPSY_WAGON from the list of unused units in Jotnar_CIV4CivilizationInfos; 2) Your monument UB is not used, to change it go to your Jotnar_CIV4BuildingInfos and under <Buildings> add
Code:
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_MONUMENT</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_OBELISK_JOTNAR</BuildingType>
                </Building>

This is because you are using my BETA version with the latest FF. They do not play well together. Yet.

I'll get together with my wife about your suggestions and get back to you. Several of them do not feel right, but that 'monster' hero that spawns monster could be a idea if one spin it a little different.
 
These ideas were quite random and I was bored at work. I will playtest your civ. more and maybe then I'll get something better :).

Good to hear that your wife likes gaming. Mine hates me to play anything.
 
These ideas were quite random and I was bored at work. I will playtest your civ. more and maybe then I'll get something better :).

Good to hear that your wife likes gaming. Mine hates me to play anything.

Give'me anything you come up with, I don't shoot anything down but only implement stuff I like.

And I am happily married to a hot, voluptuous blonde female computer-geek.
 
I have added two new Jotnar leaders. Father Kasghenal (lawful elder warmonger) and Uxol the half-breed (barbarian, evil half-troll). My problem is that conqueror trait does not work very well, when taking over new cities with Kasghenal (whom have conqueror) I can only build a few buildings such as palisade and brewery.
 
Recent development:

- New Jotnar Thrall unit graphics, Fixed/Changed Jotnar Berserkers, Archmages and Sea-giants.

- Added two new Leaders, one older Jotnar with more warlike features 'Father Kasghenal' (Financial, Aggressive) and a evil Troll half-breed 'Uxol' (Barbarian,
Arcane, Raiders). Mother Enningas has become Good Alignment - so the Jotnar now have a Good, a Neutral and an Evil leader.

- Nerfed the Jotnar max city size to 8 instaed of 10 and the Jotnar Staedding maintnance modifier to -10%.

We also discuss to replace all religious units from Savants to Paladins with 'jotnar' equivalents, larger, +2 str, giantkin and not buildable. Or ... its complicated. Is it really a good idea?
 
Personally, I think that if it's possible to give them unique religious units, you should do it. Mainly because it helps make them unique, but also because being able to construct dwarves or elves in Giant cities seems awkward.

Producing.. :)

Well. There would be the whole issue that you'd take away from Jotnar the usual build-and-burn religious units. Soilders of Kilmorph for production, Savants for research, Cultists to build temples. Playing the Jotnar there is no chance in hell that you'd sacrifice a unit promoted from a Jotnar Citizen to buff the city's culture with 15. And.. we are talking about 7*6 = 42 units that are involved.

I could consider removing all religious units (everything from satyrs and savants, to Paladins and High Priests) and instaed have -one- religious Jotnar unit for each religion. Available when you have the religion and priesthood (no temples required) whom simply can spread the religion without being sacrificed. 'Pathfinder of Kilmorph' or 'Voice of the Sea' etc. Giantkin, str 6 as base, divine and one or a few spells depending on religion. Mostly the same graphics but with different holy symbols. Only four allowed. That would mean that I have only to create 7 new units.

Vehem? Tal?
 
could they spread religion in the same manner as CoE?

Also, in the main game you can see when a unit is CoE - could that mechanic be expanded to cover the other religions?

That way you could have a single Jotnar religious unit that is of an unspecified faith until it is built/spawned (although a single faith city will only have that religion). It'd means a little less control over what religion spreads across the Jotnarr civ...
 
I am considering a Jotnar unit that have/will have unspecified religion. That simply spreads the current state religion (like CoE) but without any cost attached and it is consistent across any potential changes of state religion. It will be a compromise (perhaps max 6 units) and will be a hybrid between cleric and paladin/eidolon - weaker then the top units but available earlier (at priesthood). Starts with str 6 and ages up to str 10. It will be Jotnars -only- Divine unit.

Vehem seems ok with it, so I'll be looking for some cool graphics to corrupt. Names sofar is 'Oquid' and 'Seijd'. Idea's on what to call it? Lorekeeper? Mouth of the Divine? Anything cool pops up?
 
I was planning on letting the Jotnar Civilization raise/lower mountains/hills -

Strikes me as problematical, in use if not in execution.

I'd enjoy being wrong, though. :)

- Spawning of Jotnar Citizens are modified in such a way that less and less Jotnar spawned as the Armageddon counter rises, while more citizens per city are allowed.

I like the lowered spawning as the AC rises. The pop-increase is non-giants, yes?

Allowing Jotnar cities max size 8 instaed of 10.

I like that quite a bit. Has a lot more "bite."

Giving the elder Jotnar giants some additional perks, for example legendary giants of tier 4 some nifty spell.

AARP card? :)

How about stack-boosts? The Elder Giants help morale, or teach, or inspire, or something along that line.

? Creating a Jotnar only world spell 'Galeh-Moman' - the great river of tears. All Jotnar Citizens (note: only Jotnar Citizens, not Units) have 10% to gain the hero promotion, the rest dies.

Cool! I'm not sure about the balance of the figures you give, or even of the Hero promo. (A custom promo that's similar could be made.) But I really like the basic idea.

If a Jotnar unit can move a resource, its gonna be a permanent move. And if its a risk of failure, its a permanent loss. No game is going to be won or lost due to the access to one sheep or fish recourse. And stealing other nations fish for example would trigger war.

I suggest making it quite a bit more difficult to move Resources in/from someone else's territory. I do like a chance of losing the Resource completely. Might be nice to have it always pop-up elsewhere. (So really "lost", not "eliminated.")

I think a cost of some sort would be good, too, to act as a natural limitation on how much resource shuffling you can do.. Monetary is the only one I can think of. (Aren't too many to chose from.)

I am considering a Jotnar unit that have/will have unspecified religion. That simply spreads the current state religion (like CoE) but without any cost attached

I like the idea quite a bit. Especially as national units. (Nice limit allowing you to make them more powerful. :)) Different State Religions could easily give access to different spells. If you want them to have spells...

No cost for spreading religion doesn't strike me as right - though I could easily be wrong on that. I don't grok the Jotnar background terribly well.... Anyway, I think an xp cost would be interesting so long as, being Divine units, they get some free xps.

Mouth of the Divine?

I like that one, or something like it. Implies to me they're not terribly invested in any one religion/god. They're the mouthpieces for whatever religion the Jotnar follow ATM.
 
No cost for spreading religion doesn't strike me as right - though I could easily be wrong on that. I don't grok the Jotnar background terribly well.... Anyway, I think an xp cost would be interesting so long as, being Divine units, they get some free xps.

I like that... Maybe make it 2xp so it's not completely free, but isn't TOO expensive either?
 
No cost for spreading religion doesn't strike me as right - though I could easily be wrong on that. I don't grok the Jotnar background terribly well.... Anyway, I think an xp cost would be interesting so long as, being Divine units, they get some free xps.

I'm most likely going with no cost, hope you don't hold that against me. One of the reasons are like I've told Vehem that the Jotnar gets only this unit instaed of -all- other existing disciple units (except Druid->Woodfather). It is a absurdly huge nerf, I've played many games with a 'religious' strategy and knows how massivly powerful that can be.

Something I'd consider though is to put a 'wait' on it. So it takes five or ten turns to spread the religion. But remember that the Jotnar can easily have twice or thrice as many cities as a normal civ and they need to spread the religion to all of them.

Thanks for the feedback, i'll get to the other points later today. :)
 
Strikes me as problematical, in use if not in execution.

I'd enjoy being wrong, though. :)

I've scrapped this idea, since Vehem wasn't so fond of it. And because it was difficult.

I like the lowered spawning as the AC rises. The pop-increase is non-giants, yes?

Hmm, what I meant is. That every city have a percentage to spawn a number of Jotnar Citizen, but can have a maximum of Jotnar Citizen units at any time. The maximum of Jotnar Citizens units you can 'horde' rises with Armageddon counter. Not Population.

How about stack-boosts? The Elder Giants help morale, or teach, or inspire, or something along that line.

Sounds like a great idea. I'll use it. Decided not to.

I suggest making it quite a bit more difficult to move Resources in/from someone else's territory. I do like a chance of losing the Resource completely. Might be nice to have it always pop-up elsewhere. (So really "lost", not "eliminated.")

I think a cost of some sort would be good, too, to act as a natural limitation on how much resource shuffling you can do.. Monetary is the only one I can think of. (Aren't too many to chose from.)

Hmm, if you pick up a recourse, you get a promotion 'Herding cattle' or something. That allows to 'Put Sheep' or similar. A unit can pick up Sheep and put them down somewhere else.

Again I prefer putting in a delay, it takes three turns to 'pick up' sheep. Making it harder to rob other civs of recourses.
 
A possibility is that I add a non-national Hero. 'Pultry McDaggon'.

An odd creature said to have sneaked in through an Sheaim planar gate after having been thrown into a hell dimension from another world for crimes for witch he was of course .. totally innocent. Looking very much like a white-feathered bird with hands and arms instaed of wings, this small creature is notorically independant yet versatile. Captured by a giant and close to ending up in a pot, Pultry quickly swore alligence to the Jotnar leader.

Recon unit available at ??? with 4/2, marksman, adventurer, escape chance 50% and a near 100% chance of changing side if defeated. Channeling II and Shadow I. Can steal magic items.

-low- priority
 
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