Things you only just now realized

So Immortals don't spam more land units, but now they do the every-tile-a-unit in the form of navies





God, that was the hardest of all the AIs in that game to wade through, even with atomics.

smallfish said:

So Immortals don't spam more land units, but now they do the every-tile-a-unit in the form of navies

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

God, that was the hardest of all the AIs in that game to wade through, even with atomics.

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Interesting that Germany doesn't spam more land units.
I imaging the Ottomans would be even more of a pain to wade through.

nefloyd said:

Yea, I think hunting camps should still allow celt's bonus, but not lumber mills or trading posts.

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It's not completely true. Roads are a tile improvement, and that doesn't take away the bonus. Also, I only recently realized that roads are the *only* tile improvement that contributes to your "tile improvement" costs in the UI. Why don't they just call it "route maintenance" or something? In Civ 4 if I recall all tile improvement had a cost. Dunno. In any case, for a long time in Civ 5 I tried to only build improvements I needed for cost reasons. Of course, this is probably good practice anyway, because it made me more efficient about which ones I chose to build first, but it was mostly for the wrong reasons. ;-)

Cromagnus said:

In Civ 4 if I recall all tile improvement had a cost.

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I'm pretty sure that's untrue. There's a reason why the Civ IV AI tended to spam roads and rails.

nefloyd said:

Doesn't apply to ranged units. The turn you complete building an archer in a city that already has one stationed there, you can ranged attack with both. At the end of the turn, one of them will be forced into a nearby empty hex.

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This also happens with GP, even before the turn ends. This screwed me, because I had another civilian in the city, and I didn't move the Great Engineer immediately. Before the turn was even over, somehow he had gotten forced out. I was under siege. I couldn't move him back into the city and use him in the same turn because of the flanking movement penalty. This delayed me from rushing a wonder that turn, and someone beat me to it as a result. :-(

So, if you have stacked units in a city, resolve that first before you click on "A Unit Needs Orders", or you might find them forced out before you can move them yourself.

Jabberwockxeno said:

Yep.

Never destroy jungles

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On the other hand, when an AI nukes your primary science output city and it's working 7 jungle tiles, you suddenly lose a LOT of science. Sigh.

Speaking of which, in that same turn I learned the hard way that when you lose access to a resource, it cancels production of anything that requires it. The AI nuked my *only source of aluminum* and I had 1 turn left on the engine. Boom, the engine was gone, and I lost *all the production* for it. I had to start over. I still won the game, because with that new info in hand, I retaliated by nuking all of his uranium and aluminum tiles. I think that slowed him down just long enough for me to win. :-D

also, if you have a civilian or GP in a city and you have faith purchases automated they wont stack. i learned this the hard way when i couldnt figure out why my automated purchase wouldnt happen. made me facepalm when i found out a normally gotten GS I was saving for later was the reason why. also a worker just sitting in the city because there was nothing else to do w/him prevented missionaries and inquisitors from spawning for automated purchases.

I think I've learned more from this thread than from the last few games I've played. lol

OmniPotent42 said:

Interesting that Germany doesn't spam more land units.
I imaging the Ottomans would be even more of a pain to wade through.

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Makes sense it is an island.

On another note, playing yesterday, the Romans had unreal ballista spam going on. I would say they had 10 ballistas, 3 composite bowmen, 1 infantry (usually a warrior or pike, at this particular point in the game.) which they would use specifically for capturing the battered city. All they would do is batter the city into the ground and take out any threat around that city, and march in with infantry. Their unit ratio of 10/3/1 was very effective.

The battle for Kaupang was an ongoing slugfest which chewed up vast resources on both sides. I placed that city near the Romans to grab the only source of iron, which was anywhere near me. The city changed hands 7 times. The Roman ballistas in rough terrain, in the end, were the deciding factor. They simply were able to wear my infantry out, which took longer to heal. Any of my infantry that stuck their heads up were smashed to a pulp. I took my share of their ballistas, with my bowmen behind the city. My spearmen would charge a ballista near the city to weaken it. Then my bowmen would finish it off. That way my spears did not go out into open terrain. When that spear got warn out. I'd retreat it to heal and bring a fresh one forward.

If they recaptured the city. I would take it again with longboats and archers. Usually the Romans did not have an infantry to retake it the next turn. So, I would withdraw my longboat which is a melee unit, which replaces the trireme. Then simply march another spear into the city. The city could never recuperate enough. Adding walls was foolish as well.

Finally, they destroyed one of my bowmen and outflanked my infantry over time. This effectively made it so, I could not destroy ballistas as easily. Or reinforce the city. Then England backstabbed me, and attacked my home cities. This whole thing was a military blunder on my part. It was a bad idea. It reminded me of the battle of Gallipoli, or in a way Thermopylae. What great fun though.

Anyway, I started a new game. So far I am doing much better. I'll post a few screenshots if something interesting happens. I should have taken some of that battle yesterday, but I was so determined to defeat the Romans, that I did not take any. My supper was also cold by the time I got to it.

Just discovered you can actually rename units that are promoted!

I'm curious about this...when your civ sends out a tentacle and grabs, say, a stone hex, but this hex is outside any of your cities' three-hex limit, what is going on?

The hex can't be worked by one of your cities,.... Is there some benefit I'm not aware of???? I know if it's a luxury or a strategic resource.., say marble, or aluminum or horses or such, you get credit for that, but if a city can't work a stone quarry, why is it reaching out to grab it ....and it almost seems to be making a point of grabbing it??? Sam thing with cows and sheep and wheat...

Koiranputki said:

I'm curious about this...when your civ sends out a tentacle and grabs, say, a stone hex, but this hex is outside any of your cities' three-hex limit, what is going on?

The hex can't be worked by one of your cities,.... Is there some benefit I'm not aware of???? I know if it's a luxury or a strategic resource.., say marble, or aluminum or horses or such, you get credit for that, but if a city can't work a stone quarry, why is it reaching out to grab it ....and it almost seems to be making a point of grabbing it??? Sam thing with cows and sheep and wheat...

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keeps the ai from building a city on it or next to it...that and it restricts the ai's movement closer to your city unless they DoW you or have an open border with you. I am glad the city screen prioritizes for resources.

Submarines can swim under ice.

If you time your great people points, you can get 2 or 3 at once. If you spawn two at once, the cost goes up 200. If you spawn 3 at once, the cost goes up 300. This makes them significantly cheaper in the long run.

Example:
If you spawn GS, GE, GS, GE one at a time, they cost 100, 200, 300, and 400 respectively, for a total of 1000 points.

If you spawn GS & GE at the same time, then do it again, they cost 100 each the first time, and 300 each the second time, for a total of 800 points. (20% discount)

If you do this with GS, GE, GA, the cost goes up to 400. So, instead of 100, 200, 300, 400, 500, 600 (2100 total) you only pay 100, 100, 100, 400, 400, 400. (1500)

This is more than a 25% discount!

Also, popping a GP from a wonder like Pisa increases the cost, so time that carefully.

If you really want lots of one type of great person, this isn't a good tactic, obviously. 4 GS will cost 1000 if that's all you spawn. Getting to 4 GS if you always spawn GE at the same time will make those 4 GS cost 1600, and will negatively effect your critical early game science output.

In any case, I'm not sure if Firaxis intended it this way or if it's an exploit.

I don't know if this counts, since it's something I've known for a while but keep forgetting... and hating myself for forgetting it:

When you raze a city, it temporarily makes it part of your empire, which will almost always interrupt a National Wonder build, *making you lose all production*. (Unless you get lucky and the required building is in that city after capture)

I personally feel like this is a bug, and a very annoying one at that.

However! There is a workaround. Switch production to something else right before you cap the city. Wait until you finish razing, then restart production after the razing completes. This will result in minimal production loss. It will delay completion of the building, obviously.

This workaround works even better for spaceship parts. If you traded for alumimum and the 30-turn deal expires while you're in the middle of a build, and the AI/player chooses not to renew it, *you lose all production* and have to start over. So, just in case, switch to building something else before the turn ends, and restart the deal or make a new one with someone else, then restart the build. You lose virtually no production and only one turn. A better solution is to have an overlapping deal with another civ, but that's beyond the scope of this thread.

Edit: Also, if you nuke someone's only aluminum tile, similarly it will pillage the mine and interrupt production of the spaceship part. An AI did this to me when I was one turn from completing a part. I was wondering why he nuked a tile so far from my cities, until later when I realized I'd lost the part. This remains the smartest thing I've ever seen the AI do.

^ I think the best option is to play with a mod that allows production from a cancelled project to be saved, as if you switched away at the last second.

I wonder if that exists yet?

ThisNameIsTooLo said:

^ I think the best option is to play with a mod that allows production from a cancelled project to be saved, as if you switched away at the last second.

I wonder if that exists yet?

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Why? There always should be (more) consequences of action, so why remove more of them?

I'm pretty sure you don't lose ALL production. It just stops whatever it was the turn before, and you can start where you left off after the city is razed.

Buccaneer said:

Why? There always should be (more) consequences of action, so why remove more of them?

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Yes, but that sort of thing is not SUPPOSED to happen for National Wonders or Projects. World Wonders, yes, since the very nature of that game mechanic is that you are desperately racing to claim a unique bonus for your civilization. But that's not what National Wonders are all about; they're supposed to be a reward for focusing on constructing buildings in your city.

Besides, the requirements are already ridiculous enough for any empire that isn't strictly Tradition-based, they don't need this fake difficulty thrown in as well.

Tachii said:

I'm pretty sure you don't lose ALL production. It just stops whatever it was the turn before, and you can start where you left off after the city is razed.

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I'll need to double-check that. I'm almost positive that when a national wonder build gets canceled, you lose all production. Same with any unit/building that requires a resource, if you lose that resource. I'll verify that in my next game. I should have double-checked before posting, but oh well.