[MOD] Medieval: Conquests

Radunz · Jan 18, 2011

First of all, dude ur mod is AWSOME, realy realy good, am playng for a week non stop, and called a few friends to join a massive hotseat game.
But there are some things that in my opinion need balance:
Techs are too fast, when you get a monastery and a library and use full, it usualy takes me 3-8 turns to discover techs including late ones, and also i think you could add more techs, because some techs just add a huge bonus, you could divide those bonus in 2-3 techs.Also Paved Roads would be nice, a higer movement bonus.

One other thing, i think that castles, military cities should be like the monasteries build from the ground by a military unit, i also think that monastaries should be more especializated and with less comercial buildings.

anyway ur the king :king:

Kailric · Jan 18, 2011

Radunz said:
First of all, dude ur mod is AWSOME, realy realy good, am playng for a week non stop, and called a few friends to join a massive hotseat game.
But there are some things that in my opinion need balance:
Techs are too fast, when you get a monastery and a library and use full, it usualy takes me 3-8 turns to discover techs including late ones, and also i think you could add more techs, because some techs just add a huge bonus, you could divide those bonus in 2-3 techs.Also Paved Roads would be nice, a higer movement bonus.

One other thing, i think that castles, military cities should be like the monasteries build from the ground by a military unit, i also think that monastaries should be more especializated and with less comercial buildings.

anyway ur the king

Hey, thanks for the feedback and glad you are enjoying it. The tech tree isn't complete by no means and does need balance. One problem is I like the 300 turn game, makes for a faster passed game that you can complete in a few hours. However, it does speed of the research. I may have to go to a 400 turn game or reduce the amount of research you can produce. I want players to be able to have about 90% or so of the techs research by the time their conquest starts.

I do want to add new techs including the first Gun Powder units and buildings as Gun powder was an invention of the middle ages and in doing so I will probably have to increase the game turns.

And yes, improved roads is planned to be added at some point.

I am not sure what you mean by "build from the ground". Do you mean like instantly founded where you don't have to bring lumber or stone and take several turns to build?

In making this mod I wanted it to be a lesson in history and tired to make features that reflected actual historical events. In reality Castles took a long time to complete and in game turns this is represented by the build times and sense castles gain extra buildings you are required to bring extra materials.

And historically monasteries where excellent producers of Wine, beer, and dairy products and sometimes whole cities where built around or near monasteries. At the moment its up to the player to decided how much to develop his Monasteries. If you just want a peaceful place for your researchers to study, maybe with a little wine, then you can do that. If you want to build a thriving Leather Armor industry then you can do that. As it is now its up to the player to make the choice.

PS Stay tuned as I plan to release another update today.

Radunz · Jan 18, 2011

I do want to add new techs including the first Gun Powder units and buildings as Gun powder was an invention of the middle ages and in doing so I will probably have to increase the game turns.

Man that would be reeealy cool, on late game, while the europeans have that heavy armor arabs and turns have muskets.

I am not sure what you mean by "build from the ground". Do you mean like instantly founded where you don't have to bring lumber or stone and take several turns to build?

Instead of using a pioner to build the caste, do it has a normal city, but with diferent buildings(much like medieval total war)

And historically monasteries where excellent producers of Wine, beer, and dairy products and sometimes whole cities where built around or near monasteries. At the moment its up to the player to decided how much to develop his Monasteries. If you just want a peaceful place for your researchers to study, maybe with a little wine, then you can do that. If you want to build a thriving Leather Armor industry then you can do that. As it is now its up to the player to make the choice.

Cool, i didnt knew of that =)

PS Stay tuned as I plan to release another update today.

Waiting for the game nigth tonigth =D

Kailric · Jan 18, 2011

Update 1.1c is up for download on front page. It address the below issues..

-Jester now has the correct bonus to Culture
-Market graphic is fixed
-you must have talked to the barbarian chief before units will migrate from that city
-Innkeeper now gives +100% to Culture
-Alternate Equipments now show in the Professions Pedia
-Professions Pedia is more complete
-Courthouse art has been replaced (thanks to Deon for the link)
-Marauders appear according to difficulty. At lower two levels they want appear till later in the game and not during a player's Conquest
-Tutorial has been updated to explain a few more things
-Expert Cowherdsmen and shepards now appear at a frequency more like Expert Cotton Planters
-Collaborate has been changed to Research Pact
-Hammer Font Icons now appear where they should (thanks to KJ for this)
-Nations should start father away from each other, especially on larger maps
-Expert Vineyard Workers should now be Summonable on the Commerce Screen
-Watch Tower help text updated
-Sheep Farms produce less Sheep and Wool now, they where producing to much
-Research Lab has been removed. It was more of a Renaissance building
-The Tech Calender reduces travel time by only 25% now
-fixed missionary icons

Those are the things that are suppose to be fixed. Let us know if they are not

Kailric · Jan 19, 2011

I got up this morning with an itch to update one part of this mod. So here is a bonus update. Link is at first post.

The Wily Trader
This unit makes the best Pedlers and Merchants as they gain a bonus to movement and cargo. They also make Excellent Diplomats when talking to Barbarian chiefs and have a better chance at finding beneficial Goodys. If you plan on founding a new city in Barbarian lands the Wily Trader gains a 30% discount on the cost to purchase land.

Version 1.1d Wily Trader
-The Wily Trader unit has been give a promotion. He gains a +1 to movment and +1 to cargo when he takes on the Pelder or Merchant Professions
-Wily Traders can be Summoned to your realm, however the cost to do so increases by 500 each time
-Units with Pedler or Merchant profession can no longer found settlements. This was causeing a crash.

KJ Jansson · Jan 19, 2011

Kailric said:
Hey, help is much welcomed. What exactly is the Porge Attitude icons? Got a link as I havent heard of that one.

Here Porge Attitude icons for your mod. I made them for version 1.1c but they must work in next versions, too. They looks as

In your mod they will be as

There is a small bug here:

To fix just change in CIV4UnitInfos.xml

Code:

    <UnitInfo>
      <Type>UNIT_VINEYARD_PLANTER</Type>
      <Class>UNITCLASS_VINEYARD_PLANTER</Class>
	  .....
	  
        <YieldModifiers>
        <YieldModifier>
          <YieldType>[B]YIELD_COTTON[/B]</YieldType>
          <iYieldMod>100</iYieldMod>
        </YieldModifier>
      </YieldModifiers>

on

Code:

	  <Type>[COLOR="Black"][B]YIELD_GRAPES[/B][/COLOR]</Type>

P.S. Few words concerning last update.
Very strange, but Pope (or Viking Adviser) declares the war on the first turn. Then he sends a very powerful army. Of course, his army destroys my very weak city with only one military unit.
The variant of Vikings is also strange. My military viking units did not establish a city, but just waiting the enemies on one of mountain. Turn 36, the enemy ships try to find them, but does not attack.
Pope or Adviser refuses to talk, thus I have no possibility to finish this .... war.

What to do? Not so funny..... :confused:

Turn 65, my situation is the same. I guess this is a serious bug.

Kailric · Jan 19, 2011

Thanks for the info and bug report, KJ.

Hmm, what settings are you using when playinng as the Vikings? Just started a game on default settings and all is fine. The Scandinavian Civ are "Invaders" and Invander Civs must conquer a settlement before they can found one of their own. See the screen shot...

[removed screenshot]

Jennvare · Jan 19, 2011

Kailric,

Just started a new game with the new patches. Your Expert Vineyard Worker has the wrong bonus. He has 100% cotton instead of grapes. You may wish to change this.

Also, there's still the issue with everyone clustering near each other. Ive got 2 other civs who started right next to me and one more that isnt that far away.

Kailric · Jan 19, 2011

Jennvare said:
Kailric,

Just started a new game with the new patches. Your Expert Vineyard Worker has the wrong bonus. He has 100% cotton instead of grapes. You may wish to change this.

Also, there's still the issue with everyone clustering near each other. Ive got 2 other civs who started right next to me and one more that isnt that far away.

Yeah, I uploaded a new update a couple hours ago that fixes the vineyard worker.

Still getting clusters aye, well I have it coded so that the player wont start with in the city radius of a Barbarian Village or in the mist of a Jungle or next to a Goody. The problems steams from the fact that some maps have Barbarian Villages, Goodies, and the Jungles spaced in such a way there are just not enough plots for all the Civs. Especially if most of the Civs are land starts. Its just a random thing. So, its a give or take.

In Civ4 there are no Barbarians so its easy to find a spot where no other Civs are. In Vanilla Col there are no land starts for players so then again its not a problem. So, I may have to allow Players to start near Barbarian Villages in order to prevent this.

What Map was you using and what size? In my tests I was only using The_New_World map and never had a problem.

KJ Jansson · Jan 20, 2011

Kailric said:
Thanks for the info and bug report, KJ.

Hmm, what settings are you using when playinng as the Vikings? Just started a game on default settings and all is fine. The Scandinavian Civ are "Invaders" and Invander Civs must conquer a settlement before they can found one of their own. See the screen shot...

I know about this feature of Vikings (and Mongols).

My problem is different. Turn 1 - peace, turn 2 - war with my "European" king (Pope, Advisor). My vikings ships cannot reach a coast yet, when his Viging Advisor declares war. Such situation happens all the time. Yesterday I tried different nations, different difficulty levels, but result was the same: turn 2 - war.

I guess I have to reinstall your mod, then update up to version 1.1e and try again. I see no reasons where and why this "bug" came from. Most probably, this is a local problem of my game. Today later I will reinstall, test and report the results.

Kailric · Jan 20, 2011

KJ Jansson said:
I know about this feature of Vikings (and Mongols).

My problem is different. Turn 1 - peace, turn 2 - war with my "European" king (Pope, Advisor). My vikings ships cannot reach a coast yet, when his Viging Advisor declares war. Such situation happens all the time. Yesterday I tried different nations, different difficulty levels, but result was the same: turn 2 - war.

I guess I have to reinstall your mod, then update up to version 1.1e and try again. I see no reasons where and why this "bug" came from. Most probably, this is a local problem of my game. Today later I will reinstall, test and report the results.

In the mod there is a feature that starts your war automaticly. Its the code below:

Code:

    if (!isInRevolution())
    {
        int iMaxTurns = GC.getGameINLINE().getMaxTurns();

        if (GC.getGameINLINE().getElapsedGameTurns() >= iMaxTurns)
        {

             GET_TEAM(getTeam()).doRevolution();
             bValid = false;
        }
    }

There may be a problem reading your CIV4GameSpeedInfo.xml cause this is where the game gets the "MaxTurns" info from. If iMaxTurns is a negative number then yeah, the AI will declare war on you your second turn.

And right now for some nations things may be a bit off. Like with the Vikings and Mongols its the Advisor that declares war on you when its not suppose to be. In a future update I hope to have it set up so that the game spawns the actual Enemy nation to do war with the player. In the mean time just try to over look it

KJ Jansson · Jan 20, 2011

Kailric said:
In the mod there is a feature that starts your war automaticly.
There may be a problem reading your CIV4GameSpeedInfo.xml cause this is where the game gets the "MaxTurns" info from. If iMaxTurns is a negative number then yeah, the AI will declare war on you your second turn.

And right now for some nations things may be a bit off. Like with the Vikings and Mongols its the Advisor that declares war on you when its not suppose to be. In a future update I hope to have it set up so that the game spawns the actual Enemy nation to do war with the player. In the mean time just try to over look it

Here result of my testing.

Fresh installation + update 1.1b + update 1.1e.
Start as "Willaim the Conqueror" (in your transcription), level Pilgrim.
Turn 1 - peace, turn 2 - war.
N.B. Victory condition: Conquest.

If I choose "Time" as Victory conditions, no problems. I can continue peacefully.

Probably, this information helps you to find and fix the problem.

Kailric · Jan 20, 2011

KJ Jansson said:
Here result of my testing.

Fresh installation + update 1.1b + update 1.1e.
Start as "Willaim the Conqueror" (in your transcription), level Pilgrim.
Turn 1 - peace, turn 2 - war.
N.B. Victory condition: Conquest.

If I choose "Time" as Victory conditions, no problems. I can continue peacefully.

Probably, this information helps you to find and fix the problem.

Ok, yeah, without even looking I bet I know what the problem is. You say "If you choose Time". So, you are setting up a custom game and choosing your victory conditions. So if you don't choose "Time" then the above code I showed you would always result in a Conquest starting on turn 2, cause there is no "MaxTurns".

I did not know the game would work like this. I had an idea that this was the problem and I have already made changes in the code to address this. Let me test things out and if I am correct I'll post an update for you. I need to remove the Industrilization Victory also as its not a viable choice in this mod and leads to errors as well.

Kailric · Jan 20, 2011

Here is update 1.1f

Test this out please and let me know if all goes well. You should be able to not select Time as a Victory and the game will work as should. I also removed Industrialization as a Victory Condition.

KJ Jansson · Jan 20, 2011

Kailric said:
Here is update 1.1f

Test this out please and let me know if all goes well. You should be able to not select Time as a Victory and the game will work as should. I also removed Industrialization as a Victory Condition.

Thank you very much, Kailric! Here a short summary.

Conditions:
Fresh installation + update 1.1b + update 1.1e + update 1.1.f.
Start as "Willaim the Conqueror".
Victory condition: Conquest.

Result:
No war on turn 2, all is OK.

Jennvare · Jan 20, 2011

With this many patches one needs to keep, you may just want to compile it all and just make the whole game one file again for easier installation.

Kailric · Jan 21, 2011

Jennvare said:
With this many patches one needs to keep, you may just want to compile it all and just make the whole game one file again for easier installation.

Yeah, I am looking into making the installation a .exe and any updates the same so it will be easier. So, when I do that I will repost it.

Radunz · Jan 21, 2011

Hi,

Some balancing issues i think
Monastary is overpower, you produce +50% on wine and sheep(rly dont know why, i agree that jesuit missionaries and maybe firebrand preachers should produce +50% wine, but not anyone in a monastery)
Second to that i think that cattle is too expensive and salt is very cheap, besides i never knew there were salt in marsh.
And another think i have though is about resources, you could do the same with grain resources like livestock(you being able to plant if you have enougth seeds) i think that adds more balance to the game

Anyway Hotseatnigth was awsome =D a friend of mine conquered us all with al-mansur >.<

Kailric · Jan 21, 2011

Radunz said:
Hi,

Some balancing issues i think
Monastary is overpower, you produce +50% on wine and sheep(rly dont know why, i agree that jesuit missionaries and maybe firebrand preachers should produce +50% wine, but not anyone in a monastery)
Second to that i think that cattle is too expensive and salt is very cheap, besides i never knew there were salt in marsh.
And another think i have though is about resources, you could do the same with grain resources like livestock(you being able to plant if you have enougth seeds) i think that adds more balance to the game

Anyway Hotseatnigth was awsome =D a friend of mine conquered us all with al-mansur >.<

The reason Monasterys give a bonus to wine, sheep, cattle, and ale is that historically monasteries where big producers of such goods with wine being one of the major goods. The monks labored to perfect the production of these goods as well. Ok, yeah thats probably too big of a bonus. Your towns can build a Trading post, which gives a bonus to Cloth and Coats by 25%. So, I wanted a bonus for Monasteries as well. Maybe lowering the bonus to 25%? Towns however can upgrade the Trading Post to a Market and then a Guild Hall to get a final bonus of 50% to Cloth and Coats. I was wanting the bonus to be about the same.

The two city types would help each other. The monasteries grow the Wine, Ale, and wool. That feeds the Coat factories, Inns, and Taverns of the Towns.

We can maybe make this even more specialized in that Monasteries have a bonus to produce all agricultural products and Towns have a bonus to produce finished products.

The price of cattle was set close to that of Food. Food is priced high so that you can't just buy loads of it to produce new colonists. But, sense cattle has to be first turned into Luxury Food then the price could be lowered down some, maybe close that of sheep? If you go lower than sheep it would seem logical that sheep should be lowered as well.

And salt, I wasn't sure what to do with salt just yet. But, I did research it some what. I live in the US and a big salt mine is on Avery Island, Louisiana. Also, have you ever heard of a Salt Marsh? Thats basically what Avery Island is.

At the moment salt is one of those commodities that the player doesn't have to worry about producing as they can just purchase it and Marshes and deserts are one of the rarer tiles types. If we made it so that salt was costly the player would have to seek out such tiles to maximize his profits. Which could add a more strategical depth to the game.

That maybe a good idea with planting such things as Cotton, barley, and wine bonuses. With the system I have set in place this would be an easy thing to add. Just adding the appropriate build commands to the XML I do believe is all it would take.

I wont have as much time to work on this from now on probably. But what I can do is upload "beta" files in time with changes suggested on the forums so that people can test out.

One other Idea I had was making it so that Cowherdsmen and Shepards could actually go to a tile with their respective resource and then "herd" it back to the town or city. For instance a shepard could move to a sheep bonus thats outside the city radius and then "gather" the sheep like a transport. Then "herd" them back to town. This would produce say 50 Sheep in the city. Sound neat or what?

OK, I'll work on a "beta" update with those changes mention over the next few days as I get time (or take time) and let you know when I post it.

Thanks for the feedback.

Radunz · Jan 21, 2011

Well, about the monasteries, they already start with that bonus so i think they are a little over powered, because you start with it already.Also i they automaticly generate 2 points of research, wich a friend of mine used to ''cheat'' he builded a lot of monasteries and before the end of the dark ages he had longbown =/.
The mod is reeealy good just need some balancing

[MOD] Medieval: Conquests

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