[Religion and Revolution]: Mod Development

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I love both ideas! :goodjob:

Great. :)
(I will put them on our list "Planned" then.)

About the first one (smuggling and Royal patrol), we would have to be careful... Could everyone use the "Sail-to-Europe"-Sea-tile spawned by the patrol? I don't wan't to see to many "Sail-to-Europe"-Sea-tile's appearing in the middle of my maps!

I am not sure but I believe we have a misunderstanding here. :)

Royal Patrols do not create new "Sail-to-Europe"-Sea-tile, they use existing ones to be spawned.
Royal Patrols of a King are spawned at a "Sail-to-Europe"-Sea-tile close to the corresponding colony.

About the second idea, we must add some randomness of course. We could trigger "Martin Luther's 95 thesis" in 1517, but after 5 or 6 games we would be quite bored!
So I vote for random events too!

Great, we agree again. :lol:
 
Another little idea. :)

Founding Fathers become available again when Nation is eliminated

I implemented a feature with TAC that allows European Nations to be eliminated under certain conditions, basically when they are chanceless.
(more than 100 rounds played, lost all cities, less than 3 units left.)

So, I was thinking about the following:

If a European Nation is eliminated from the game, all Founding Fathers that nation has acquired get available again so the remaining European Nations could acquire them again.
(Same number of Founding Father Points, they required in the first time.)

So, if another nation gets another Founding Father you really wanted, that Founding Father is not lost forever.
You will get a second chance for the Founding Father, if the other nation is eliminated.

Implementation of this feature as a game option.
(So playing the current system is still possible.)
 
Hi raystuttgart,

I'm impressed with ideas of the mod. Thanks for trying make Civ4Col better. :goodjob:

But how much time are you going to wait for TAC 2.03 release?
Do you expect waiting TAC 2.03 for months (or even years :p ) will be better then using stable 2.02b right now?
Or perhaps significant differences between 2.02b and 2.03 are expected?
 
Hi JFreak,

I think version 2.02c will be released "soon". But I don't know what "soon" means...
Ask someone form TAC-team, they will know better than me.

About Founding Fathers, I say yes !
However, there's another option I wanted to add too, but it might be slightly more complicated to implement. I don't like the actual "selection" mechanism. Especially I don't like the fat that you have to refuse a founding father definitively. So could we do either:

A) We can choose again a FF we have rejected (after getting all the FF in the same category)

or

B) We could choose which category we would like to focus.
Let's say you have enough political points to get two FF, one in trade category and one in military category. You would like to have the military FF first, however you are a few military points short (or simply you have more trade points than military points). Could we add a new line in the FF popup: "Agree", "Reject definitively", "Wait for x "?

Of course I prefer B) !
 
I'm impressed with ideas of the mod.

Thanks, Robert and I really want to create something big here. :)

But how much time are you going to wait for TAC 2.03 release?
Do you expect waiting TAC 2.03 for months (or even years :p ) will be better then using stable 2.02b right now?
Or perhaps significant differences between 2.02b and 2.03 are expected?

I really do not know, how long TAC will need to release TAC 2.03. :dunno:

But
A) We have promised not to release our mod before TAC 2.03 is out.
B) There will be some important improvements until release TAC 2.03 we want to have.

What we probably will do:

We continue preparing our features and setting up our plans.
When TAC 2.02c is out (which should be soon), we start integration of our features in that.
When TAC 2.03 is out, we will do a merge.
After the merge, we will finish up everything we want for our 1. release.
Then there will be a release.

Sorry, but there will not be anything available to community until a few weeks after TAC 2.03. ;)
(Nothing is going to change here.)
 
About Founding Fathers, I say yes !

Ok, I will put in on our list.

B) Could we add a new line in the FF popup: "Agree", "Reject definitively", "Wait for x Rounds"?

Of course I prefer B) !

Ok, then let us do this. :)
I should be pretty simple to implement.

How do we name the feature ?
("Postponing Founding Fathers" ?)

I will put it on our list, too. :thumbsup:
 
Another idea.
(It is a little inspired by DoaNE. ;) )

Storagehouse in Europe and Trading Contracts

There would be a new Sub-Screen in Europe Screen.
There you could see your Storagehouse and currently available Trading Contracts and active Trading Contracts.

Instead of directly selling goods, you could unload them in the storage house and eventually sell the goods at a later point.
(For example if a European Event has changed prices so you do not want to sell goods at the moment.
Also I think about having further Events that increase prices of goods sometimes.)

From time to time you will get offered a "Trading Contract".

A Trading Contract would mean something like that:
Bring 1000 Furs to you storehouse in the next 30 rounds.

You then choose which Trading Contract you want to take on.
It will then be added to your active Trading Contracts.

If you do achieve, the goods will be automatically be removed from the Storagehouse and you will get a big amount of money.
(More than you would get by normally selling the goods.)

If you do not achieve you will have to pay a fine and the Trading Contract will be removed from your list of active Trading Contracts.

By selling goods via fullfilling Trade Contacts, there is no negative effects on prices.
(Founding Father Points for Trade are of course also generated.)

Trading contracts will appear relatively randomly.
A Trading contract will only be available for a limited number of rounds and then disappear again.

In the beginning of the game, the demanded amount of goods for these Trading Contracts is relatively small,
but the demanded amounts will increase as game progresses.
(Eventually it could be increased every time you fulfill a contract.)

AI would not use this feature.
(It is simply too difficult to teach AI.)

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Feedback ? :)
 
How do we name the feature ?
("Postponing Founding Fathers" ?)

I will put it on our list, too. :thumbsup:

Yes "Postponing Founding Fathers" is a good name.

Storagehouse in Europe and Trading Contracts
I like the idea, of course ! :goodjob:
Two questions, must we sell only goods, and must we limit the "achievement gift" to money?
I mean, could the king ask us to bring back converted natives to Europe, we would "sell" them ("selling" isn't the right word, we would get a retribution when we bring them back. I'm not talking about slavery!).

raystuttgart said:
If you do achieve, the goods will be automatically be removed from the Storagehouse and you will get a big amount of money.
Could we get something else? A special bonus? E.G. invention points, crosses etc...
Of course, in many cases we would get money.
 
Storagehouse in Europe and Trading Contracts
I like the idea, of course ! :goodjob:

Great. :)

Two questions, must we sell only goods, and must we limit the "achievement gift" to money?
I mean, could the king ask us to bring back converted natives to Europe, we would "sell" them ("selling" isn't the right word, we would get a retribution when we bring them back. I'm not talking about slavery!).

Could we get something else? A special bonus? E.G. invention points, crosses etc...
Of course, in many cases we would get money.

It is a matter of implementation effort, we want to put into this. :)
(I would like to keep this feature simple in the first version.)

About bringing other things than goods to Storagehouse:

Please let us stay with goods to bring to the storage house.
(No units.)

It would be a lot of effort for a few exceptions ...

About different rewards:

How would you explain something like Culture, Invention Points, Crosses, ... ?
There is no story behind these "Trading Contracts".

I wanted to randomly generate them by following certain rules (formulas) for defining amounts and gold rewarded.
(Having a few XML-Attributes in the yields to define if they could be used for Trading Contracts.)

Wouldn't it be kind of strange, if you bring furs and get crosses as reward ?

-----------

But maybe you have some different concept in mind. :thumbsup:
 
You're right ! Maybe as a quest... Bringing a native to the Kings court and getting a reward in exchange.
Let's stick to money then.

I've been reeding Agaro's post about TAC. It's quite interesting. It remembers me a few of my ideas.
I find it quite unfair you can only build one improvement on Tundra plots (Lodge). Why can't we build a Farm? I was wondering if we could add a Camp improvement(as in Civ 4)...
It's just an idea.

About wagons!
I actually thought it was realistic and useful to be able to ship empty wagons.
I agree with agaro. Do you Ray? Of course, this would only apply to empty wagons.
Could we also buy Wagons in Europe screen?
 
You're right ! Maybe as a quest... Bringing a native to the Kings court and getting a reward in exchange.
Let's stick to money then.

Ok. :)

I find it quite unfair you can only build one improvement on Tundra plots (Lodge). Why can't we build a Farm? I was wondering if we could add a Camp improvement(as in Civ 4)...

Did you take a look at the improvements in my Preview ?
(There is a Lodge and a Hunter's Camp in there.)

I agree with agaro. Do you Ray? Of course, this would only apply to empty wagons.
Could we also buy Wagons in Europe screen?

In my Preview you will see, that Galeons can transport Wagons.

But if you want empty Wagons to be transportable with smaller ships too, then it is fine for me. :thumbsup:
(I would still like to give them iBerthSize of at least 3.)

However, I do not feel that it should be possible to buy Wagons in Europe.
It simply is much more atmospheric to me, if you have to build them in the New World.
 
I like the sound of the ideas being generated. I was just thinking, and feel free to throw this out if it is something too complicated or has no interest within the wider community. But... when you go to war with other powers you can typically negotiate terms, especially if the conflict is going in your favor. Could you do this with your king during the WOI? Say for example, you have been fighting a protracted war that does not look like it will end soon, and you have control of enough colonies to be satisfied, could you sue for a settlement? Or alternatively if you have your king on the ropes and do not want to expand the extra cost and bloodshed to finish him off, could you offer to end the war on terms favorable to you? Perhaps end the war for a lump sum of gold, or offer to end the war in exchange for possession of several colonies still under royal control? Just an idea!

Also I know we talked about the idea of colonial satisfaction a while ago and how war would affect it. Would there be a way to affect satisfaction back in your mother country? I was just thinking about the historical end of the WOI, and how a long war, that raised taxes back in England and seemed to accomplish very little eventually turned the British populace against continuing a war with the colonies and how the surrender of a British army at Yorktown finally convinced the Brits that the war was very likely unwinable. If the king has to worry about satisfaction also would they try to force a speedy end to the revolution? That could add a missing dimension to the game, a battle of not only military but political wits and wills. Again they are just thoughts, not even sure if such a concept would even be possible?

Let me know what you guys think.
 
I like the sound of the ideas being generated.

Hi colonialfan, happy that you are back. :)

I was just thinking, and feel free to throw this out if it is something too complicated or has no interest within the wider community.

Community is welcome to give input and feedback. :thumbsup:

But... when you go to war with other powers you can typically negotiate terms, especially if the conflict is going in your favor. Could you do this with your king during the WOI? Say for example, you have been fighting a protracted war that does not look like it will end soon, and you have control of enough colonies to be satisfied, could you sue for a settlement? Or alternatively if you have your king on the ropes and do not want to expand the extra cost and bloodshed to finish him off, could you offer to end the war on terms favorable to you? Perhaps end the war for a lump sum of gold, or offer to end the war in exchange for possession of several colonies still under royal control? Just an idea!

See, the thing is, that WOI is the final phase of the game.
Most players will not like to shorten it, because after it, the game is over.

What you suggest is a lot of effort and personally I do not see a lot of use in it, sorry. :dunno:

Also I know we talked about the idea of colonial satisfaction a while ago and how war would affect it. Would there be a way to affect satisfaction back in your mother country? I was just thinking about the historical end of the WOI, and how a long war, that raised taxes back in England and seemed to accomplish very little eventually turned the British populace against continuing a war with the colonies and how the surrender of a British army at Yorktown finally convinced the Brits that the war was very likely unwinable. If the king has to worry about satisfaction also would they try to force a speedy end to the revolution? That could add a missing dimension to the game, a battle of not only military but political wits and wills. Again they are just thoughts, not even sure if such a concept would even be possible?

It would probably be possible.

If we would do something like that, WOI would automatically get easier over time and I would not like that.
(Troops of the king would get malus because of satisfaction.)

Again, it would mean a lot of effort and I personally do not see a lot of use in it, sorry. :dunno:
 
No need to apologize Ray, I was just throwing out an idea, but I think ultimately you are right. In fact the more I thought about the idea itself, the less I began to like it. If you could negotiate a peace with the king, what would stop you from just holding out with one or two colonies and abandoning the rest. Where's the fun in that! Not one of my better ideas for the game. :(
 
I see that everyone agrees!
I like to fight till the end, as everyone else!

A small question. Could we choose AI's difficulty level in custom game?
These are XML-settings.
(There are 2 of them: standard and quick game.)
Before I start a game, I usually change all kinds of XML-settings to the way I want to play that specific game. :)
Most player's would rather be able to do this in-game...

It's just an idea...:cool:
 
Sorry to jump in the bandwagons, but are animals or even fabled beasts included, as an option at least? The map in Col is rather boring, you don't have much diversity to expect when you explore. Adding animals, lairs, some sorts of Indians (yes Native...) fabled beasts and others things like that would spice exploration.

and also, I hope that the Indians can burn to the ground your settlements... This is historical, and is a nice way to prevent over expansion.

Before I forget, I hope you'll get rid of the stupid price mechanism, where selling banana rise the price of muskets, or the reverse. Nonsense, that was not there in the original Col.

In TAC also, I see you can have cuirassiers rapidly. This not historical at all. Even dragoons were super rare. First, horses where a pain to convoy to the new world, and even during the AWI, the rebels only had a few dragoons.
 
Hi again Vorpal+5,

I assume you've seen my reply on the Dawn of a New Era sub-forum...

About wild animals, we have already answered the question: it's a yes ! :goodjob:

About fabled beast, we haven't discussed this yet. However I think Ray told me than someone in TAC-team wanted to do a Werewolf feature. I'm not sure about that, but I think it was Writing Bull's idea.

Vorpal+5 said:
animals, lairs, some sorts of Indians (yes Native...) fabled beasts and others things like that would spice exploration.
I really love Fall from Heaven II's exploration mechanisms. I'm waiting for Ray's answer, but fabled beasts could be fun, if you choose them wisely! But of course, with our wild animals, and pirates etc... you will probably not be bored!

Vorpal+5 said:
and also, I hope that the Indians can burn to the ground your settlements... This is historical, and is a nice way to prevent over expansion.
Well they already can! I've seen many settlements burned to ashes!

Vorpal+5 said:
Before I forget, I hope you'll get rid of the stupid price mechanism, where selling banana rise the price of muskets, or the reverse. Nonsense, that was not there in the original Col.
You must be wrong. Each yield is independent, but sometimes you'll get a random price change...

Vorpal+5 said:
In TAC also, I see you can have cuirassiers rapidly. This not historical at all. Even dragoons were super rare. First, horses where a pain to convoy to the new world, and even during the AWI, the rebels only had a few dragoons.
Well, all I can say, is that we're planning to add inventions to our mod, so you will probably have to wait before getting cuirassiers, but we haven't fully discussed that part.;)
 
About wild animals, we have already answered the question: it's a yes ! :goodjob:

:thumbsup:

About fabled beast, we haven't discussed this yet.

"Fabled beasts" is something I really explicitly don't want to have.
It does not fit into the atmosphere (at least generally historical and authentical) I want.
I do not want to have "Fantasy"-stuff ...

However I think Ray told me than someone in TAC-team wanted to do a Werewolf feature. I'm not sure about that, but I think it was Writing Bull's idea.

Writing Bull started creating a ModMod "Werewolves" based on TAC.
It is a totally different scenario with new Yields, Units, Professions ...
(It is not simply adding a feature "Werewolves" to TAC.)

I really love Fall from Heaven II's exploration mechanisms. I'm waiting for Ray's answer, but fabled beasts could be fun, if you choose them wisely! But of course, with our wild animals, and pirates etc... you will probably not be bored!

Sorry, but I do not have Civ4 anymore and have never played Fall from Heaven II or any other Civ4-mod. :dunno:
I simply do not know the exploration mechanism of that mod. :(
(Currently I do not have the patience or time to test Civ4-Mods ...)

But as I said, I do not want fabled beasts.

Well they already can! I've seen many settlements burned to ashes!

Yes, Natives burn down your cities if you are at war with them and loose a fight for a city.

You must be wrong. Each yield is independent, but sometimes you'll get a random price change...

There are 2 things:

A) Amount of a specific yield sold -> prices of that yield drop
B) Amount of yields sold in general -> triggers random price fluctuations

Well, all I can say, is that we're planning to add inventions to our mod, so you will probably have to wait before getting cuirassiers, but we haven't fully discussed that part.;)

Yes, there are many discussions ahead about Inventions / Knowledges. ;)

But in general, I also think that it might be very interesting to unlock Units / Buildings / Professions / Promotions by Inventions / Knowledges. :thumbsup:
 
Writing Bull started creating a ModMod "Werewolves" based on TAC.
It is a totally different scenario with new Yields, Units, Professions ...
(It is not simply adding a feature "Werewolves" to TAC.)
Yes, it's a discrete project which is only playable at its own scenario-maps and can't become a part of another mod ...
 
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