Middle-Earth:Lord of the Mods (XI)

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Hello,

Was brainstorming Isengard and came up with 3 ideas:

1. have standard orcish stats but interchange names and graphics betweeen men and orcs. Either some lines are mannish and some orcish or some parts of some lines are varaied. Confusing and difficult.

2. Have both mannish and orcish units available. IMHO too much.

3. Have mannish units come through buildings. Give them a wonder in the 4th age (Treaty with Dunlendings) that puts an otherwise unattainable building in every city on the continent. This building gives a dunlending every 7 (or so) turns.

I personally like 3. it helps with balancing out the lack of settlers (Only through buildings) and relatively small empire and production. throughout the 1st to 3rd eras Isengard should concentrate solely on research, and then when it gets to the 4th era can bloom. will require significany balancing, but might be workable.

Re: barbarians. we have barbarian horsemen in civ3 that pop up nowhere near a horse resource. don't be too worried about having barbarian wolves.

RRnut
 
I loved AlcTrv's BIG post! :lol:

Wolves, Spiders and Kraken have my vote for the three barbarian units, great ideas. The Corsairs will be a part of the Southron civ, so it would be odd having Corsair ships both as Southrons and as "barbarians." Besides, this way, the Kraken will attack both good and evil civs equally. Same with the Spiders and the Wolves. That sounds sort of right, because there are many evil (or unpleasant) things in Middle-earth that aren't necessarily friendly with Sauron and his allies.

On RRNut's Isengard ideas,

If #3 can be done, I'd go for it. If not, then I'd go for #1. On option 3, what units would Isengard get in the first three eras, though, orcs? (This is getting weirder, isn't it? Saruman wasn't always corrupt!) Maybe option #1 is better after all? Dang, I wish I had all the answers! :mad: :D
 
Yea, I was thinking orcs. 3 can be done IMNSHO, but will require a lot of balance testing.

As far as Saruman being not being always corrupt, look at it this way. From the time that he desired power, and thus became the leader of a "civilization" he was corrupt. This mod simply extrapolates that backwards!

RRnut
 
Okay, cool! :cool:
 
Hello,

Nobody else has any ideas re: Isengard?

I'll leave this for the weekend:

Tenative orc listing:

Goblin Spear
Goblin Sword

both upgrade to

Orc which is both defensive and offensive infantry.

Uruk

Uruk Hai


RRnut
 
Id give Isengard mannish units untill lateron. Then (dunno when exactly) there should be a really kickass wonder(s) which spawns orcs and together with that tech he should also be able to build orcs.

So Isengard would suck in the beginning, but then suddenly should be albe to build a massive army of orcs.
 
I agree with Wimp here about Isengard. Start mannish and turn orcish later.

I have a neat idea for the Isengard workers: use the pediaicons.txt to let them change looks in the fourth era (just as the modern worker in vanilla), to make them change from mannish workers to orcs. This way Saruman can tell his orcs to fell all those trees. :D

I can live with wolves and spiders (it seems I'm outnumbered anyways ;) ), but I don't like the kraken, unless anyone can show me giant squid used to swim around in ME.
I prefer a simple pirate ship.
 
I too think Mannish units first, Orkish later for Isengard sounds right.

And I love mrtn's Worker idea!

The Watcher in the Water is sometimes interpreted as a kraken, but that's about it. Despite the Professors fascination with maritime voyaging, surprisingly little of the action in Silm and LotR take place as sea.

What about a "storm" unit that randomly zooms around and sinks ships? Unaffiliated pirates are about as unattested as kraken.
 
I was worried about the lack of textual support for the Kraken. It seems that it is largely a result of David Day's imagination conflated with the Watcher in the Water, nothing more. It seems to me a safe enough extrapolation, though. I would rather have extrapolated Kraken roaming the seas than having both Southron Corsairs and generic barbarian pirates roaming the seas.

But if we don't want to go for extrapolation, then the storm idea is the best so far.

Okay, seeing how the tide is turning towards Mannish units for early Isengard, my preference for RRNut's option #1 (or thereabouts) is overturning my agreement on his option #3. I'm so fickle. But if we have mannish units for Isengard early on, then we can have lots of those Wild Men (not Drúedain, though) types that roamed the western forests prior to the arrival of the Numenoreans that were under the shadow of Sauron. These dudes could be the imaginary forerunners of the Dunlendings, for example. We could use the Conan-style half-naked dude graphics for some of these guys (maybe?).

Egad, I just want to work on the graphics!!!
 
I just wanted to say you guys are doing an awesome job and I'm sure this mod will be amazing. I kinda of like the idea that makes buildings spawn units though isengard should start man then turn orc.

Again, very good job. Keep up the good work. I'll try to keep up with the new posts and comment here and there.
 
There was a seadragon off the coast of Andrast i believe. And also some sea serpents (or perhaps Im just stating ICEs vision from MERP, i dont recall)... Kraken sounds good to me.
 
Hail and well-met, Eddiit. Welcome to the mod. We look forward to your participation!
 
Hello,

So it comes down to this for isengard:

1. Do we want to give them men and then have orcs at the end?

2. Or give them orcs and then men at the end through the wonder?

I like 2, what does everybody else like?


I somewhat remember a sea monster somewhere in ME. can't remember where. any ideas? prefer some sort of monster over a pirate ship as monsters would attack everybody including evil ships.

RRnut
 
Well.... I kinda like 1 but have them get orcs through a wonder....or maybe 2. Damn, I dunno. Yah I'm lening towards 1 right now.
 
Hmm, It seems as if I remember now. Didn't Eandril ?spelling? fight some sea monsters on the way over to Valinor? or was that just in the HOME series? or was it just in my memory like so many other things. hmmmm.

In other news, Welcome Eddiit!

RRnut
 
I'm going to have to vote 1 also. It just makes more sense.
Sorry haven't been around for awhile, will update soon. The post will post the agreed mannish lines (yes, dumbed down cavalry) and then we can start finagling for the next unit line, the Elves.
Post sometime on the 5th.

While I’m at it do you guys have a better sounding name for a non-era tech, which gives Elves the ability to plant forests?
I have “forest lore” :rolleyes:
 
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