How is AI able to get so many missionaries?

Did they build Borubodur for 3 free missionaries? The ai also pays less for each missionary (maybe 66% of normal).
 
Illianor123 said:
Did they build Borubodur for 3 free missionaries? The ai also pays less for each missionary (maybe 66% of normal).
Click to expand...

That was built a long time ago in this game

More:
Their capital only produces 7 faith per turn
The civ that built Borobudur was Japan not Siam
Japan seems to be the only civ able to do a pretty good job keeping their cities mostly their own religion.

Religion stats for this game:
Siam's religion: 37 cities
Japan's : 8 cities
My religion: 2 cities
Some other one: 1 city
last religion: 1 city
 
Only five? I'm playing on Prince and I counted 11 of them in my current game.

(at the same time).
 
1. Piety is very common for AIs, which includes reduced cost Missionaries
2. Not all AIs are going to have the option of faith buying buildings even if they went Piety

So basically whichever AIs went Piety but missed out on religious faith buildings will spam out Missionaries if they have a decent faith per turn output from any source (faith pantheon, faith natural wonder, some of the world wonders, religious city state friend or ally)
 
If they have Religious Order and Mandate of Heaven I think that becomes a 50% discount.
 
The ai are stupid and spam missionaries and waste prophets. I know firsthand how annoying there antics and how bad the religions they force upon me are but I always think that those missionaries could have been a scientists or that prophet could have been a good tile.
 
Even better is when the AI spams archaeologists and does nothing with them. :) Now I can use a few captured archaeologists.
 
If it helps, I think the AI treats missionaries similarly to military units, in that it will hold a few back and then flood your cities at once. I don't know for a fact, but I'm guessing it's based on a calculation of how many are needed to flip a given city. In terms of how the AI can spam so many: I have given up worrying about how the AI gets so many units. On higher difficulties, you will always be outnumbered in every unit category. That's just the reality of it.

(By the way, I finished a game on immortal awhile back where I purposely selected only religious civs. At that difficulty, I don't bother with religion. They just went ape trying to convert each other's cities! It was a ridiculous game in that they went to war constantly and totally ignored my sneaky culture victory. First time I played at that level and never went to war.)
 
Primacide said:
If it helps, I think the AI treats missionaries similarly to military units, in that it will hold a few back and then flood your cities at once.
Click to expand...

Yes, behavior matches that of that for a single city. With the proviso that the AI doesn't know about the "Unwelcome Evangelist" penalty.
 
AI gets a faith handicap. I don't remember if it increases production or decreases cost, but they get something.
 
What's really crazy is watching the AI send prophets at me, sometimes two at a time, and when I check the Religion screen I see that they haven't even enhanced their religion to get a full complement of beliefs!

If you have enough extra units (obsolete troops, Great Generals, etc) you can surround the Great Prophet and, depending on what the map looks like, you can "herd" them into a barbarian camp. Once they capture the Prophet you can defeat them and take it for yourself. If it has not spread religion yet you get a free Holy Site.

If it has already spread religion... it still may have some use. If you want to stir the pot and get a religious Civ to declare war on you, so you don't look like the bad guy, you can send those partially used Prophets into their territory. First zap their Holy City, then any others you can manage. This will really mess up their network of religious pressure and get them angry at you. Again, only do this if you want to fight them eventually.

In my current G&K game as France I have corralled four or five Prophets and herded them into barbarian camps. I got two Holy Sites out of it. I founded Christianity and Russia founded Hinduism. We got along well until she sent two Great Prophets into my territory and converted Vienna while I wasn't looking (Austria got taken out early). This actually wasn't so bad since I could then buy a mosque for Vienna. I captured both her Prophets by the "herding" method. Later I retaliated by sending other captured Prophets (a Spanish Confucian one and a Dutch Jewish one) into her territory to mess up her religious heartland. Her border cities are already following my religion. She got mad and just declared war on me. Once I push back her initial force I will take her out - I'm going for a Domination victory. Oh well, she started it... :lol:
 
vorius said:
That was built a long time ago in this game

More:
Their capital only produces 7 faith per turn
The civ that built Borobudur was Japan not Siam
Japan seems to be the only civ able to do a pretty good job keeping their cities mostly their own religion.

Religion stats for this game:
Siam's religion: 37 cities
Japan's : 8 cities
My religion: 2 cities
Some other one: 1 city
last religion: 1 city
Click to expand...

SIAM UA: Food, Culture and Faith from friendly City-States increased by 50%
Click to expand...

-Did you check how many religious city states are they allied with?
-Are they working some natural wonder that gives religion? (those seems to pop a lot)
-Do they have some belief that grants them additional faith?

Moreover looking at the capital's faith production doesn't tell you much, usually the best way to spread your religion is to have a lot of cities. Each city with "organized religion" a shrine and a temple can dish 5 piety per turn. What the capital produces is just a little thing unless you have the grand temple, and they obviously do not.
 
My bet will be that they have pilgrimage as founder believe. Ai actually pretty good in leveraging that one. On other note when I do my liberty/piety 8-10 city strategy I have about 150 faith turn at the end of feudal era.
 
Kirin Rider said:
What's really crazy is watching the AI send prophets at me, sometimes two at a time, and when I check the Religion screen I see that they haven't even enhanced their religion to get a full complement of beliefs!

If you have enough extra units (obsolete troops, Great Generals, etc) you can surround the Great Prophet and, depending on what the map looks like, you can "herd" them into a barbarian camp. Once they capture the Prophet you can defeat them and take it for yourself. If it has not spread religion yet you get a free Holy Site.

If it has already spread religion... it still may have some use. If you want to stir the pot and get a religious Civ to declare war on you, so you don't look like the bad guy, you can send those partially used Prophets into their territory. First zap their Holy City, then any others you can manage. This will really mess up their network of religious pressure and get them angry at you. Again, only do this if you want to fight them eventually.

In my current G&K game as France I have corralled four or five Prophets and herded them into barbarian camps. I got two Holy Sites out of it. I founded Christianity and Russia founded Hinduism. We got along well until she sent two Great Prophets into my territory and converted Vienna while I wasn't looking (Austria got taken out early). This actually wasn't so bad since I could then buy a mosque for Vienna. I captured both her Prophets by the "herding" method. Later I retaliated by sending other captured Prophets (a Spanish Confucian one and a Dutch Jewish one) into her territory to mess up her religious heartland. Her border cities are already following my religion. She got mad and just declared war on me. Once I push back her initial force I will take her out - I'm going for a Domination victory. Oh well, she started it... :lol:
Click to expand...


Haha, never thought of herding prophets into barb camps, that's wonderful.
 
There can be many reasons why ai would end up with many missionaries... higher difficulty ais can do that, choosing piety gives that much more faith and building Borobudur also gives you 3 free missionaries. You can try to capture the missionaries with the belief that the ai focused more on faith than in usual defense...
 
I think that their goal is to take out your religion, not necessarily to make the most logical use of their faith to help their Civilization. And really to take out another religion, you would need to have a big rush, and pray (pardon the pun) that they're not using inquisitors. And as somebody was saying before they don't really seem to mind diplomatic hits against you very much. If I was playing against a human, I would be weary of spamming missionaries at the same time, because I would realize that they could DOW against me, capturing them all and I would be out a lot of faith.
 
In the earlier parts of the game when Great Prophets are still a problem I typically save a Great Prophet just to re-flip my holy cities religion, just in case I've got some religiously aggressive civ in my neighborhood. In my current game I had to go to war with the Celts twice because she was trying to convert my cities. I warned her about it, she told me to piss off, so then any time a Prophet ended up showing up in my borders I'd immediately steal and delete the Prophet and fight a short war with her.

I will always keep a GP when I'm playing as Venice if I happen to pick up a religion while playing as them. I've had too many bad experiences with Civ's flipping it and then not being able to get my religion back up and running. Very frustrating.
 
MechMedic130 said:
In the earlier parts of the game when Great Prophets are still a problem I typically save a Great Prophet just to re-flip my holy cities religion, just in case I've got some religiously aggressive civ in my neighborhood. In my current game I had to go to war with the Celts twice because she was trying to convert my cities. I warned her about it, she told me to piss off, so then any time a Prophet ended up showing up in my borders I'd immediately steal and delete the Prophet and fight a short war with her.

I will always keep a GP when I'm playing as Venice if I happen to pick up a religion while playing as them. I've had too many bad experiences with Civ's flipping it and then not being able to get my religion back up and running. Very frustrating.
Click to expand...

It's a lot cheaper to get an inquisitor, park it in your city, and thus prevent anyone else from flipping it away to start with.
 
MechMedic130, you know that placing an Inquisitor inside or next to your city prevents the rival Missionaries and Great Prophets from converting the city to their religion, right?
 
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