Um, can you plz post a savegame to look at? I'm having my troulbes interpreting the situation without being able to look at all screens.
Normally, you should be able to get 3-5 techs with Aesthetics alone, put some beakers into them, if they don't wanna trade. And after getting them, bribe the people you didn't give Aesthetics against Civs with other Religions, they will be declaring for the whole game then.
Sure, I'll attach the savegame in just a bit. Be aware that it requires the BULL/BUG mod. Thank you for your interest; it'd be nice to get advice from someone used to these settings.
That's pretty much the plan with Aesthetics. Did you open the foreign advisor screenshot yet? I can get maybe four techs atm, but only one of them I care much about (Sailing). I was debating whether or not to wait to make the trade. I would like to get Math, but they're not trading it yet. So, I was debating whether I should convert religions first before trading.
I'm sure that I'll be able to solve that problem with BUG/BULL.
From the Screen only I'd advise you to trade Aesthetics to Alpha with HC to see what you could get from Saladin (all the low-stuff possibly). I don't think HC will trade with the Buddhist Fraction, so you will have some time and can safely convert and put some beakers into Math, IW and HBR to get all three from them, point is, can you get them to pleased just by adopting their Religion (I think you can, but I don't know those leaders well enough and cannot see current relations and don't know the threshold when somebody gets pleased / friendly but I could find that out through testing, I always wanted to know those values) .
I will look at that. I just have to finish this game where I landed the Lib -> Med Slingshot. Sushi-games on Huge maps are sick in the last stages, the City Advisor can't handle it and always stops Growth of the cities, so I have to turn him off and micromanage 110 cities myself But the game is in it's last turns, shouldn't be too long. Moderator Action: Expletive deleted. Please do not replace letters in inappropriate words with symbols to evade the auto-censor. It is against the forum rules.
Ok, had a look at the Save. My intuition to put some turns into Alpha and trade it with HC to get Techs from Saladin didn't fail me I won't spoil what happened afterwards, only that much, that...
Spoiler:
...you can get everything you want for Aesthetics if you do it right. That won't be your main problem though
Turn 215 through turn 260: Stormy Clouds Gather Me Up
Lots of things going on this turnset. Let's start with the state of the Empire:
Spoiler:
Let's see, a couple of new cities and the capital is slowly starting to come together. I'll talk about the new cities further down.
As WillToAct pointed out, TunaTown can't be a town of Tuna when it doesn't have fish. So, I renamed it. I couldn't come up with anything that combined fish, rice, and cows, so I just called it Cornucopia for now. I'd like to call it something based on "farm" because it's being used as a cottage farm and will soon be used as a GP farm. Any ideas?
You may notice that I finally got rid of the barb galley. It only took me three galleys and a couple hundred years to get rid of the pirate and a friend it conjured up soon thereafter. Not too shabby! I hate barb galleys.
The capital:
Spoiler:
Yes, I just realized that I'm working a bare grassland tile. In my defense, I only just grew big enough and I've got workers on the scene now.
My Tech Adviser:
Spoiler:
And now that you've seen where I'm at now, let me explain what's been going on:
year 1210 BC: The first war that I'm aware of erupts between Ragnar (the aggressor) and the Arabs. Isn't it cute? Saladin has been plotting war for over 20 turns (I can't remember how many turns for sure, but he started plotting in the last turnset) but apparently Ragnar beat him to it.
Monty also begins war preparations. Thank goodness he's on my side! I beg some gold off of him.
Turn 235: I managed to take the barb city to my north. It looked important, because I thought it might disrupt trade. When I got around to taking it, I got lucky and grabbed three workers out of the deal without losing anybody.
Spoiler:
I forgot to write down what turn it happened, but Ragnar demanded that I help him fight the Arabs. I declare war since Saladin's cities aren't anywhere near mine except for one oddball city. Might as well go for the brownie points, n'est pas? It was only defended by a single chariot and had nothing going for it; I razed it to the ground because there was no way it was going to become useful. You can still see the ruins to this day, just north of the Incan city Ica.
930 BC: I get my first GS. I sent him to the capital to make an academy there. No point bulbing Math when everyone already knows it except for me.
Ragnar and Saladin also declare peace on this turn. I'm stuck in the war. I should have seen if I could give Saladin that city back that I took from him in exchange for peace. Bleh. Now, I probably should bribe somebody to join the war. Fortunately, nobody has metal casting yet, despite having Compass
Even the most cold, ruthless leaders feel sorry for me at this point:
Spoiler:
So that's that. Despite gems and a leader with much in the way of early production bonuses, I'm still a nobody in the international community Good thing I never put any money down on my winning this game
Going Forward: I'm woefully behind in many ways, but I'm not ready to give up yet. Here's the plan: I can get another round of tech trades going once MC comes in. I can then turn research off and "acquire" my next techs through the Incas. I'm really regretting killing off that Arab city now, but whatever. We shall overcome!
So, we steal our way through Monarchy and maybe the rest (Incas have Feudalism by now, btw). That will let us grow the capital even larger so I can have all those cottages in anticipation of CS, which is the most important tech at this stage.
I can start consolidating my empire and focus on developing the cities that I already control. I got all the city spots that I thought were worthwhile and feasible (I never really thought that I could get the jungle spot, I figured either Ragnar or the barbs would build it first). I dunno, maybe my cities will be good enough to "get 'er done" and pull out of this nose-dive. It'll be interesting to find out one way or another.
Oh hey, you're right. I was just so used to Toku not wanting to trade that I never noticed when he got currency.
Let's say he's willing to trade Mono plus some gold. How much gold would be worth Aesth?
On a different topic, I really should've met more AI at this point I think. Without horsies hooked up, maybe I should invest in a scout or two? I had an axeman or two wandering around, but they got eaten by Arab chariots.
300g for a tech at that time is already very good, if you get Mono, take it, no matter how much else he has. Perhaps you can even sell Mono to some other Civs and fasten up your Research somehow.
And for Scouting, use a WB and a Scout in Combination.
Sorry. I can't keep those religious techs straight since I rarely research them myself (I know, Oracle is good if you can get it. I just don't bother trying. Ditto OR).
And yes, I was indeed considering stealing from the Incas at this point. I don't like the idea of researching something that everybody already has or that they will soon get. My decision to steal depends on whether I can get Monarchy. If I'm going to steal anyway, might as well also grab Math and maybe Calendar.
Feudalism would be a coup de grace, too, since I think the Incas are the only civ with it, but actually, CoL and CS are more important.
Barb workers exploring the untamed wilderness that is the AI world? Yes, there will be danger, excitement, romance more danger! Watch as these poor brave souls face untold adventures, armed with nothing but a spoon! --Sponsored in part by the Muslim Add Workers Council and viewers like you.
300g for a tech at that time is already very good, if you get Mono, take it, no matter how much else he has. Perhaps you can even sell Mono to some other Civs and fasten up your Research somehow.
And for Scouting, use a WB and a Scout in Combination.
WillToAct pointed out that it's Priesthood, not Monotheism. I'll have to double check, but I think that means the tech doesn't give me anything directly, right (the Oracle has already been built, I think)? It's a pre-req for CoL and writing, iIrc. Little chance I can trade it around, either, unfortunately.
Explore with a WB? Why is that better than a trireme? Have I mentioned that I hate barb galleys?
If you can keep your area spawn busted from boats, you should be free to send your triremes out to explore.
How... are you going to steal techs? Do you have any espionage points? Maybe if you have 100% of your palace espionage dedicated to Inca since you met them... kinda doubt it.
^^ Well, I mentioned that I was considering turning my research slider off, but I guess it's not worth it. I don't have the Espionage cost formula memorized, but my only advantage would be the 50% reduction due to waiting. 50% empire-wide bonus versus 75% in your single best commerce-heavy city? It's hard to say which would be stronger. But then I got to consider that Espionage makes techs more expensive, too. I guess I should just straight out research things. That Academy really makes a difference!
With regards to the spawnbust part of your post, do you mean that I should use a WB to spawnbust the coast? The reason I don't think that that is a good idea is that ships all move two spaces. That means that they can get me before I can run away.
Besides, on Mara, ships are one of the few units up to now that are 2 pop whips (settlers are 5 without the first , three with. Workers are normally 2, but I'm EXP so they're 1 after the first )
Well what I said about spawn busting might not apply to your empire, obviously you can't prevent galleys from entering through the AI's coast.
Just to clarify, spawn busting is about eliminating ships before they appear, so it shouldn't be a "risk" in that sense.
Perhaps you can explain the empire-wide 50% reduction bit, I know that a stationed spy lowers the potential cost by that amount?
Espionage might be a good play here, everything about Deity is strange and foreign to me, hehe.
^^Yeah, just like it sounds. The reduction from waiting is not tied to any one city, so you get the full 50% reduction. This is in contrast to, say, an Academy, which gives 50% more beakers but only in the city with the Academy.
I didn't mention this above but a cost reducer is better than a beaker/ espionage/ whatever boost. Think about building libraries when you're CRE. You get 100% boost, which translates to 50% reduction. In other words, you only have to pay half of the cost. This principle is part of the reason why Espionage Economies are so powerful (other reasons: more flexibility, no WFTYBTA, cheaper boosts, points can be "used" passively). On Mara, the wait time is still just 5 turns, so it's extremely effective. I'm just not in a position to abuse it right, though. EE's are much better in the hands of a SPI leader. The other way to jump start your EE is a GSpy, which I can't get yet.
On spawnbusting, you're right. That ex-barb city south of me should keep barb galleys from reaching me anymore. Good call. I probably don't have to worry about attacks from the north either since there aren't any sea resources over there (right? I'm just going off of a quick glance at the screenshot.
On marathon speed, workers cost 120 hammers, each population whipped away yields 90 hammers.
If you are expansive, you get 112 hammers (or perhaps 113, not sure how it is rounded), when whipping one population to a worker.
+25% bonus when producing workers => 90*1.25 = 112,5
So if you have very few hammers invested in a worker, you should still be able to 2-pop-whip a worker for massive overflow.
It requires some micromanagment, and it works only if you don't have a forge.
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But the game is in it's last turns, shouldn't be too long.
I won't spoil what happened afterwards, only that much, that...
Good thing I never put any money down on my winning this game 
Might also be nice to get some Diplo-Bonuses with him.
, three with. Workers are normally 2, but I'm EXP so they're 1 after the first 
