After years of playing, what new things have you found in Civ 4?
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Mizar
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friendly suggestion: you usually do not want to post everything in bold & red.
Oh that takes me back to my lemon chiffon days on the ADOM boards. Yeah, you should totally try to kill Momma Dragon in her cave. She is harmless in the dark, for massively overpowered characters.
Doesn't seem to be the right yellow here though ): .
Doesn't seem to be the right yellow here though ): .
Kallikrates
Prince
@ #501
Wasn't the "culture bomb" severely reduced in impact in BtS (or warlords)? That is, you still get 4000 culture points but the impact on the tiles *around the city* to flip still takes ages. So unless one has absolutely nothing better (GA) to do with the GA it seems like a waste just to skip the turns of anarchy
Wasn't the "culture bomb" severely reduced in impact in BtS (or warlords)? That is, you still get 4000 culture points but the impact on the tiles *around the city* to flip still takes ages. So unless one has absolutely nothing better (GA) to do with the GA it seems like a waste just to skip the turns of anarchy
Seraiel
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Idk, but culture in BtS is a lot simpler and better than in Vanilla. In Vanilla, it was no problem for a neighbouring city to have 2nd and even 1st ring tiles of the other city, in BtS, culture is stronger on the BFC-tiles of a city, so it's very hard for a neighbouring city to get any BFC-tiles of another city.
What could make it appear, as if the culture had no effect, is, that 4k of
simply isn't that much, if an AI has cities with all the superflous infrastructure it builds. One or two Wonders, and even a culture-bombed-city will be struggling for any tiles, especially as the previous culture doesn't get treated completely fair, because when a city pops borders, it accesses the old culture which actually should be completely gone, so if one has below 50% of culture on the new tiles, the AIs city will still get them with a border-pop.
That culture bombs are to expensive to negate anarchy is something else again.
What could make it appear, as if the culture had no effect, is, that 4k of
simply isn't that much, if an AI has cities with all the superflous infrastructure it builds. One or two Wonders, and even a culture-bombed-city will be struggling for any tiles, especially as the previous culture doesn't get treated completely fair, because when a city pops borders, it accesses the old culture which actually should be completely gone, so if one has below 50% of culture on the new tiles, the AIs city will still get them with a border-pop.That culture bombs are to expensive to negate anarchy is something else again.
The culture mechanics are really unintuitive with plot culture and city culture.
When you first see the description you naturally think 4000 instant culture should be worth as much as a city that has produced 20/turn for 200 turns, but thats not how it works at all. Result is that the culture bomb is one huge underwhelming waste of a GP.
In general fighting cultural wars are very rarely worth it. The only exception is really when 1 ocean tile is separating two continents. That's worth fighting for.
When you first see the description you naturally think 4000 instant culture should be worth as much as a city that has produced 20
/turn for 200 turns, but thats not how it works at all. Result is that the culture bomb is one huge underwhelming waste of a GP.In general fighting cultural wars are very rarely worth it. The only exception is really when 1 ocean tile is separating two continents. That's worth fighting for.
oranje willem
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New findings:
1. One can whip Warriors (i. e. pre-Maths) do generatebefore Currency.
2. One can chop into the same Warrior, to make even more
3. OF from one build to another is capped by either the base-OF that would be needed to build that building (i. e. 300when building something which costs 600
How does whipping warriors generate
? By throwing the excess overflow hammers in a wonder for failgold? Or is there a different way?
Seraiel
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How does whipping warriors generate
In the BUG or BUFFY version of the game, OF that would otherwise get wasted is transformed into
, which is a bug-fix that the standard version of the game doesn't have.Early game, you can only have as much OF as the Warrior costs in
, so i. e. on Marathon it costs 30 but a single whip is 90 , therefore 60 are not used, 30 go into OF and 30 that otherwise would be wasted are turned into . If you whip a Warrior even 1 before he'd be completed, the sum of rises and it's even possible to chop tons of Forests into it on the same turn, to create hundreds of way before Currency.
Imperator Knoedel
Simperator Knoedel
In the BUG or BUFFY version of the game, OF that would otherwise get wasted is transformed into
Early game, you can only have as much OF as the Warrior costs in
That's all nice and dandy for BUG and BUFFY, but what about the base game?
Heck, I'm having the distinct impression that overflow has been ludicrously nerfed in Next War or at least the BtS version it was based on, assuming it hasn't been updated since then. I even checked in the PBEM I'm playing with it: I put 62 Hammers into a Workboat which costs 30 Hammers, and somehow only had 15 Hammes overflow the turn after.
Seraiel
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In the base-game you get nothing, so the OF that's too much really is completely gone, into nothing. One reason more, to play with BUG / BUFFY.
Kallikrates
Prince
I thought BUG mod only changed the easily available info, does it change game mechanics like overflow vs. normal BtS?
Pangaea
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I've heard that is the only gameplay it changes, as overflow would otherwise be lost (probably a leftover bug), but if there is some change with global warming too, then that would be two gameplay changes I guess. Makes the Unaltered a little inaccurate, but I'd say both changes are definitely for the better.
I'm having some problems accepting that adding yet another way of getting gold is "definitely for the better". All the cheesy ways of getting gold is hurting the game.
Based on the patch notes for 3.19 it's clearly a bug, but not all bugs should be fixed.
Seraiel
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How is OF being converted being cheesy? It's at the same efficiency than building normal Wealth, and it's a lot more difficult to pull off. How is losing
because of not exactly calculating every OF in front with a calculator fairer?
Seraiel
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You should be able to answer that question, after having read my post.
Seraiel
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There are some more fixes, like i. e. enabling the AI to build Privateers, which I doesn't in standard-BtS. Not every bugfix applied is to the players advantage, those mods just make the game a little more complete.
Kallikrates
Prince
"base game" could have referred to vanilla CIV or any BtS version before some patch. Please do not treat everyone as an idiot. Not all of us can follow all minute changes between patches. As BUG contains "unaltered" in its name, it is quite confusing that overflow mechanics would be different from the latest patched BtS.
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