Ladies and Gentlemen, the recipe to beat Deity

You have only one thing to know in order to beat Deity, because other way you will be overrun scientifically. You don't have to conquer thousand cities in order to do so, 6-9 owned will be enough. (may have to conquer some anyway, but just a few)

You just have to make sure you have around 100 science beakers in turn 100, 500 in turn 200 and 1500+ when you're about to win.

This is a pretty hard objective as you will need constant growth and expansion where happiness can seem so much limiting. But don't worry. Developers and Let's Players have cleared the path before you : you won't have to count each happiness point, you just have to know that it's possible, as long as you focus your expansion / conquests on new luxuries, which can seem trivial (only 4 happy faces after all) but is not.

You can train in Prince difficulty, because you have to know that if you don't achieve this goal, Deity will be a nightmare. Just remember to build no wonder to approach the Deity philosophy.

If you can't do it in Prince, you know you can't beat Deity. Despite multiple tries, I still fail, and I'm on Prince only. That's it. Beating this game highest difficulty level ties exclusively on how and when you grow. No need to think about other ways too much (like war), it's all a question of management.

Now if you have tips in order to achieve this, please feel free to expose them in this thread. Thanks in advance.

Getting more science is actually easier at higher levels than Prince because you can use the AI gold to fund cash buying science buildings. On Prince the AI just won't have the cash to help.
In addition RAs are more valuable at higher difficulty level.

My answer would be a bit shorter: Know how to use and piggyback off the AI.

My own personal reason for playing Immortal over Diety is that I feel a bit discontented having to basically rely on AI bonuses to play the game and also rely on the fact they should obliterate me with a huge carpet of doom but won't because a) I've bribed the right people, or b) they're not able to use that carpet effectively enough.

All that said, Industrial and Modern era wars (which are a usually a walk for a good player in Immortal) can be awfully competitive and dicey in Diety. But again, you're relying upon poor AI combat traits in addition to your own skills.

If you can make friends with cash-rich AI, and bribe an aggressive AI to go around and attack your neighbors instead of you, Diety is quite manageable. Yes, there are certain strategies to employ, but so long as you're not being targeted and can trade for AI lump gold to capitalize on the best buildings as soon as researched, you can catch and keep up.

Certain Diety players more skilled than I might add different comments, but really, Deity is about how able you are to bend the AI to your needs and then take advantage of its massive bonuses. To use the analogy, you start as a Ramora fish eating scraps and then eventually grow into a fish capable of turning on the Sharks to become the Alpha.

You need to be able to do one or both of the two things:
1. Beat the AI in science peacefully. I.e. be ready to launch into space before turn 300.
2. Slow all the AI down scientifically to give yourself more time to do your stuff.

I'm not sure how valid your recipe is if you haven't beaten deity. The general focus on science is true though, and the more behind you are, the more you need to focus on science. This is why the majority of people like to go up to education, ST as fast as possible.

Also, if you can't achieve the beakers objective on prince, you probably won't be able to do it on deity, but even if you can, it doesn't guarantee that you can pull it off in deity. it's much better to gradually increase difficulty levels, allowing you figure out details of your play.

Just watch Marbozir's videos. He uses basically the same strategy time and time again on Diety. It doesn't really matter what civ he is playing.

Pottery, Scout, Tradition almost every time. Rarely liberty.

Get up to three cities and get National College ASAP. Buy a library in your weakest production city to make it happen.

Sell Luxuries and strategic resources as much as possible.

Always go for Rationalism. Anything else is just a waste of time.

Grow, grow, grow! Population = science in Civilization 5. People = beakers.

Get other civs to fight each other. Bribing them to do so is usually laughably cheap.

Only get a few melee units and get a whole bunch of ranged units and promote them for extra range and logistics. (extra shot)

Anyway, watch his videos and you'll see it play out time and time again.

I watched peddroelm videos and saw that he had cleared deity with the honor and commerce social policies which to me is a challenge that I like. The videos are rather long to watch though but I have learned a few tips. Larger populations often make more technology if you can keep them happy then you could also get enough production to make military social policies or more gpt.

The theory isn't the problem, I find. There is plenty of very good advice to be found on these forums. It's putting it into practice that is tricky (for me). This is a "decision-making" game, and if you don't make the right choices it can be fatal. There are so many variables and forking paths. The really good players seem to be good at assessing the costs and benefits as situations present themselves, and they make cool, reasoned choices (no doubt based on a lot of experience). My personal opinion (and it is personal) is that "recipes" can only take you so far. In the end, it is the ability to assess the situation at any time and make better choices that makes the better player.

My two penn'orth.

Once I find a recipe that works...I go off and do something else.

Sessy said:

I'm not sure how valid your recipe is if you haven't beaten deity.

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Obviously you can object the title is misleading, because that's even not a recipe, more a goal to reach, but I found that bit so much important that qualifying it of "recipe" may lead some people in the mess that the game is now. For example, before I realized that, I often stayed with 2 cities only on Prince. With that sort of tactics or playing, I could only beat Emperor at best. My Immortal games were so much discouraging... now that I'm focusing on this, I can totally say that I was doing something wrong for sure. But from where my problem were ? Don't forget, ~100 science beakers in turn ~100, ~500 in turn ~200 and you should be fine.

Also, if you can't achieve the beakers objective on prince, you probably won't be able to do it on deity

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That's what I'm saying ! And that's why I train on Prince. Once I achieve this objective on Prince, I could try out Immortal or Deity. (already beat Emperor, Emperor is really for noobs !)

but even if you can, it doesn't guarantee that you can pull it off in deity. it's much better to gradually increase difficulty levels, allowing you figure out details of your play.

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Because of increased science in trade routes and RAs ? I wouldn't count on it. Trust me, if I can't achieve this on Prince, I will not try on Deity. This point is all about claiming this is a (good) recipe, but I already answered you about this.

As to try out every difficulty, I think I've had enough of my tries ! I can already beat the game on Emperor with suboptimum play, the last two are Immortal and Deity, I could try out Immortal first for sure. The only bit beside internal management and developement is, well, ***WAR***, but I learned how efficient range units are, and I even know we can avoid war in some cases. It's not like AI was good at moving units (and happilly ! ) or it was invading you each time. (unless I bribe it to attack someone else, which I can do and is very simple, one just has to think about it)

tetley said:

Once I find a recipe that works...I go off and do something else.

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Me too.

But that's not really a recipe here, much more a goal to reach, story to clear things out. (probably something close to a "revelation")

Speaking of how it's not quite a recipe: I do domination-style gameplay, I get well over 2000bpt in modern, and it's not enough science. Simple reason: puppets. Screws up the math.

Thormodr said:

Just watch Marbozir's videos.

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I've skimmed through some of his vids and he isn't even close to hitting 500bpt by t200 (or its equivalent on quick/epic/marathon). MadDjinn is a much stronger player, plus he has a lot more content and is pretty entertaining. I'm sure there are other good LP makers out there too.

Sessy said:

Also, if you can't achieve the beakers objective on prince, you probably won't be able to do it on deity, but even if you can, it doesn't guarantee that you can pull it off in deity.

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I disagree. Deity is about helping the AI, not hindering the player. The only ways in which the AI bonuses are going to prove an obstacle to reaching the milestones are if a) they DoW you or b) they beat you to a wonder (which you won't be building many of anyway, the only three I can think of are Oracle, LToP and PT). On the other hand, the AIs have more gold and luxes to lend to you; RAs are worth more; you can steal workers earlier and in greater quantities; and you get science from trade routes! The AIs are far more likely to help you than hinder you, which is why I think hitting any bpt objective is going to be easier on Deity than on Prince.

Naokaukodem said:

You have only one thing to know in order to beat Deity, because other way you will be overrun scientifically. You don't have to conquer thousand cities in order to do so, 6-9 owned will be enough. (may have to conquer some anyway, but just a few)

You just have to make sure you have around 100 science beakers in turn 100

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How the heck do you get to 100 beakers by turn 100.

You would need to have 4 cities of size 12 each (one city with National College) that is still only 85 beakers and I can't even get close to that. By turn 50 I usually only have 2 maybe 3 cities still but they're tiny and by turn 100 I'm usually below 50 beakers still.

See my guide at http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=530940

Learn in Emperor/Immortal to win before T300 and defend your cities against attacks. And you'll win in Deity, unless to don't know how to manage your happiness.

Redaxe said:

How the heck do you get to 100 beakers by turn 100.

You would need to have 4 cities of size 12 each (one city with National College) that is still only 85 beakers and I can't even get close to that. By turn 50 I usually only have 2 maybe 3 cities still but they're tiny and by turn 100 I'm usually below 50 beakers still.

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Let's assume a 15 pop cap with NC, and three 10 pop cities, all with libraries. Then the cap has (15*1.5+6)*1.5=42.75 beakers, and each of the other three cities has 15 beakers, for a total of 87.75 beakers. Still not 100, and I don't know how the hell you'd get three 10 pop cities AND a 15 pop cap with NC by that time.

With universities and full science specialists it might be possible--but that would require Education by T90 or earlier (since you won't have the money to buy 4 unis) which I suppose is possible but very difficult.

But 100 beakers by T100 is definitely not needed to beat Deity. I still struggle to consistently get Education before T110 and can still usually win on Deity.

Hey OP, here is how to beat Diety in one simple shot.

Archipelago.

x2Madda said:

Hey OP, here is how to beat Diety in one simple shot.

Archipelago.

Spoiler :

You can thank me when you are ready

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Don't mock bad water AI

59saintdane said:

I've skimmed through some of his vids and he isn't even close to hitting 500bpt by t200 (or its equivalent on quick/epic/marathon). MadDjinn is a much stronger player, plus he has a lot more content and is pretty entertaining. I'm sure there are other good LP makers out there too.

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Well if Marbozir is a sub optimal player and yet is regularly winning on Diety with ease, what does that say about the game in general?