full PLE mod for BUG

ruff_hi said:

is there a 'turn off all silly filters, groupings, etc' button?

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Yes, the first checkbox on the "Unit Icons" tab of the BUG Options screen, but I highly recommend you try out the filters and stacked view modes. </evangelism>

I think Ruff is just one of those guys who once he made his POV known, he wont' change that POV, even if it means he stands still while the tornado sucks up his house.

EmperorFool said:

Yes, the first checkbox on the "Unit Icons" tab of the BUG Options screen, but I highly recommend you try out the filters and stacked view modes. </evangelism>

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alerum68 said:

I think Ruff is just one of those guys who once he made his POV known, he wont' change that POV, even if it means he stands still while the tornado sucks up his house.

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Truth be told, I actually do sometimes use these little suckers

It would be nice if the promotion available sign was more obvious than the light blue surround. When you have units selected you can no longer see this! A better way might be to have the upward arrow as the promotion available sign, since the majority of players will generally be aware of upgrade potential. Plus, this wouldn't conflict with when units are selected.

I've noticed that too, DrJambo. What about a white star to match the PLE button and Combat I promotion?

The thing I like about a highlight is that for those of us with poor vision, the upgrade arrow and GG star just aren't visible.

ruff_hi said:

is there a 'turn off all silly filters, groupings, etc' button?

Click to expand...

EmperorFool said:

Yes, the first checkbox on the "Unit Icons" tab of the BUG Options screen, but I highly recommend you try out the filters and stacked view modes. </evangelism>

Click to expand...

No - I meant is there a button that undoes all of the filters. Just been playing in an SG and turned on various filters only to loss all of my units - no unit icons at all. I would like a button that I can click to reset to my Ctrl-Alt-O default.

BTW - nice buttons, huge improvement.

umm... EF was talking about having a button for that... he didn't code it in?

Yes, I have a button graphic for the now, but I need to make room. It will reset all filters, and maybe I will make it reset to your default modes as well.

So I coded up my idea of tri-state buttons (click to see healthy, again to see wounded, again to clear filter), and I want to get some feedback. Also, right-clicking the filter goes in the opposite direction.

Please replace CvMainInterface.py with the following file (backup your file first and change this file's extension) and tell me what you think. Only the healthy/wounded filter is changed.

* Note: This isn't a ZIP, it's a PY file.

EmperorFool said:

Yes, I have a button graphic for the now, but I need to make room. It will reset all filters, and maybe I will make it reset to your default modes as well.

So I coded up my idea of tri-state buttons (click to see healthy, again to see wounded, again to clear filter), and I want to get some feedback. Also, right-clicking the filter goes in the opposite direction.

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I fear it is not so intuitive, or at least, IMHO going in that direction we loose some of the increase in immediateness that we have get with your "BUG mode" and hover text. Furthermore, IMO if we want to do this, the hover text should be fixed (in your example is mismatched) and more important we need a different icon for the "all" state (for example, I think that the unselected green cross is non enought to differentiate from the selected green cross).

I have a different suggestion: leave the filter buttons as they are, and create a unique 4-status grouping button. You will free room equivalent to 3 buttons, and you'll avoid the problems which I mentioned above, because doing so you will not add a "status" (so, no more image needed), and furthermore you always are in one and only one of the four status, so IMO it is intuitive to have a unique button cycling through them.

Cammagno said:

we lose some of the increase in immediateness that we have with your "BUG mode".

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That is precisely what I fear. If we go this way, though, the hover text would be rewritten and each group of filters would have its own "off" button. For the health-related ones, that's a gray cross.

Cammagno said:

Create a unique 4-status grouping button.

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That is a possibility, but it suffers the same drawback (lack of immediateness). I only use those four buttons, however, when I'm looking at a city screen with a ton of units. This is why I was thinking of a "city screen view mode" so I wouldn't even need to click the buttons. Alerum says he uses them also when he's got a large stack and cannot click where he wants to move units.

However, given that I suspect people will filter more than change view modes, I think that might be the better solution and provide just enough room for the "clear all filters" button and a new "movement" filter button group.

Now for the four right-most buttons. From people's comments, I think it is unclear that they are mutually exclusive. They aren't entirely related, though. The left two switch how units are grouped in the four view modes. I will combine these into a two-state button.

The right two switch the whole plot list into completely different operational modes, showing all units that can be promoted or upgraded depending on which button you push along with icons showing how they can be promoted or upgraded. Clicking the icons should do that thing, but it didn't work for me. Also, unless I'm mistaken, all the normal filters lose their effect temporarily.

One option is to remove these two modes entirely and turn them into regular filters. They would each be a single button only, as I don't see the point of "show me all units that cannot be promoted". Same for upgrade.

The other option is to at least push the group-mode button (squares, triangle) next to the promo button so it's clear that the three are mutually exclusive.

I looked at it and here is are some comments ...

• why do we have a single row option - that was early civ4 vanilla and they (Feraxis or how every you spell their name) stole the idea from someone here at CFC ... we shouldn't have the option to do something that is horrible
• cycle filters for one filter but not for the others is not consistent
• I see now about 3rd / 4th from right filter options to get my unit icons back ... not clear even with hovers
• did I mention I like the new buttons?
• <whinge>I still cannot get back to vanilla BtS PLE icons </whinge>

... my suggestion

• watch rush hour 4 ... its not that bad
• remove single row icon, keep other three ways of stacking icons
• next icon should be toggle icon (highlight not there / there) that says 'turn filtering off / on
• have a small break and then display all of the filter options ... laid out, not toggle version BUT only show them if the filtering option is ON.
• remember the last filter setup (not between civ4 sessions)

BTW: GG star is now in a horrible place ... will mock up different icon and suggest new spot ... maybe right below dot.

EmperorFool said:

That is precisely what I fear. If we go this way, though, the hover text would be rewritten and each group of filters would have its own "off" button. For the health-related ones, that's a gray cross.

Click to expand...

Ok

EmperorFool said:

That is a possibility, but it suffers the same drawback (lack of immediateness). I only use those four buttons, however, when I'm looking at a city screen with a ton of units. This is why I was thinking of a "city screen view mode" so I wouldn't even need to click the buttons. Alerum says he uses them also when he's got a large stack and cannot click where he wants to move units.

Click to expand...

Yes, but IMHO the immediateness is more than in the other option, and, as you said, the use of those button is much less common.

EmperorFool said:

Now for the four right-most buttons. From people's comments, I think it is unclear that they are mutually exclusive. They aren't entirely related, though. The left two switch how units are grouped in the four view modes. I will combine these into a two-state button.

Click to expand...

Good idea! And maybe move it near the unique 4-views button?

EmperorFool said:

The right two switch the whole plot list into completely different operational modes, showing all units that can be promoted or upgraded depending on which button you push along with icons showing how they can be promoted or upgraded. Clicking the icons should do that thing, but it didn't work for me. Also, unless I'm mistaken, all the normal filters lose their effect temporarily.
One option is to remove these two modes entirely and turn them into regular filters. They would each be a single button only, as I don't see the point of "show me all units that cannot be promoted". Same for upgrade.

Click to expand...

If the promotion or upgrade doesn't work (and it's not possible to make it work) turning them in regolar filters can be ok. If it is possible to make them work, of course they'll be useful.

In my quest to make PLE look good, I'm looking for feedback on this:

or or or vs

I'm aiming to swap out the text for icons in the corner of the unit button. EF made a good point that it might be hard to see so I'm wondering anyone else thinks. Say which you like the most (saying its number, going from left to right).

EDIT: Added version with outline per EF's suggestion.

The fourth image with a full circle that overhangs the unit's icon is much clearer to me. Perhaps add a thin black border to the circle? Not sure if that would help or hurt.

Okay, I've added that to the options in two forms, one with a semi-transparent background, one without.

Personally, I like the fourth version the most. It seems brighter and clearer to me.

the question I have is are we replacing all of the text actions with little icons?

ruff_hi said:

the question I have is are we replacing all of the text actions with little icons?

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The answer I have is "Yes." As long as NikNaks can design icons that are clearly distinct and easily recognizable, I will swap them out for the text tags. If you press, I could make this configurable.

My main reason for this is to avoid having non-translatable text in graphics. Sure, we could make different graphics for the same icon usage, but that take more time and can't be done by the translators themselves, slowing the process.

Besides, the German and Italian text tag icons would need to be 250 pixels wide, only allowing five units on the screen at a time.

EmperorFool said:

The answer I have is "Yes." As long as NikNaks can design icons that are clearly distinct and easily recognizable, I will swap them out for the text tags. If you press, I could make this configurable.

My main reason for this is to avoid having non-translatable text in graphics. Sure, we could make different graphics for the same icon usage, but that take more time and can't be done by the translators themselves, slowing the process.

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I support this idea, the icon are much prettier and furthermore it's a pity to have translated everything, even the more hidden word, and then having not-localized words in full view in the main area.

EmperorFool said:

Besides, the German and Italian text tag icons would need to be 250 pixels wide, only allowing five units on the screen at a time.

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Ah, I'm also for the 4th picture, very good ^_^

Clearly number #4. If only I could play better to match the BUG Mod in it's ever increasing perfection... It's sad to get steamrolled by Boobica of the Celts with a 50 Cavalry stack...