Manufactories? Yay or Nay?

I plant manufactories early game because the hammers add up that way and because wonders are cheaper earlier in the game. In fact I don't even use them to rush wonders until the wonders cost at least 1000 hammers. One exception is if my capital can't build Macchu Picchu or Neuschwanstein but I have a less developed city that can, then I rush it there. My thinking is that a manufactory planted early, at 4 hammers per turn, will add up to 800 hammers in 200 turns. And that's without even factoring in the chemistry bonus and the percentage bonuses from workshop/windmill/factory/power plants. That would easily bring the total over 1000, equal to the cost of the late game wonders. Earlier wonders just aren't worth enough to justify using a GE on them in my opinion.
 
I plant manufactories early game because the hammers add up that way and because wonders are cheaper earlier in the game. In fact I don't even use them to rush wonders until the wonders cost at least 1000 hammers. One exception is if my capital can't build Macchu Picchu or Neuschwanstein but I have a less developed city that can, then I rush it there. My thinking is that a manufactory planted early, at 4 hammers per turn, will add up to 800 hammers in 200 turns. And that's without even factoring in the chemistry bonus and the percentage bonuses from workshop/windmill/factory/power plants. That would easily bring the total over 1000, equal to the cost of the late game wonders. Earlier wonders just aren't worth enough to justify using a GE on them in my opinion.
Problem is, while you can indeed plant a GE for 4 production on either grassland (2f/4p) or a hill (6p) you could at the same time put a mine on a hill and work that for 3p. So basically what you get from the manufactory is 2f/1p or 3p depending on where you plant it - or basically the equivalent of a free citizen, given that you could work 2 hills for the same 6p that you get from one hill with a manufactory. Is a free citizen good? Sure it is. Is it as good as a free wonder? I'd say no!
 
There are ancient wonders that are very good, but many are also simply "just ok" or even "meh". The AI usually pumps out the ancient wonders and also usually very close to each other for some reason. I have since my Venice campaign (where I did made a manufanctory) actually re-valued this. Sure can I get one of the yummy wonders, then I go for it, but I will think twice before I use a GE on one of the "just ok" or a "meh" wonders.

And also, it of course depends on the map. My Venice map was flat grassland so there I needed to have at least some production somewhere. In my Incan campaign, uh nooooo.
 
There are ancient wonders that are very good, but many are also simply "just ok" or even "meh". The AI usually pumps out the ancient wonders and also usually very close to each other for some reason. I have since my Venice campaign (where I did made a manufanctory) actually re-valued this. Sure can I get one of the yummy wonders, then I go for it, but I will think twice before I use a GE on one of the "just ok" or a "meh" wonders.

And also, it of course depends on the map. My Venice map was flat grassland so there I needed to have at least some production somewhere. In my Incan campaign, uh nooooo.

True but many of these early wonders give a free engineer point which means that by the renaissance era you can for instance use the free engineer to rush Leaning Tower or Sistine Chapel.
So it can be a case of build a wonder get one free.
I find if I play Diety and ignore all the early engineering point wonders it does bite later as hard-building Leaning Tower or Sistine Chapel is so risky.
 
Below immortal I almost always use them for manufactories in my capital. I used to have capitals with 10+ academies and 5+ manufactories. Sometimes I planted them on luxury as I had no more space for them. I did it for the wonders (national and global). With all the possible mutiplyers my capital was a powerhouse that contributed most of my science and nearly all of my culture and tourism in the endgame. ..
 
If I quick build with GE's, I pretty much only use them for World Wonders. I'll use them for manufactures if I get a GE, and I'm not really anywhere close to having the tech for an unmade WW. An exception might be if its towards the end of the game, and the future hammers from a manufacturer wouldn't exceed the quick build hammers.
 
Usually will always save for a wonder, but my current game I tried moving up to Immortal, and was just barely behind enough in tech that I couldn't build any wonders. So in that case, I ended up planting a couple, and it is a nice boost. Thankfully i wasn't too far behind, so I did manage to use a couple for wonders, but it's not as terrible a choice as you think. But otherwise, if you can use them for wonders, do it.
 
Usually will always save for a wonder, but my current game I tried moving up to Immortal, and was just barely behind enough in tech that I couldn't build any wonders. So in that case, I ended up planting a couple, and it is a nice boost. Thankfully i wasn't too far behind, so I did manage to use a couple for wonders, but it's not as terrible a choice as you think. But otherwise, if you can use them for wonders, do it.

if you cant rush wonders, its better to not allow engineers to born as they spoil great scientist progress.
 
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