Got a taste of misery

So Just left a game where I was playing england on a standard continent map, at empereor level. And I got to say, I got my ass kicked because of the WC for the first time.

Since the beging I was planing for a conquest victory. Got a huge luck at my start. At the first move of my warrior I found El Dorado and bought a setler as soon as I could. After setting up my citys I went for Great Lighthouse, Colossus and Hanging Gardens in this order.

On my continent I had Egypt right next to me, Venice little up, Siam after Venice and finally greece. After getting 3 sword man, 2 archers and 2 catapults I took thebes quitly easy eliminating Egipt. I had friendship with venice so I decided to buy open borders and proceed to attack Siam(which I think was my mistake on the game), After destroying Siam and having a good lead on tech I proceeded to attack greece. After gathering all my forces on their borders things began to get ugly. Polynesia who was at the other continent declared war on me with greece and Venice. I managed to hold polinesia's reinforcemets with 2 ships of the line and got greece elimated. At the same time, Venice captured Thebes. On next turn the votes on the congress just sealed my destiny. Embargo city states and ban Wine. As you guys can imagine all city states were in control of Venice so even if I ended the war I could not trade with then, so happines and gold just went to the floor. I proceeded to take one of the city states that Venice had as Puppet, just to discover that I cant liberate it. At this point of the game I jsut game up. With so little gold and rebels spawing as crazy near my capital where I could not defend properly beucase my troops where way far fight Venice I was just doomed.

My culture tree at the end was full Tradition and full Honor. I guess if I had attacked as soon as finished ramnses I could have won this game. They would have only one city state as puppet, I would not lost thebes, and I could clear my continent way faster without city states attacking me. Still I think I did pretty good holding my ground against so many AIs, but...well more than 3 hour on the trash can

Another thing, I'm definitly bad at playing on sea maps, which I was better using ships.

I like this story!! You over extended yourself, you got cocky and you paid dearly for it. I see this a lot more in BNW.

Great story. In G&K you would have kept rolling up your continent and then sniped the remaining capitals, and won easily. Sounds like one of the designers' goals for BNW (allowing use of the WC to rein in a runaway) has been achieved.

Skull_ said:

Still I think I did pretty good holding my ground against so many AIs, but...well more than 3 hour on the trash can

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Only if you think learning is a waste of time!

It's not a waste, you know what I mean. I was hoping to win that game. Next time I'll storm anyone in my way, no matter if it's an ally or not, since they will hate me anyway.

Skull_ said:

It's not a waste, you know what I mean. I was hoping to win that game. Next time I'll storm anyone in my way, no matter if it's an ally or not, since they will hate me anyway.

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Not exactly a lesson to take from this game

I would say next time I will buddy up to a harmless neighbor and get him on my side so I always have a trading partner. Then will make sure I control WC (very very useful for Dom VCs) and pass proposals that will get everyones approval. And I will make sure I can win multi front wars before I get into them, especially having a navy to defend against seaborne invasions. Btw AI is awful at those and will keep sailing invasion fleet to it's destination, including escorts, allowing you to pick them all off en route. Just have good scouting at sea.

You don't even need to control WC, just give it to your buddy. I just got the dark horse achievement on deity, and getting WC away from Alex who was my fake BFF and next door neighbor and giving it to Egypt who were then eternally grateful and prevented any of the really evil proposals aimed at me from passing, was key. It's not that hard as early on everyone has few votes and your two can swing the tide.

The AI will love you and love you for voting them for WC leader!! I also do what Max suggest, always have my bff near my border. Unless of course that is Alex, I hate to say it, but I hate Alex. If he is anywhere close to me, we will have a somewhat early war to remove him.

I'm not big a fan of gargatuan size troops attack all sides. And I think that for someone who wants to get a dom victory start the first war after the congress is silly.

I don't know, I'm used to early wars but I guess I'll have to adapt and plan a new strategy.

You don have to wait till WC for war, it's fine to start early, as early as CB in fact. But not if you only have one AI next to you. It's better to get trade with them. If you have 2-3 as in a standard continents, pick a trustworthy and weak be to be your BFF. Give him lux, get someone else to attack him, or attack someone with him. Here is your early war without diplo penalty. Do same to another AI, maybe even get someone wiped out so you can liberate them

Then once you have your continent subdued, and it doesn't mean wiped out, unless you have not met anyone else yet but will soon, and can live without ITRs for a while, set out for new lands and pick a weakest victim, prefferably one at war with other AIs to get a foothold. Then get the leader taken down asap.

great story, and a good example of WCs importance

WC is key. There's no deny on this. War became very hard to sustain, and since you cant liberate venice city states, the need to be the first get kicked.

Skull_ said:

And I think that for someone who wants to get a dom victory start the first war after the congress is silly.

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Oh, you CAN definitely go for war, first thing. Just make sure to stop after killing off one or two civs, and focus on caching up a bit, making friends, getting ready for next big push, etc.

At least in my experience it's too hard to keep an early attack going for long enough. Unless it's a very small map, like a pangaea with 4 or less AIs. Then yeah, I'd aim to kill a couple off early, then conquering the rest with some sweet ideology happiness.

Don't underestimate Venice. He is backstabbing freak! Eliminate him ASAP because Venice gets a lot of trade routes & if he survives till industrial then he'll start buying every single CS & Freedom and WC will make it even more worse.

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I learned this leason on the hard way. I though that we could remain friends. At least until I eliminate everyone on the continent, so I could just wipe him of the map and get all those wonders in his capital. Now I don't think I should spare anyone, unless someone very week and poor near me.

Skull_ said:

I learned this leason on the hard way. I though that we could remain friends. At least until I eliminate everyone on the continent, so I could just wipe him of the map and get all those wonders in his capital. Now I don't think I should spare anyone, unless someone very week and poor near me.

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Understanding the AI personality is very important. For example leaving Gandhi in a corner is not a problem in most cases but giving Venice some time to survive can prove to be a huge annoyance late game. Similarly keep a check on AIs armies & size of empire. If one goes too strong you should attack it. Just wait for your DoF to expire and denounce them. Then after a few turns when you are completely ready, declare war!