Oxford radio or plastics?

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tschukki

Chieftain
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Jun 30, 2013
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When and how to enter an ideology, the question will pop up sooner or later, and most times I am unsure about the best path to take. (I am talking multiplayer btw; in SP i assume its easier since you will usually be ahead at this time anyways.)

In 90% of my games either of the two is the oxford tech, but I find myself going back and forth about this, especially in games where i am pretty sure i wont get 1st and likely not even 2nd ideology. An early ideology is still valuable, but how much? Should I still go straight to radio, or maybe even start at industrialization before public school tech? And what about bulbing into radio instead of oxfording it?

In some scenarios I struggle less: When i am ahead and more or less sure i will get first ideology i usually oxford radio. Also when hydro plants will be huge for the empire ill go straight to radio since ill be up there in the tech tree anyways. And should there be a neighbor threatening with war and teching at the bottom of the tree ill usually go for industrialization first and take it from there.

Unfortunately things are rarely this clear, so id be thankful for some input.
 
Radio is often better because hard teching radio can take 10+ turns while teching plastics when you reach it is often around 8. Also if it allows you to be first on ideology then it's definitely worth it. Then if you need a ideology right away it helps. I would always preffer to Oxford Radio, the only way I seen me using Oxford for a later tech is if I'm totally unprepared to build Oxford or if I plan to get Ideology with 3 factories.
 
%99 of the time it will be Radio. In saying that in a recent Immortal game where my friends and I were rich, and I had already unlocked Mercantilism I bulled Industrialization. The gamble paid off as I has 3 coal which lead to a t162 Ideology and a t182 Plastics(Oxford bulb). Big Ben was faith bought GE rushed allowing me to buy 5 schools and 3 factories on the same turn, after a an extensive loan from my friends.
 
I'd say Radio - it's usually more turns, you usually have more other techs to be researching at the time, and it results in more great benefits - a ideology if you don't have the factories up, and the Eiffel Tower is a great wonder, especially for combating ideological pressure.

Having said that, I actually use it for Acoustics some of the time (especially if I'm going for a cultural victory) - after education, I'll beeline Printing Press (for the Leaning Tower, and possibly founding the world congress), and use Oxford University to snag acoustics (for the Sistine Chapel, and to start on Opera houses).
 
Usually Radio for the reasons already mentioned.

sometimes, I like to use Oxford to get Dynamite.
But thats not one of the choices listed, so probably radio unless I know I am gunning for a science win.
 
yeah, radio is common for oxford, but bulbing a scientist for faster Plastics is also useful if you can rush buy the Labs. ive always regretted using oxford earlier, like for Sci Theory. it always feels like i should have saved it for deeper techs. in the babylon OCC DCL you can have it SUPER early (any OCC in general). just dont fall to temptation, haha.

(all of this is assuming diplo/sci vic strategy.)
 
Oxford > Public School
Oxford > Cannon
Oxford > Artillery
Oxford > Frigate

But seriously, Oxford does have 2 writer slots. Perhaps earlier can be better.
 
diplo/domi/culture can also have a use for oxford for grabbing their last techs while skipping labs (or school for domi).

Examples:
Want to reach Dynamite asap while skipping schools: Oxford is very good there.
Want to reach info/atomic era to precipitate WLeader vote while skipping labs
Want to reach internet while skipping labs

Oxford can basically give you a 12+ turns tech in these situations while getting radio after schools isn't as long (or as useful).
Lately I have been enjoying my CVs a lot getting ideology with 3 factories and getting Radio later. Then keep Oxford + Rat finish for 2 costly atomic/information techs.

Basically it's a choice between fast ideology (radio) or costly tech. Note that in a science victory late game techs usually take the same time than radio does so I'd advised to use Oxford always for Radio for a SV.
 
Acken said:
Examples:
Want to reach Dynamite asap while skipping schools: Oxford is very good there.
Want to reach info/atomic era to precipitate WLeader vote while skipping labs
Want to reach internet while skipping labs

Oxford can basically give you a 12+ turns tech in these situations while getting radio after schools isn't as long (or as useful).
Click to expand...

Bulbing a GS can give about 8 turns if you are making a mad rush for something and are thinking about using Oxford.

You also have an early round of RAs , a Liberty finisher, etc to give a boost. The list goes on. All good if you are thinking about war.
 
oxford gives a flat free tech, regardless of cost. bulbing GS is varying based on bpt, and the cost of the techs arent static as city count alters those costs too. the only real argument to have on oxford is situational timing being more valuable than raw beakers/turns saved (or viewing its value beyond the free tech, like slots or natl wonder bonuses from other things). i think the answer really does hinge mostly on the strategy. as a standard rule of thumb oxfording radio/plastics isnt a mistake per se, but it is difficult to know if it was truly optimum or not for that particular game.
 
I wasn't trying to say one was better than the other, I was pointing out ways to combine the effects for a bigger jump.
 
In a game where nobody has Coal when you have the prereq to Radio, it's a no brainer to build Oxford for Radio just for the ideology.

Now if discovery of Industrialization shows one of your mines was on Coal and you quickly got 3 factories up already (production and/or cash), it might be better to wait for Plastics.

Given that Plastics allows the last science boosting building in the game, it's difficult to see how waiting even longer than Plastics for Oxford would ever be better.
 
That approach does require that you go one tech out of your way (Industrialization) on the way to Electricity (and then Oxford Radio). However, it does have the advantage of potentially delaying your entry into the Modern Era, when RA costs, the faith cost of religious buildings, etc., rise again.
 
i think i had a harder time deciding when to finish Rationalism in that OCC Babylon game. hold it off for a better tech or get it because of the RA bonus? i never signed many RAs in GnK, too buggy for a long time. but OCC gave me reasons to sign a lot of them. they arent spectacular and 2 (of the 10 or so) were complete fizzles but the other 8 were helpful and worth the money.

i used oxford on Plastics that game to rush buy Labs, i think. wasnt as good of a decision with only 1 city but it worked out.
 
This is most likely not the optimal way to do this but sometimes I finish Rationalism for Radio and Oxford Satellites. However, most of my games I am either using Oxford for Radio or Dynamite. I have used it for many techs though. Sometimes I use it to get to Printing Press faster if I have a chance at Pisa or I want to found the WC. I have used it for Navigation to get Frigates up faster and Astronomy to get the Observatory up quicker as well.
 
Hammer Rabbi said:
yeah, radio is common for oxford, but bulbing a scientist for faster Plastics is also useful if you can rush buy the Labs. ive always regretted using oxford earlier, like for Sci Theory. it always feels like i should have saved it for deeper techs. in the babylon OCC DCL you can have it SUPER early (any OCC in general). just dont fall to temptation, haha.

(all of this is assuming diplo/sci vic strategy.)
Click to expand...

I'd say the only reason to use Oxford for radio is to get an early Ideology, but in the Babylon DCL OCC you will be in the lead (at least I somehow was) before the Industrial era even rolled in, it was crazy, so it seemed a better idea to save it up for later
 
I have to shamefully admit that in some CV games, like OCC Babylon, I use Oxford to tech Printing Press. Got me there first, and first crack at Pisa.
 
I play mp too and if i dont go for artillery right away i will use Oxford for Radio 95% of time. There is some situations where i will keep Oxford for later like when beelining Industrialization. In this case i probably want to upgrade Machinery UUs(playing England or China) or simply because i have 3 big cities that can chunk 3 factories in no time(can suck if no coal though).

Getting first to ideology is nice because you have all choices for you with possibility to start with 2 tenets. It's also useful if you wanna time your next policy and use it for your next ideology(to bring Foreign Legions faster, for example).

You can keep Oxford if you are in a game where your gpt is awesome. Just buy 2 or 3 public schools right away and count 6 turns before burning 1,2 or maybe 3 gs so you can pop up Radio in a short time, keeping Oxford for Plastics instead.
 
Fluphen Azine said:
This is most likely not the optimal way to do this but sometimes I finish Rationalism for Radio and Oxford Satellites
Click to expand...

No it's actually a fine idea especially if you do RAs. The Rati finisher and Oxford are almost equivalent (Oxford has theming and +2 science). It's even easier to time Oxford for a late game tech than it is with the Rati finisher.

But I usually cannot go that far into Rationalism before radio.
 
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