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Excellent point. Loner starts do happen and they will suck if you are dependent on having trade partners in order to fund buildings and units.
Complete New Game - Opinion thread
- Thread starter DevilHell
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Excellent point. Loner starts do happen and they will suck if you are dependent on having trade partners in order to fund buildings and units.
To be honest I don't read too much into it either way. The gold will be made one way or another, it is just going to be interesting to see just how far these trade routes are implemented and in what ways we acquire said gold.
And for the same reason why the potential of removal of gold from coasts could be bad, it could also swing the other way. Perhaps there are additional perks for trade routes you can only get from a coastal city.
I dunno. All we can do is wildly speculate, but it seems trade routes are one of the things getting discussed most since the announcement (well, other than the typical civ speculation threads that take have taken place since vanilla release).
And for the same reason why the potential of removal of gold from coasts could be bad, it could also swing the other way. Perhaps there are additional perks for trade routes you can only get from a coastal city.
I dunno. All we can do is wildly speculate, but it seems trade routes are one of the things getting discussed most since the announcement (well, other than the typical civ speculation threads that take have taken place since vanilla release).
I think policies are going to be a bit cheaper, considering that there will be 9 policy trees plus 3 ideologies, and that the Polish UA seems a bit overpowered if the costs stay as they are. Whether they will be cheaper from the start, or only later, is of course a different question.
So you need trading partners for getting rich? Well that's how it should be!
You can do like China and Japan in 16th-19th centuries and turtle up and use only internal trade routes and protect your culture from foreign devils, or you can go like, say Dutch and British and stretch your imperial tentacles to ports all over the world.
Ed Beach said, don't know in which interview, that trading even farther away is more lucrative, so of course risks get higher when you extend the routes, but rewards get stronger too.
What it sounds like, I love it!
You can do like China and Japan in 16th-19th centuries and turtle up and use only internal trade routes and protect your culture from foreign devils, or you can go like, say Dutch and British and stretch your imperial tentacles to ports all over the world.
Ed Beach said, don't know in which interview, that trading even farther away is more lucrative, so of course risks get higher when you extend the routes, but rewards get stronger too.
What it sounds like, I love it!
kaspergm
Deity
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Hardly. 1 gold per turn, even over the course of the entire game, does not make any significant difference. This would be the gold on all tiles adjacant to rivers, and possibly (and this is what I'm sceptic about) the gold on all ocean tiles.
I personally don't think that this is a bad change at all. Like someone said, you will be making the money anyway with trade routes and all. The only thing that it changes is that now everyone will get a more even start. Instead of someone getting a ton of money from a river in the beginning, everyone will have this chance now with trade routes. Also, those on the coast will get an extra bonus with 1 land route and 1 sea route so it isn't as bad as it sounds IMO.
Greizer85
Emperor
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If ocean gold is removed though, you'd only ever want to found as many coastal cities as you can have oceanic trade routes. Those cities would be horrendous without an extra trade route... Water cities are already not worth it unless there are at least two sea resources, at least one of them a luxury (imo). Even then I'd rather capture and puppet such a city than found it myself.
About this gold problematic, my opinion is as follows:
As soon as we found a city, there is only the 3 gold the palace gives us.
We have no trade routes whatsoever.
We have to discover a technology to unlock caravans AND found a new city to increase our GPT.
This means, we cannot have more than 3 units AND buildings at once, which is kind of impossible, this is gonna cripple our start HEAVILY.
Caravans are units, so we have to invest production in them. Now, what would be the top of it, is that they costed mantainance, so I guess they don't.
The worst about this is that in high levels, the AI will recieve this stupid big fat bonuses, so they won't get crippled and Deity and Immortal may really get impossible.
EDIT: This provokes a production-gold unbalance.
You'll still have gold from tiles with luxuries, even if you haven't improved them yet.
Uhh... you guys do realize this is something the devs are obviously aware about, right? Like I said above, you are going to get the gold one way or another. They aren't going to simply remove gold and call it a day. It will be counter-balanced in one form or another. Believe it or not they do actually play the game after coding it to see if it actually works...
dagriggstar
King
My thinking is that
a) Trade units will be upkeep free, much like economic buildings such as the market are currently
b) They will be available from at or near the start of the game (before religion kicks in, which was mentioned in an article anyway)
c) I think it is quite likely that cargo ships (sea trade units) will move faster than caravans (land trade units). So potentially, more trips between cities and therefore a bigger gold bonus, which helps offset the "badness" of a coastal start
d) Gold, as a tile yield, will almost be completely removed from the game. That tended to be what the gold yields represented anyway - increased trade on those tiles
a) Trade units will be upkeep free, much like economic buildings such as the market are currently
b) They will be available from at or near the start of the game (before religion kicks in, which was mentioned in an article anyway)
c) I think it is quite likely that cargo ships (sea trade units) will move faster than caravans (land trade units). So potentially, more trips between cities and therefore a bigger gold bonus, which helps offset the "badness" of a coastal start
d) Gold, as a tile yield, will almost be completely removed from the game. That tended to be what the gold yields represented anyway - increased trade on those tiles
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