The City States of Greece

You can RP whatever you want as long as it fits into the setting and time period.

Sounds good. Thanks!

ooc: For those not in the loop, I would just like to apologise for the delays in the turn ticking over, the Areopagus is having an animated discussion on such issues as Japan and who gets the settler. A large part of this game for anyone going into a leadership position is balancing the wishes of the commons, the AI nobility and of course other players, and this is why the turn is taking its sweet time in concluding.

Once its done I will post the actions resulting from it, along with maybe a nice speech. In the meantime I would urge people like Aaronius to perhaps post continuations of their stories, they are really interesting to read (I especially like aforementioned Aaronius' one) and would serve to make the thread look a bit less sparse in that time-frame where there are only a few people actually in the game to spice things up.

Oh and for the record I will be raising Magnive to the nobility in this turn now that he has concluded a very successful diplomatic mission (which incidentally makes the nobility less inclined to chafe against his ascension, like they have done to Filli Noctus whom they thoroughly dislike).

Thank you, oh great and wise Archon

That last comment killed me lol. "Who they thoroughly dislike"

IDK why, it was just funny to me :/

maybe because you have a not-so-secret desire to topple the ascendant Lords off their lofty pedestals, and thus a reference to his "AI noble problem" amuses you in a sad, ironic way since you know it is merely transitory bump in the road and that as a matter of inevitability he will once again claim a form of lordship while you continue to endure as a peasant into the forseeable future, knowing all the while that even should you become a noble you will never, EVER achieve meaningful dominion over Hellas....

is this correct j/k

The great Archon is amused by the tales around the campfire. It just goes to show the sun baked plebs that despite the height of his lofty position, the Archon has one ear to the ground. Perhaps a new chapter will be forthcoming...

public speech

In light of his excellent service to the archonate, and in particular acknowledgement of the great success of his diplomatic mission to Korea, which has resulted in the beginnings of a long and fruitful friendship between Athens and the Empire of Korea. I, Archon Pericles Megakyrios announce, promulgate and proclaim that the diplomat Gennadios Plousios has been raised to the nobility.

Furthermore in light of his meritorious service to the state, I appoint him to serve as my chief diplomat, to advise me on foreign matters and to serve as my herald to all nations with which Athens wishes to come to terms with. In reference to the success of his mission I would like to announce that my son Solon is engaged to the daughter of the honourable Emperor Sejong, and that my daughter Athena is engaged to the crown prince of Korea, further deepening ties between our two nations and between the Houses Megakyrios and Joseon. It is a testament to the skill of Lord Plousios that such a firm friendship has been established in such a short period of time.

In other matters I would like to advise my people that the Lords Kosta, Glaros and Economou have been appointed to serve as Domestic Minister, Military Attache and Treasurer respectively. To ensure the greater efficiency of state functions and to ensure Athens is strong and able to meet any challenge should necessity require it.

Finally I would like to announce that the Lord Demandros, in light of his generous proposal to establish a founding treaty between a new city and Athens, has been granted authority over the settler group. He shall have control of the settler group and have the freedom to settle where he wills, being no longer under the direct sovereign authority of Athens once he leaves our borders. The treaty we have agreed too and which binds athens and its future daughter for all eternity is as follows.

ESTABLISHMENT TREATY OF THE POLIS OF DELPHI

The polis of Delphi recognises Athens as mother of cities and first among the Hellenic states. As such Delphi agrees to:

1. Acknowledge the Megakyrioi Archon of Athens as Hegemon
2. Consult with Athens before implementing foreign policy directives
3. Grant rights to a tile (worth at least 8d) to the Megakyrioi Archon of Athens as a perpetual tribute to its hegemon
4. Guarantee that when requested military support will be provided to Athens
5. Provide access to any strategic resource discovered in its bounds to Athens
6. Provide the citizens of Athens with the rights of honourary citizens of Delphi
7: Refrain from interference in the internal affairs of Athens

Pursuant to the above conditions the polis of Athens agrees to:
1. Support the right of the Demandroi to rule Delphi as they see fit
2. Refrain from interference in internal Delphic affairs
3. Guarantee military support to Delphi against any agressors
4. Not request military support for action against a declared ally of Delphi or if providing such support will have a deleterious effect on the ability of Delphi to defend itself
5. Provide access to Delphi of any strategic resources discovered in its' territory
6. Provide equivalent rights to citizens of Delphi as Delphi provides to citizens of Athens

Each party is obligated to uphold their agreement as long as the other party does not willfully fail to uphold all aspects of their own agreement. This shall not be prejudiced if due to changing circumstances any stipulation becomes impossible to fulfill. In this event the stipulation remains in force and should circumstances again alter so that the stipulation may be fulfilled it is required that it be fulfilled.

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We find it most expedient that these terms are fulfilled, in order to preserve what ancient custom demands and ensure the new cities sovereignty, while at the same time ensuring the proper respect for our hegemony over all the hellenes is also retained.

On a final note, I wish to warn my people that the time may come when what was once freely given through the benevolence of the Megakyrioi must be taken back through the demands of necessity. Athens no longer is a world unto itself, and the time will soon come where we must all do our part for the greater good of the whole lest our enemies grow strong as we idle in weakness and seek our overthrow and ruin. As such I ask you all to endure any trials that may come in the years ahead, for the clouds of conflict brew over the horizon and not even Athens, the mother and father of civilisation may be spared the tempest ahead.

I will try to write more Ekvallei...

Edit: There goes decentralization.

ooc: You have plenty of time

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not really in regards to decentralisation. He still has an independent foreign policy (he merely is obliged to consult with athens this being for the purpose mainly of greater threats like say Japan). Not to mention he is completely, totally and absolutely in control of his own internal affairs and as per the treaty I can't interfere in his, and neither can he in mine.

What he is doing is signing a mutual defence treaty, a mutual strategic resource sharing treaty and acknowledging my hegemony (and greatly superior army) and as such is giving me tribute in the form of a perpetual land holding. The whole citizens thing is basically dealing with something FN wants to implement in his city regarding "classes" of people and isn't really relevant to decentralisation or not.

Public Announcement:

I have grown increasingly concerned at the fact that the children of nobles, even of the megakyrioi, are passing into the common estate simply through being two generations separated from a Lord. My brother Athanatos' lineage, despite being descended also from the great Agamemnon would under the old system pass into the commons, with the great Agamemnons grandchildren being denied their birthright. Indeed under this system the son of a second son of a Lord is consigned to obscurity, irrespective of his lineage.

As such I have seen fit to officially clarify the situation for the benefit of all noble houses and for the benefit of all athenians, and organise the structure of the nobility, to ensure clarity on this matter and to ensure that an equitable arrangement is made for the younger sons of Lords and Archons. By them of course I mean those that at this day retain the position of lesser nobles, but who's heirs would otherwise enter the commons, making a mockery of the dignity bestowed on their ancestors by the Archon.

As such I implement this following alteration to the rules of nobility

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THE NOBILITY

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The Archon: The font of honour and source of all nobility and can raise and depose a house or individual from nobility at will. He is Autokrator and Lord of Athens and stands higher than all others in dignity and honour, and posesses the majesty of the state itself. All sovereignty comes from Him, and he posesses all government power save that which he delegates to others in a vicarious capacity.

The Aristocrats: The Highest degree of nobility, members of the House Megakyrios of two generations descent from an archon (children and grandchildren) and the Patriarchs of the great houses consist of this class. The patriarchs and the archons heir amongst those in this class are entitled to sit on the Areopagus alongside the Archon as a separate right from other members of the aristocracy due to their positions of primacy above other aristocrats. All Aristocrats are entitled to the title "Lord" or too spouses "Lady". All aristocrats have the privelege to hold fiefs distinct from freehold land at the will of the Archon who dispenses such fiefs, with the duty to ensure order and protection to their tenants and to look after their well-being should they be graced to recieve fiefs.

High Nobility: Descendants of an aristocrat to the second generation, or specific individuals otherwise exalted to this level consist of this class. They have the right to observe the proceedings of the Areopagus if they so wish. Ha

Low Nobility: descendants of third generation descent from an aristocrat, alongside others raised by the archon to the low nobility on merit, or by virtue of local leadership consist of this class. This state is passed in perpetuity to the lawful heir of a lesser noble and from him to his son and so on. These individuals have no special rights over citizens and it is primarily a position of superior honour granted to those in positions of localised authority, or who posess noble descent. They do have the right to bear arms in public even if not members of the military or the police however.

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~unmarried noble women are of the class below that of their father, married women of any class are of the same class as their husbands save the Queen of Athens who is considered the rank of an Aristocrat due to the singular nature of the level of Archon.

~All nobles are expected to display loyalty to the Archon, and to faithfully fulfil the duties of any offices the hold, whether as magistrates in a court, or as ministers vicariously administering the archons authority in whatever area.

~A higher class of nobility posesses all the rights of lower classes of nobility in addition to the additional rights given to that level of noble

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To the commons, I wish to ensure you that the ability for commoners to rise to the nobility via merit seen by the archon remains unchanged as is your current state of priveleges. This edict applies only to the nobility. I also note also that this measure also will in time once a thorough evaluation is made, extend honour to those who would otherwise be undignified in their service by raising them to the lower nobility. For it is my hope that I, or my successor, will once an evaluation is made extend the lower nobility to those who serve in positions as local leaders, as magistrates and other emminent personages of lesser distinction and authority, and also to leaders in the military. All this I hope will occur as time passes while the Megakyrioi ensure that the dignity of those who are currently lords is in no way diminished or lessened. Indeed it is in fact exalted through this measure through the increase of lower classes of nobility supporting their descendants who would otherwise be lost to the ranks of nobles. It also ensures the uniqueness and exclusivity of the aristocracy, which consists of that group that was already entitled to lordship, is in no way diluted and remains entirely undiminished and unnaffected in their estate by these clarifications.

I thank the Archon for his wisdom and beneficence in agreeing to my proposal. I shall lead the settlers to the source of the sacred Eurotas where we shall lay the foundations of the city of Delphi.


I ask the Archon if he would see fit to permit the archer regiment to escort our party to the site of Delphi if he does intend for the archers to support our warriors against the incursion of the Japanese barbarians.

I would ask you to consider settling one NE of your current allocated location, for the location my father prophesised held a hidden gift, from your current location, would be beyond your reach. However ultimately the place to settle is up to you. As to the archers, I have already pre-emptively ordered them to escort the settler group north as they are heading to that region anyway to support our warrior group up there, should the japanese act as aggressors and attack us.

On a related matter, I would like to make it known that should anyone have... "disagreements", with the government of Athens, they are perfectly entitled to join the settler group.

I had considered the location you speak of but to settle there would make it difficult to rapidly make a strong claim on the Fountain of the Gods. Perhaps the Archon would be willing to make a loan to Delphi to allow us to set up a community around the fountain as quickly as possible if we settle the NW of the Grove of Dionysus as he suggests.

I will consider it should Delphi settle at the location suggested.

(the site I suggest encompasses the least amount of desert tiles, and will bring in horses in time AND still nets you a giant steaming pothole of upwelling water though. Ergo its a long term proposition)

ooc: That's Old Faithful
Have we opened the liberty tree (suddenly put in mind of GTA III) or just tradition. One thing I've found with all these games is it's so difficult to keep track of SPs. Having access to the wheat will make early growth much easier and having some level of culture from liberty would make me more sympathetic to the northern tile.

ooc: your in luck, we have liberty and the extra culture for inferior non-athenian cities. However I would like to note that I do like your site, indeed the wheat + closer steaming pothole is a plus, and your on a hill at that site and closer to Athens, which in a settler race where Japan is likely to attack you if you manage to get there is a plus. Now to be fair, your site is inferior in the far long term to my site. But thats a minor detail since the game due to the time it would take is likely to be done and dusted before then. The only other minus actually is that it may, MAY, require us to get into a war to the death with Japan if we want horses. No biggy there

Incidentally your mention of liberty reminds reminds me, I am requesting that when we come to collective rule that we stop and make the decision directly, it would be most unfortunate to have a free city fall in the hands of greek ultra-nationalists for example just because we slotted it in a list and let it fall to whomever it may. Not to mention I would rather not delve too far into liberty without the moderating tendencies of tradition.

ooc: Fortunately strategic resources don't require being within workable radius. If I get a temple and garden up ASAP I can push for a GA and culture bomb the tile in question.
I thought we were all Greek ultra-nationalists in this game

IC: I have considered the advice of the Archon and made sacrifices to receive the wisdom of Apollo. The omens sent indicate that my original decision was correct and Delphi shall be sited as previously indicated.

filli_noctus said:

ooc: That's Old Faithful
Have we opened the liberty tree (suddenly put in mind of GTA III) or just tradition. One thing I've found with all these games is it's so difficult to keep track of SPs. Having access to the wheat will make early growth much easier and having some level of culture from liberty would make me more sympathetic to the northern tile.

Click to expand...

I'll try to remember to add that to Updates from now on. Update probably wont be till the end of the week. Sorry guys.

Phillipos used his hand to shield his eyes as he surveyed the plain upon which the settlers were gathered. Many families had joined the party, although the space they occupied was somewhat less than Phillipos had imagined.
Xanthippus created a path through the throng towards a rocky outcrop near the centre of the settlers before helping his master climb it.
From a more elevated vantage point Phillipos could see the true extent of the settling party, it was more than sufficient to create a great city.
As the settlers noticed his ascent a wave of quiet rippled outward from the rock. Once the only noise was the wind and the distant sussuration of the Athenian bustle Phillipos began to speak.
"My friends," he began, "we stand at the beginning of the greatest journey made by the Hellenes. Once we leave this plain we will not be heading to the bank of the Eurotas, not even to the Sacred Valley. No, when we leave this plain we will walk with Athens behind us, the gods by our side and the future before us! Though the path may prove treacherous and in the face of barbarian hostility we go where Fate has demanded of us. We shall build a city that one day may rival even the majesty of Athens herself. We shall reside overlooking the sacred Eurotas promised to us by the gods and we shall prosper within sight of the magnificent fountain they have created.
We must not forget where we came from but neither must we forget why we go. So now let us begin our long march. For Athens! For Greece! For the gods! And for Delphi!"
As the settlers cheered and Phillipos jumped down from the rock, Xanthippus appeared from the crowds with a group of men. They were all well respected individuals and well known in their communities.
"Gentlemen," said Phillipos, taking the walking staff proffered by Xanthippus, "during this trek I shall be composing the Delphic Syntagma."
All around them people were loading possessions onto horses, oxen, slaves or their own backs. The group made its' way through the crowd, gathering a tail of those who were already prepared to leave.
"I want you to spread word throughout the party that any man who wishes to contribute to the Syntagma is welcome to submit his proposals for my consideration." The men nodded their understanding and peeled off back to their own groups.
When he and Xanthippus reached the edge of the crowd they emerged beside Phillipos' family. Madea smiled at her husband.
Phillipos paused briefly, gazing back at Athens. Then he raised his staff and led the settlers north, to Delphi.