Civ4: Col - Age of Discovery II Mod

Well, Col2 is announced and all the little plebs are happy. hehehe.

So, I can see them being fairly faithful to the original, which means certain very influenctial areas of this era will be totally skipped or summarised horrendously.

We also know that Col2 is going to be on the Civ4 engine so one can assume a certain level of Modding is possible (at least to the level of BtS, hopefully higher).

Thus I am proposing the beginnings of my Age of Discovery II Mod for C4C (Civ4: Col):

1. Add in Portugal, Denmark, Russia and China. We will assume for the minute that the original nations are in: Spain, England, France and Holland.

2. Allow a native victory: such as "Declare Federation (at which point all natives DoW) and capture and hold for 10 turns 50% of all native villages". This is similar to the game Conquest of the New World (awesome game!). This is assuming there is not already a native victory and that only Revolution is available to the Euros.

3. If not already in allowing the discovering and naming of terrain features, such as mountains, ranges, plains, rivers, etc.

4. Extend the map to Western Africa. This region played a large part in the colonisation of the Americas.

5. A Pirate nation to add a real spin to the game.

This is just a beginning list, and as more information comes to hand and the game's release, this will get extended.

Comments? Suggestions?

Didn't take you long now did it

I love Conquest of the new World. but part of the flair was the extra tactical combat system. that was damn fun (and sometimes really frustrating ).

So, I suggest the implementation of big Regiments and Formations, just for the sake of battles a la "The Patriot" (with Mel Gibson)

Dale said:

1. Add in Portugal, Denmark, Russia and China. We will assume for the minute that the original nations are in: Spain, England, France and Holland.

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Portugal is the obvious choice. If I recall they were omitted because it was difficult to give them a niche that set them apart from the other principle nations.

Denmark (plus other nations like Sweden, Germany (well, the German states) and Scotland) we're at a disadvantage geographically and/or in terms of population numbers so I'm not sure if their inclusion would be, in reality, more of a distraction. Again, giving them a niche is the difficult task and to some extent they are represented by the Netherlands

China - is a what if...but on the basis of what if's you could also argue the case for the possibility for the like of Venice and Genoa. Having a race to colonise from the West (with Russia) could be an interesting aspect, but the distances involved should make it more difficult. China also had the habit of going through some intensely insular moments.

Similarly Russia had to contend with travelling across it's vast Asian holdings, and indeed was effectively still colonising most of it. It was also hampered by the lack of effective port facilities in the winter, and whilst Alaska is large landmass to have colonised, it wasn't colonised on the scale of the East coast. As such I wonder if Russia would really have been able to support Alaska it it had had any serious contention to it.

seZereth said:

I love Conquest of the new World. but part of the flair was the extra tactical combat system. that was damn fun (and sometimes really frustrating ).

So, I suggest the implementation of big Regiments and Formations, just for the sake of battles a la "The Patriot" (with Mel Gibson)

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Conquest of the New World was so fun !

Hey, I just thought of something.

If Firaxis is doing a Colonization II for Civ 4 with features analogous to the original's, then they'd have to invent some kind of Quantitative Resource system, now wouldn't they? Not too big of a deal even if they didn't, since I have one working and we can still include it in this mod if Dale is willing, but it sort of makes you wonder... The economy of Colonization was one of the best parts of the game.

Since its on the BTS engine maybe add a building that lets you have slave specialits, can only run withte slavery civic and have a unit, like ctp2, that can be abolitionist that can free the specialists. captured workers could be added to a city like great people do, but abolitionist can free it


Or alternatively have a corporation that generates hammers for every slave resource you get

Colonization can load "mods"?

The Slave unit could be a Worker, just replaces it. Each slave Galleon that enters a port generates x amount of gold for that nation's coffers.

Also, try throwing in a shipping system: when a ship leaves a port, it has x amount of turns before it has to stop at another one and restock supplies. This would be a high x for Galleons, and a low x for warships (?). Every time a ship of another (non-warring) civ stops at a port of yours, some gold (2?) is added to your gold supplies. if it's possible, establish a few variables to determine where the ship came from, then get a trade route to that location. Thus, cities at strategic peninsulas or islands can get a ton of gold and commerce, becoming centers of trade...simulating what happened in real life.

[Nationalistic Pole]
I DEMAND POLAND!!!!!!!!
[/Nationalistic pole]

But seriously, I think these nations should be included:

England
Netherlands
France
Spain
Portugal
Denmark
Sweden
Germany/Brandenburg ((united)Germany tried to Colonize Venezuela, for other German Colonies in the Americas, they were colonized by Brandenburg).
Scotland
Russia
China(You said China, but Why? Just curios, are you basing this off of the book 1421? Note: I'm not opposed to the idea).
Polynesians (just a suggestion, now that there is proof that the Polynesians visited the Americas before the Europeans (and actually traded with the Amerindians), and your thinking of including China, it might be reasonable to include them to).

Also because i'm Polish, and Biased, i'm going to put out there, Polish Colonialism But i do admit it was small, and perhaps to small for the game. (although it is a What-If game, which leads me to my next question).

Is the mod going to be tied with history and be historical? or are you going to make it a "what if" mod?

Also, I think the game, Colonization, is only going to be about the Americas, (and if it's like the original, it's going to include northern hudson bay all the way to the Falkland Islands) So will you make the mod not only about the colonization of the Americas, but colonization of the planet? I mean, include a map of Africa/Asia/Oceania? (Maybe not as one, but perhaps as different scenerio's?)

Gooblah said:

The Slave unit could be a Worker, just replaces it. Each slave Galleon that enters a port generates x amount of gold for that nation's coffers.

Also, try throwing in a shipping system: when a ship leaves a port, it has x amount of turns before it has to stop at another one and restock supplies. This would be a high x for Galleons, and a low x for warships (?). Every time a ship of another (non-warring) civ stops at a port of yours, some gold (2?) is added to your gold supplies. if it's possible, establish a few variables to determine where the ship came from, then get a trade route to that location. Thus, cities at strategic peninsulas or islands can get a ton of gold and commerce, becoming centers of trade...simulating what happened in real life.

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i was thinking of changingthe spy specialist to a slave specialist and only vailable when running slavery. i was thinking capture workers would become slave units and you can add to your city

My only problem with that model is what slave specialists would produce...production? We already have Engineers for that.

I think Slavery is best represented by having slaves do what slaves do: slave away in plantations (or mines or simple farms or whatever).

A slave resource would be inaccurate, since you can't tug resources in a Galleon.

Gooblah said:

A slave resource would be inaccurate, since you can't tug resources in a Galleon.

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How do you know? In the original game, carrying resources in ships was an integral part of the economic system. Perhaps they've made it possible in this one.

Gooblah said:

My only problem with that model is what slave specialists would produce...production? We already have Engineers for that.

I think Slavery is best represented by having slaves do what slaves do: slave away in plantations (or mines or simple farms or whatever).

A slave resource would be inaccurate, since you can't tug resources in a Galleon.

Click to expand...

i guess lsvaes would produce less hamers and maybe a gold. under the civic slavery you could have unlimited slaves or add a slave specialist. engineers are not always available. i may make a mod and test it out (at some point)

I don't see a problem with having a slave specialist. Yes engineers already produce production, but getting specialist engineers are one of the hardest to get. Usually until very late game, even running a highly specialized economy, most my cities can only get 1-2 engineer specialist.

I would picture slave specialist giving perhaps just 1 hammer and 2 gold. It shouldn't be equal with the engineer or prophet. If you do give it similar stats as the other specialist, then maybe they shouldn't give GPP's. Kinda like a citizen but better, since they are forced to work for free.

sorry if this is nonsense, its a bit early

Shiggs

Shiggs713 said:

I don't see a problem with having a slave specialist. Yes engineers already produce production, but getting specialist engineers are one of the hardest to get. Usually until very late game, even running a highly specialized economy, most my cities can only get 1-2 engineer specialist.

I would picture slave specialist giving perhaps just 1 hammer and 2 gold. It shouldn't be equal with the engineer or prophet. If you do give it similar stats as the other specialist, then maybe they shouldn't give GPP's. Kinda like a citizen but better, since they are forced to work for free.

sorry if this is nonsense, its a bit early

Shiggs

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nope, it makes perfect sense. good point on the GPs and alave shouldn't do that. but why 1 hammer and 2 gold? i guess because they were used more for commercial agriculture and not factory work?

But simulation of abolition could occur through the capture of enemy Slaves/Workers by an invisible unit. Make a Slavecatcher unit with a chance to see the invisible unit.

The buildings for Engineer assignment could be changed/added:

Silversmith, Blacksmith, Stable(?), Forge, Shipyards, etc (Engineer)
Library, University (Scientist)
Market, Grocer, Harbor, Shipyards (Merchant)
Theater, Plaza (?), Town Square (Artist)
Church, Monastery, University (?) (Priest)

So really, there would be more engineer buildings than other ones. That's one problem solved. I would also support the addition of the Officer Specialist, to represent garrisons and provide an extra 'oomph' to GG production:

Barracks, Stable, Military Academy, Military Docks (Officer)

Officer: +1 Production, +5% defense (?)

Finally, Civilization Proposals. First, how long does this game run till? At any rate, these MUST be included:

England, France, Netherlands, Denmark, Spain, Portugal (is it just N. America or S. America as well?)

Native Civilizations: Iroquois Confederation, Huron, Ottowa, errrr the guys who were killed by Jackson?

I always liked the idea/concept of slaves being a resource. I could never envision slaves working to build farms/roads as a movable unit.

In the Civ4 world, the resource "slaves" can provice bonus production to farms/plantation or something in that respect. Then becomming obsolete with a later tech

Dale said:

...
We also know that Col2 is going to be on the Civ4 engine so one can assume a certain level of Modding is possible (at least to the level of BtS, hopefully higher).

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Could someone confirm this? Will it be moddable?

Yeah, said so in the press release "Mod tools will be included".