Community Deity Game #1 - Persia

Folks need to chill down. People play games for fun and not necessarily because they want to participate in a series or make it into a spread sheet. I don't give a flying fook about spread sheets, for example, and I mostly play other games, but if I see a map which looks interesting, I will try. Ultimately, people who do series or spread sheets should do it for their own pleasure and entertainment and take others' participation as a favor and not an obligation. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
Too bad we started off on the wrong foot (domination task for the inept warmonger, welp)

To say something on topic as well I wholeheartedly disagree with the inept part though the bonus doesn't come in form of an op unit but as supportive perks.

Domination usually is seriously lacking money & happiness and the UB offers both. On the other hand during a GA making war is just (too) easy when extra mp acts as a mini-logistics and can effectively double the shots a siege unit can take during a war nevermind how easy the meatshield rotation comes and on top of that double healing tanks throughout the game with the mod in use - Persia is simply an awesome warmonger without having anything particular pointing to that direction.

In case the warpath starts with Nukes/SBs/XCOM the bonuses aren't that visible or significant but that doesn't make Persia bad, just under-/misused.
 
T246 DomV
Achievements: A,B,C, and E

A. Keep 10 Immortals alive to the turn of victory. You can upgrade them, obviously. - 3 pts.
*built 15-16 immortals (and 1 CS gifted me a spearman). Once I was down to 11 Great War Infantry (10/11 were immortals), I put them in cities for safe keeping.

B. Raze 15 cities throughout the whole game - 2 pts.
*15 (16 started, but 1 got captured by CS at 1 pop):
Spoiler :
Heliopolis, Texcoco, Teotihuacan, Buffalo Creek, Vladivostok, Pataliputra, Samara, Magadan, Tver, Murmansk, Vladivostok 2.0, Irkutsk, Bryansk, Brasilia, Agadir, Chita
***Brasilia was captured by CS at 1 pop
***Vladivostok fully burned to the ground; Vladivostok 2.0 was a new/different city built in a different location


C. Enjoy 100+ turns of Golden Age across the game - 3 pts.
*T246 was 100th turn of GA; timed final capital to coincide
*Liberty policy, 4x natural GA, Aesthetics Golden Age, Aesthetics great artist

D. Win a DomV without ever having built trained (including bought) a ranged unit. - 5 pts.
*heck no!

E. Finish with a (base) points score of over 3000 - 3 pts.
*3204

Policies
Full Liberty
Open Commerce, Rationalism, Secularism, Wagon Trains (Commerce)
4 in Aesthetics + 4 in Order

Religion: Desert Folklore, Initiation Rites, Holy Warriors

T87 5-city NC (2 conquered with Comps)
T92 Liberty finisher (GE for Machu)
T101 Machinery
T177 Dynamite

Spoiler :

Founded 3 cities and attacked Egypt first with Composite Bows. They didn't build a single wonder in any of their 3 cities.
Monty had taken over much of Brazil, so I attacked him next; Tenoch had built Pyramids (and Great Library and Terracotta).
I wanted to get Itza for the golden age boost, but Russia was becoming too strong, so next war was mainly to knock them down a few pegs: Russia had Great Wall, I didn't even get close to their capital. In total, went to war with Russia 3 times, taking a few cities each time, and making peace mainly as my immortals were in danger. I think I made peace 3 times this game just to preserve the 10+ immortals.
Anyway, just a long, slow grind of nearly 200 turns of war. Given the 100 turns of GA requirement, game couldn't have finished much quicker for me. Good timing at the end to secure achievements, taking a few extra cities to be sure I was >3000 points. I definitely got sloppy on build order and stopped caring about TR.

Spoiler :



 
To say something on topic as well I wholeheartedly disagree with the inept part though the bonus doesn't come in form of an op unit but as supportive perks.

Domination usually is seriously lacking money & happiness and the UB offers both. On the other hand during a GA making war is just (too) easy when extra mp acts as a mini-logistics and can effectively double the shots a siege unit can take during a war nevermind how easy the meatshield rotation comes and on top of that double healing tanks throughout the game with the mod in use - Persia is simply an awesome warmonger without having anything particular pointing to that direction.

In case the warpath starts with Nukes/SBs/XCOM the bonuses aren't that visible or significant but that doesn't make Persia bad, just under-/misused.

I meant me, I'm the inept warmonger, Persia are a great civ to play :lol:
 
Re: The spreadsheet

How about +1 point for finishing under 250 and +2 for finishing under 200. Everything else remains as is. We keep it universal throughout the maps and designated VCs as I still think finishing a map in under 250 (200) turns is an achievement in itself

I think it's better if there are achievements that force good play, but that get away from straightforward fastest completion. The Immortal achievement is good since it forces early game sacrifices. If the raze 15 city requirement was changed to "raze 15 cities before turn Xxx" then there would already be an anti-turtling incentive. Something like that. It could even be scaled to count the number of cities razed before a certain turn to differentiate close games.

Putting up two (or more) goals that are mildly incompatible leads to the most interesting decision making, I think. I have a couple more thoughts (mostly good :) ) that I'll post after I finish this one up.
 
Makes sense. I really hope you'll take up the offer of being on the host rotational as well, along with Consentient and (so far) Grendel
 
Nothing's stopping you from starting your own series.

I ain't got time for that my friend. Even if I did I don't think many people see the need for an additional series.

I surveyed the existing community. Did you contribute to that survey?

If I recall correctly I did

If you didn't get to participate in the DCLs at the time, nothing is stopping you from going back and doing them. Many people, myself include, read the old threads to see what people got up to.

I spoilered most of them for myself, but there are some I want to do regardardless, like the Sweden DCL among others.

Lastly, I think this thread alone proves that the strategies are not the same. There are differences between all of them. The reason why there is a suggested VC is so that there is more of a scenario feel to the games. If you want total freedom, you can either play the map anyway, contribute your write-up (no one will mind, some might even be grateful); or start another DCL-like casual series.

I don't think there being a designated VC is a "design error" on your side, clearly the feedback is mostly positive, I just personally can't deal with it because as soon as I see that the designated VC is Domination, I immediately want to go Honor, even though that might not be the ideal decision taking into account the environment, diplomacy and other factors.

You could say as soon as I have a limitation from outside, be it which Civ to play, which map to play, which difficulty to play and which victory condition to play I develop a strategy a priori, without any knowledge besides map, difficulty, civilization and victory condition. So I already fee forced into a certain direction. Now with VC also being a factor it's just too much for me. Even if I were to actively strive for a different VC or ignore the suggested VC I would still probably play different than I would do without a suggested VC. I hope this was understandable.

I already fall into the same patterns every single game and that is something I want to work on. If I get to a point where I don't feel like I'm doing "something new" I'll probably just quit the game in all honesty.

But I was kinda bored of reading about people's T28x Science Victories tbh. Hardly anyone was going CV or Domination by comparison - which are really the only interesting victories in my book for the most part.

I think (hope) everyone was. I agree that Culture and Domination are by far the most fun VCs.

I think you're wrong to write this series off after only one map. Did you read the achievements for the 2nd map? I think there is a lot to chew over and consider. But hey, no one can please everyone, so if you decide not to join us, I guess that's your loss :)

I'm sure at some point there'll be a challenge, be it CDG or another, that'll incorporate Acken's Balance Mod, I'll play that game for sure. I'll continue to read the forums anyway and if one of the CDGs strikes my fancy I'll go for it. No need to please everyone, this is a democratic board after all.

Partly my comment was thrown out there because I don't believe for a second that another series WILL be formed. Despite lots of discussion, nothing besides the DCL really endured, and since the CDG is the only really epicentre of any energy, and until other hosts join in, all that energy is being provided by me, the rest of my comment is more or less the most polite I can be with naysayers (especially those choosing emotive terms like 'repulsive' and 'horrible'). I'm trying to be thicker-skinned than I was when host of the DCL, and less accommodating.

i.e. Don't like the series I'm putting together? Don't play.

So I don't think you have anything to worry about, Grendel, especially if you and others contribute maps as rotating hosts.

Not trying to sound like a dee ay cee kay, but I had to chuckle upon reading "emotive terms", read the whole post in the voice of my English teacher, a very highly esteemed and respected British lady in her best years. It's just the way I talk/write, no harm meant :lol:

PLEASE NO, JUST NO, PRETTY PLEASE JUST SAY NO TO THE TEMPTATION, NO, PLX

I agree with your reasoning as to why not and I can definitely tell you that I won't :lol:
 
Spoiler :

Kind of severely impossible to deal with Russian 23 cities and Egyptian 15. Overall the game went much differently as Egypt boxed me in early so I had to settle with 4 cities. Growth and Economy seem MUCH easier without an extra (crap) city holding everything back.

I might also need reconsidering, I've played lots more Immortal games recently and I've enjoyed it a lot more, Deity seems frustrating now, purely because the AI spamming everything kind of ruins it :/

I got to Sci Theo at 150-ish but I'm STILL dead last in tech, no way this game would end well. I think I'll make a sharp turn and use Immortals in early Liberty wars. Though I'm starting to think the map is unforgiving in its size


Probably gonna go back to my previous game and see if I do any better :)
 
To the end, all achievements complete t247. Golden Ages were not well planned.

Spoiler :

Once real bombers enter the fray the speed of conquest shoots up dramatically. Here Russia is burning (I've already burned more than 15 cities to the ground, the rest are just for flavor; I'll finish with ~25 burned cities).



Because I knew the GA turns would be the weak link, I didn't commit to this goal until too late. This leaves a funny game where I have XCOM (t223), but still need 20+ turns of GA. Assault on the second-to-last capital below. I actually need to capture it in 2 turns - otherwise I'll have two missed GA turns. (Delhi has Chichen Izta). Aesthetics has been opened to get an additional required artist.



With Delhi out of the way, a leisurely march to Morocco can proceed. I need a few more points, anyways.

I made a Persian Rug. Or Carpet.



All 13 Immortals survived. In fact the total list of casualties is quite short. Not building any ranged may help with this:

- 1 Scout died to barbarians
- 1 Frigate died (it was a captured unit)
- 1 Privateer died to Ironclads
- 1 BB was swarmed by Privateers (ouch)
- 2 XCOM died (1 to 2-city crossfire, 1 to a Delhi recapture)
- 1 Fighter died (to the same Delhi recapture)

Exactly 100 turns of GA. This is the critical achievement. I should have delayed tech to pursue more early GAs. Partial Liberty instead of finishing Rationalism would have worked, and brought the finish into the early 230s.

Overall, I like the achievement idea and implementation, as it did change how I played this out. :) I just didn't quite get the balance right.
 
Nice win.
Spoiler :
By the looks of that final minimap, you weren't kidding when you said you burned Russia...
 
Nice win.
Spoiler :
By the looks of that final minimap, you weren't kidding when you said you burned Russia...

Spoiler :

Yeah, I wanted to burn mostly Egyptians and Russian cities since this way I can still tech at close to full speed. The big challenge is managing happiness, of course. This is why I had to give several cities to Brazil. Persian Satrap's courts really help. Great Civ.


@ST
Spoiler :

Those city counts are very close to my Egypt (14) and Russia (22). Building 22 cities essentially eliminates Cathy, even with her 1k hammers. So letting them spam away just makes it easier to get a tech advantage. AI shooting itself in the foot. So don't give up :)
 
Deity seems frustrating now, purely because the AI spamming everything kind of ruins it

In GlobalDefines.xml change:
Code:
<Row Name="MIN_CITY_RANGE">
	<Value>[S]3[/S][U]4[/U]</Value>
</Row>
I cannot overstate how much more I like the game now! I am surprised it effects games that others generated (like the DCL and GotM), but great!
 
I meant me, I'm the inept warmonger, Persia are a great civ to play :lol:


Hah, that makes more sense in a modest way but still I managed, for a change, to say something on topic even if we don't disagree on the core issue of Persia's suitability for warmongering. Goodie.
 
Nice carpet Olodune! Exactly what I had in mind. My own carpets were not so big at the end because I was going for speed as well, but that screenshot is truly awesome :)
 
Jesus Christ those carpets are sick :lol:

edit: so buckle down and grind away, *sigh*

oh crap I don't think I saved and the autos didn't take care of that....
 
Finished this one on turn 269, with all 5 achievements.

I love how the mini-map is pretty much just one color with spots of black...

To the end, all achievements complete t247. Golden Ages were not well planned... I made a Persian Rug. Or Carpet.

You sure did -- in a beautiful red hue!

so buckle down and grind away, *sigh*

I am having a little more success with my latest run. Ended up waiting on RL, not really intentionally. I had wanted to try tanks like you suggested but map is tight on oil and liberal with aluminum. The oil went to four fighters and three bombers. As I get more oil, it will all go to bombers. It is still very much a question if I will be able to finish before someone launches, but I am optimistic. It is turn 298 and A-Bombs about to unlock...

EDIT: 325 loss to SV by the lady this time. So the game went longer and a different AI winer.
 
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