Underrated UUs/UBs

ok i don't dought that its just as it is a granary isn't the first thing you should build i meen 99% of the time yes i build a granary in my cities but thats not the most important thing you can build and usualy not the first either (nor is it a worker) usualy I start by building either a warrior or a baracks. And I'm not trying to stir up trouble i'm just stating my blunt opinion and everything i say is IME so this descussion can end. I will stop if someone will simply state that some buildings people ignore (stele, Dun, Salon, reaserch institute, mall, etc...) do have very good uses, and I will concied that yes I dont know the half of everything in the game. Its that simple. :deadhorse:
 
ok i don't dought that its just as it is a granary isn't the first thing you should build i meen 99% of the time yes i build a granary in my cities but thats not the most important thing you can build and usualy not the first either (nor is it a worker) usualy I start by building either a warrior or a baracks. And I'm not trying to stir up trouble i'm just stating my blunt opinion and everything i say is IME so this descussion can end. I will stop if someone will simply state that some buildings people ignore (stele, Dun, Salon, reaserch institute, mall, etc...) do have very good uses, and I will concied that yes I dont know the half of everything in the game. Its that simple. :deadhorse:

Hate to say it, mate, but I think you might be taking things a little bit too personally. Debates, arguments, and corrections happen around here all the time. You just gotta roll with it. I get told I'm wrong all the time because I'm a peace-mongering CV-chaser who has hardly any experience with the UUs and is just building opinions on them all in theory - and the game mechanics are super confusing in that sense, I still don't fully grasp how they work, so it's not terribly effective (like when I thought, reasonably, that Vulture and Axeman are just as good against melee units, because 6+25%=7.5, and 5+50%=7.5, right? Turns out that's not how it works, though. Axeman's a sight better against melee units than Vultures because of how the mechanics work. It's confusing)

So just sit back, relax, and learn from the other players. Don't be afraid to put your own opinion out there, but don't get too shook up when other people shoot it down, either.

As an aside, a Barracks isn't a great first build. It doesn't really give you a tangible advantage. If you want to grow your city, build Warriors, because then at least you'll have some units kicking around soon. An early Barracks can be good if you're rushing (I'm assuming - like I said, peacemonger here) but as your first build, it isn't that useful.

I believe the rule of thumb for new players is to make one each of Worker, Settler, and Warrior, the order depending on what you want to do. I prefer Worker first, so I can tech Bronze Working while he builds and chop out a Settler second, then do a Warrior third so that my city can grow. Other people would rather do a Warrior second, so they can grow their city to size 2 or 3 before the Settler. It depends on your strategy, your style, and most of all your start.
 
No problem maurcus.
I am one that doesn't always build the same thing first every game.
Typically, I build worker, then warrior, but there are times when that isn't the smart move.

If, I am China and start with AG and mining, then while I research BW, I built my first worker to irrigate my Corn and can now start chopoing.

If, I start with Fishing & Mining and have good seafood and a plains cow, then, I build a WB, then worker. The 1st fish builds the 1st worker faster and research BW to chop out the next WB.

If, I have No starting worker techs, it makes no sense to me, to go worker first. It will just be sitting around and my city didn't grow any.
An example might be, on occasion where I have gone for a religon (on 'always war' games, this can be good), or
on occasion I have immediately permitted my city to pop up while I went for Stonehenge on turn1.
If I start with Fishing & Wheel, I can go for Pottery & Library for early Scientists, which means I need pop more than I need the worker to slow my growth or build that road.

Each game is different. Each map is different. Each empire is different. Each leader is different.

I even had a game as an IMP leader, where I went worker/settler/settler/settler to chop out settlers ASAP for a quick empire.

For most games though, 'worker first' is a good rule of thumb.
 
i often "fly by the seat of my pants" (no offense to those who don't wear pants) i.e. all randomized it all changes rather quickly.
 
ok i don't dought that its just as it is a granary isn't the first thing you should build i meen 99% of the time yes i build a granary in my cities but thats not the most important thing you can build and usualy not the first either (nor is it a worker) usualy I start by building either a warrior or a baracks.

Warrior or especially barracks in a new city before a granary is wrong almost 100% of the time. The only exception is very early game cities with limited :) cap when you might want warriors for barb spawn busting. Growing cities is very important to both economy and productivity; granary is #1 econ building hands down in civ IV. Yes, you need units to survive, but aside from that granary all the way.

(no offense to those who don't wear pants)

I prefer to wear pants as infrequently as possible.
 
...
I prefer to wear pants as infrequently as possible.

ok. I think that was TMI.
Just not a picture I need in my head.
LOL!

Might have to rename you to To Much Information Team.
LOL!
Sorry, I couldn't resist.
:)
 
Well usually i don't start with the tech for granary so in the idle time i usually build warrior/barracks while I wait.
 
Er, actually, it was TMIT. TMI doesn't really post around here much anymore.

LOL. We can't spell TMIT, without TMI.
I guess, TMITplusPants would be too much of a name change. :D
Maybe, TooMuchInformation+Trousers ?
Currently it seems it is: TooMuchInformation-Trousers.
LOL.
and we've had a lot of rain here this week. 80% chance yesterday.
70% the day before. 60% today. We'll get it all week too.
http://www.cfnews13.com/weather/forecast.html
I can see no pants wiith this humidity, but wear shorts like me then. :D
Of course, he didn't say no shorts, so hopefully that is the case.
 
Pants are way overrated, and the blind conformism surrounding them is baffling. Down with pants.
 
Quechas.

Quechas use pants, normal warriors use loincloths.

Obviously its an intricate discussion on how Marcus thinks Quechua's are underrated, he likes to 'fly by the seat of his pants', meaning he relys on quecha's often early game.

TMIT thinks that they are overpowered, and he prefers not to use them unless he's in a particularly bad Deity level situation. Hence 'He likes to wear pants as infrequently as possible'.

Plasmacannon called him on his boasting, saying 'thats too much information'. Plasmacannon thinks that TMIT was bosting he didn't need quechas (hence, pants) as much as other players in hard high level games.

Ironon thinks Quechas are way overated, and people just think they're so great because of the elitists promoting them. He thinks there are better UU's out there, and wants to bring down their popularity.

That how it relates to UU's :D
 
Jags, LOTSA Jags :p
I like, if I do, building a jag army and annexing everyone. :D
 
The condition a player is in has a big impact on his strategy and play quality, and that is definitely related to the usage of UU and UB. You have to be comfortable or it's difficult to concentrate on how best to micro, especially with fast workers and other fast things/units.
 
ok this has gotten way out of hand pants have 0 to do with this thread. I am sorry if I made the mistake of cracking a joke here so I am sorry.
 
In all seriousness though, once you have something that boosts :) cap meaningfully you need granaries in cities as a priority. Each pop working an improved tile means more :commerce:, :hammers:, or :food: ---> gpp or whip :hammers: for your empire. As nice as something like, say, a forge is, 25% hammers rarely beats out just adding 6+ raw :hammers:/turn sooner by growing onto mines or whip-able farms. Especially because the granary is less expensive to build than most buildings, it makes it hands down the best econ building in all cities except those "pop 1 forever tundra cities set to claim resources and only for such a purpose".

Hopefully, you didn't take my response to your joke seriously. I was just showing a crack of my own in response. Of a joke.
 
maybe but it was blown WAY out of proportions by many a comment.
Also yes I love the granaries but not as a special building something like a maddrassa is a UB.
 
:hammers: saved early on snowball into larger :hammers: advantages overall than later savings. The terrace allows non-creative to get a border pop on the #1 econ building in the game, saving you the :hammers: you'd otherwise spend on early-game monuments and giving a distinct :culture: advantage over rivals given equal :culture: buildings too. It also auto-converts captured granaries into terraces, so captured cities will often have a border pop very quickly also (it's one of the only buildings you can capture + produce culture, along with odeon and the salon due to the artist). If it did more the terrace would easily be top tier, but as it stands it's still in the upper portion of UB overall and comes with a civ that brings amazing traits + UU too...but MOST people understand how good this building is so it's not really underrated.
 
Damn, I missed out on this pants discussion. But I am going to keep my pants on and say that after reading the last two pages, I learned that units can also be called niche builds. Just turn on OCC, no barbs and always peace. That way all we need is 1 niche warrior minimum, 1 niche worker and if needed a few wb and an explorer(?).

It is time to wonder hog. :) I will consider building a Granary to please others at these forums. :p
 
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