Great Diplomat Mod

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Jun 7, 2008
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Just wonder...
While I'm working on the tag Vokarya has requested, I've stumbled upon an interesting mod that I've considered some time ago but the I forgot about it.
Great Diplomat Mod
What do you think about it? I believe it would be a fine addition to AND.
 
The Great Diplomat himself is quite interesting (+4 relations with somebody? hell yeah!)
And the Envoy reminds me of Civ2's Diplomat unit.

Though I'm not sure if we need another type of specialist.
 
Though I'm not sure if we need another type of specialist.

That's something I was considering too. Great Diplomat / Envoy look fine, but why adding another specialist? And there's another thing to consider (and I'd like to hear Vokarya on this one): adding another GP would mean we need to redistribute Great Peoples through different techs. Since Vokarya has spent some time balancing them, I'd like to hear what he has to say about it.
 
Maybe the great diplomat can be spawned only from techs and the rare event? (Like the great artist from ice sculpting and the free settled specialist from the Dying Dynasty event)
 
Maybe the great diplomat can be spawned only from techs and the rare event? (Like the great artist from ice sculpting and the free settled specialist from the Dying Dynasty event)

I'm not sure; I think it's fine if it's built as a normal Great Person, I don't see why we should make it available only once or twice while other GP are periodically available. I just want to make sure we won't break Vokarya's GP balancing work. I don't know how many Great Prophets, Great Scientists and so on are available by techs and how many points toward each GP we're currently gaining from buildings. I guess we should give Great Diplomat the same chance as any other GP. But if we add it, I need to discuss with Vokarya what are appropriate Techs to get this new kind of GP, what techs can be discovered by it and what buildings can add Great Diplomat points.
 
45°38'N-13°47'E;13160516 said:
I'm not sure; I think it's fine if it's built as a normal Great Person, I don't see why we should make it available only once or twice while other GP are periodically available. I just want to make sure we won't break Vokarya's GP balancing work. I don't know how many Great Prophets, Great Scientists and so on are available by techs and how many points toward each GP we're currently gaining from buildings. I guess we should give Great Diplomat the same chance as any other GP. But if we add it, I need to discuss with Vokarya what are appropriate Techs to get this new kind of GP, what techs can be discovered by it and what buildings can add Great Diplomat points.

The other thought I had would probably not be easy to implement, but it was generating Great Diplomat points through some other actions - like how Great Generals are produced from combat, Great Diplomats might be generated from diplomatic actions somehow. I think the standard way of generating them (Specialists & Buildings) would be better and simpler though :)
 
The other thought I had would probably not be easy to implement, but it was generating Great Diplomat points through some other actions - like how Great Generals are produced from combat, Great Diplomats might be generated from diplomatic actions somehow. I think the standard way of generating them (Specialists & Buildings) would be better and simpler though :)

Yes, I think so. I like your idea but way too complicated to implement now.
 
45°38'N-13°47'E;13160490 said:
That's something I was considering too. Great Diplomat / Envoy look fine, but why adding another specialist?

  • Lawyer: +2 Commerce, +1 Espionage, +3 GP Great Statesman Points
  • Great Statesman: +4 Commerce, +3 Espionage (settled GDiplomat)

I would love to see this in the mod, but would mean a lot of work. Except...

Maybe the great diplomat can be spawned only from techs and the rare event? (Like the great artist from ice sculpting and the free settled specialist from the Dying Dynasty event)

I agree. They shoul be avaiable in a different way, than the other GPs, just as Great Commanders are different than the others.
A few cases that could generate free GDs:
-some chance for it, when meeting a new civ
-free GD for certain World Wonders and National Wonders
-free GD for 1st to discover sertain techs
-free GD for every civ when discovering certain tech (or only chance for it)
-events
-UN and UN Mission generates GD periodically or randomly


EDIT: I see that the conversation just went on :)
 
The idea seems nice ! It could be also a unique unit similar to a spy which try to make diplomatic missions (with spy points?) to improve the relations with the civ. It might also fail and decrease the relationship ?
The problem with this kind of unit is that it don't work on humans, only AI.
 
I would be in favor of additional types of Great Persons and Specialists (Athlete and Doctor are two that I would like to see); however, I think we should follow the standard paradigm for Great Persons and not try to create some totally new system.

I don't know if we can get a new specialist to show up on the city screen. I know C2C had problems with this and I don't know if they were ever fixed. What if Noble specialists created Great Diplomat GPP? That would work for a little bit. I would also be concerned with where we would get these specialists from, as I don't want to take away any Spy specialists at this point. I haven't done a lot of work yet on balancing post-Renaissance specialists (we definitely need more post-Renaissance Merchants and more Industrial Scientists).

We can easily convert some National and World Wonders to provide Great Diplomat points (Versailles, UN, even Apostolic Palace).

It's fairly simple to assign GP's to techs; pick one Medieval/Renaissance (treating the Great Artist from Music as a very early Medieval), one Industrial/Modern, and one Transhuman Era tech to get the GP, but try to balance the numbers between the eras involved. For a Diplomat, I would lean towards:
  • Political Philosophy for the Med/Ren era
  • Globalization for the Ind/Mod era as a quick-and-dirty; however, what I'd really like to do is move the Great Merchant from Applied Economics to Conglomerates, invent a new building (probably a Bank upgrade) for Applied Economics (AE would still be two tricks without the GM, but when they are a civic and its civic building, it's not as strong as it could be), and give the Diplomat to Imperialism
  • Thought Scanning for the Transhuman era

I also wouldn't mind having an event or two generate a Great Diplomat. What if the "Great Mediator" event settles a GDip in a city as well? For me it often comes up when I'm winning a war so I almost never take the +1 bonus.
 
I love diplomacy, but yeah that mod looks like a GP enhancement more than anything

What if Noble specialists created Great Diplomat GPP? That would work for a little bit.

...

We can easily convert some National and World Wonders to provide Great Diplomat points (Versailles, UN, even Apostolic Palace).

...

I also wouldn't mind having an event or two generate a Great Diplomat. What if the "Great Mediator" event settles a GDip in a city as well? For me it often comes up when I'm winning a war so I almost never take the +1 bonus.
+1

Say, is there any way of modifying events? For example, could having a certain number of Great Diplomat points lessen relationship penalties? E.g. if you kidnap pilgrims to a holy site I think that choice is a -2 to relationship with the other civ, but having some GD points reduces it to -1? Or you send food to a starving city, and instead of a +1 bonus to the relationship with the civ it becomes +2?

I love events, but they feel rather disconnected from things.
 
Ok, I think I'll go down the road Vokarya has suggested. Standard method to gain GP points, but I'll try first to see if other specialists are causing troubles. Also, I was also considering Great Doctors but I've never thought about Athletes. Sounds interesting too.
 
(...)
I don't know if we can get a new specialist to show up on the city screen. I know C2C had problems with this and I don't know if they were ever fixed. What if Noble specialists created Great Diplomat GPP? That would work for a little bit. I would also be concerned with where we would get these specialists from, as I don't want to take away any Spy specialists at this point. I haven't done a lot of work yet on balancing post-Renaissance specialists (we definitely need more post-Renaissance Merchants and more Industrial Scientists).
(...)

It's good only as long as nobles are avaiable, which is until the end of renassiance era.
I really like in nobles that they provide unasigned GPPs. It really feels like they are patrons of others :)
I would also like them giving +1Xp and -1:gold:, since they said "We serve the king with our blood", and also enjoyed tax freenes.

So I think a separate specialist is better for the GDiplomat, but maybe not lawyer, that sounds too modern for me, and could not imagine them in the Ancient-Medeivel eras.
Maybe legislator or politician?

I can agree with the rest.

Doctors and Great Doctors? Well, why not? :)
Altough I always thought of them as scientists, but it would be good to have a specialist giving +1:health:

Athlets? Oh, please no. What would they do? I think Celebs cover them good enough.
 
I've resumed working on adding Great Diplomat mod; I've finished merging it but game keeps crashing as soon as I start a map. Debugging it shows that the problem has something to do with some new COMMAND abilities of the GD, probably a new command "Upgrade improvement"

Code:
bool CvCommandInfo::read(CvXMLLoadUtility* pXML)
{
	CvString szTextVal;
	if (!CvHotkeyInfo::read(pXML))
	{
		return false;
	}

	if (pXML->GetChildXmlValByName(szTextVal, "Automate"))
	{		
		setAutomate(GC.getTypesEnum(szTextVal));
	}

	pXML->GetChildXmlValByName(&m_bConfirmCommand, "bConfirmCommand");
	pXML->GetChildXmlValByName(&m_bVisible, "bVisible");
	pXML->GetChildXmlValByName(&m_bAll, "bAll");
/************************************************************************************************/
/* Great Diplomat MOD               START                                                  		*/
/************************************************************************************************/
	int* paiTemp = NULL;
	bool bNull;
	int i;

	[COLOR="Red"]pXML->SetVariableListTagPair(&paiTemp, "UpgradeImprovementRates", sizeof(GC.getImprovementInfo((ImprovementTypes)0)), GC.getNumImprovementInfos());[/COLOR]
	// Convert
	bNull = true;
	m_piUpgradeImprovementRate.clear();
	for (i = 0; i < GC.getNumImprovementInfos(); i++)
	{
		[COLOR="Red"]if (paiTemp[i] != 0)[/COLOR]
		{
			bNull = false;
			break;
		}		
	}
	if (!bNull)
	{
		for (i = 0; i < GC.getNumImprovementInfos(); i++)
		{
			m_piUpgradeImprovementRate.push_back(paiTemp[i]);
		}
	}
	SAFE_DELETE_ARRAY(paiTemp);
/************************************************************************************************/
/* Great Diplomat MOD               END                                                  		*/
/************************************************************************************************/

	return true;
}

Looks like the lines in red are causing troubles because I'm gettin an error on paiTemp, "CXX0030: Error: expression cannot be evaluated".
Afforess or someone else, are you able to see what's wrong with that part of the code?
CommandInfos.xml is part of default Civ, it's not in AND but it's being modified adding some new commands and the one causing troubles should be

Code:
		<CommandInfo>
			<Type>COMMAND_UPGRADE_IMPROVEMENTS</Type>
			<Description>TXT_KEY_COMMAND_UPGRADE_IMPROVEMENTS</Description>
			<Help>TXT_KEY_COMMAND_UPGRADE_IMPROVEMENTS_HELP</Help>
			<HotKey>KB_U</HotKey>
			<bAltDown>1</bAltDown>
			<bShiftDown>0</bShiftDown>
			<bCtrlDown>1</bCtrlDown>
			<iHotKeyPriority>0</iHotKeyPriority>
			<HotKeyAlt/>
			<bAltDownAlt>0</bAltDownAlt>
			<bShiftDownAlt>0</bShiftDownAlt>
			<bCtrlDownAlt>0</bCtrlDownAlt>
			<iHotKeyPriorityAlt>0</iHotKeyPriorityAlt>
			<iOrderPriority>0</iOrderPriority>
			<bConfirmCommand>0</bConfirmCommand>
			<bVisible>1</bVisible>
			<UpgradeImprovementRates>
				<UpgradeImprovementRate>
					<ImprovementType>IMPROVEMENT_COTTAGE</ImprovementType>
					<iRate>3</iRate>
				</UpgradeImprovementRate>
				<UpgradeImprovementRate>
					<ImprovementType>IMPROVEMENT_HAMLET</ImprovementType>
					<iRate>2</iRate>
				</UpgradeImprovementRate>
				<UpgradeImprovementRate>
					<ImprovementType>IMPROVEMENT_VILLAGE</ImprovementType>
					<iRate>1</iRate>
				</UpgradeImprovementRate>
			</UpgradeImprovementRates>
			<Button>Art/Interface/Buttons/Actions/socialreform.dds</Button>
		</CommandInfo>

Any advice?
 
In the code you posted, piaTemp is set to NULL, and that is it. It is never allocated (like a new int[...]) so you are accessing a NULL pointer, and boom, crash. Basically there is some code that should set piaTemp to some sort of initial value, and you are missing it. Is piaTemp from the Great Diplomat mod or ours?
 
In the code you posted, piaTemp is set to NULL, and that is it. It is never allocated (like a new int[...]) so you are accessing a NULL pointer, and boom, crash. Basically there is some code that should set piaTemp to some sort of initial value, and you are missing it. Is piaTemp from the Great Diplomat mod or ours?

It's part of the Great Diplomat mod; I'm 100% sure that I've imported everything from that mod so the code is probably incomplete. I'll have to ask Stolenrays.
 
I'm going to be taking a look soon at the XML changes. We're probably going to need a lot of Magistrate specialist slots in the Industrial Era to keep them balanced with other specialists. I can also see a couple more places to allow Great Diplomat GPP and a couple of helper places.
 
I finally updated my regular copy of the mod to v723 (with my most recent tech tree tweaks). I opened up the Civilopedia and I noticed two things:

The bonuses for the Magistrate specialist and Great Diplomat specialist look like they are switched. (The GD is providing GPP, while the Magistrate is not).

Can we move the Envoy unit? It's currently at Optics. Optics is already a very content-heavy tech. I count 7.5 tricks without the Envoy (6 for Caravel, Glassblowers' Guild, Great Spy, Marco Polo's Embassy, Whaling Boats, and +1 sight over Water squares, with 1.5 for the two Renaissance Era ships of Brigantine and Sloop and the Sentry I promotion). I think it would be better for content distribution if it was moved to Heraldry (4 tricks with Draper's Guild, Man-At-Arms, Rider, and Royal Tournament) or Paper (only 2 tricks, Paper Mill and University of Sankore).
 
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