Vokarya's Workshop: Buildings

One thing that we haven't done a lot of is making Unique Buildings out of the new buildings that we have added to AND. We have way more buildings than BTS has, but the Unique Buildings are still left on their original buildings from BTS. Since UB's consist of a regular building plus one or maybe two additional bonuses, I think we can transplant those bonuses onto another more appropriate building without too much trouble. There are three places I think we can do this; most UB's are pretty appropriate, but some I just think could fit better.

American Mall: Transplant to Shopping District. The Mall bonuses are +20% gold and +1 happy from Hit Singles/Movies/Musicals. Both the Supermarket and the Shopping District come around at the same time in the late Industrial Era. The Shopping District just seems to fit better. The bonuses can be moved over exactly as originally coded.

Byzantine Hippodrome: Transplant to Arena. This one is a bit more complicated. The Hippodrome bonuses over the Theatre include +1 , double from the Culture slider (from 1/10% to 1/5%), and shifting Theatre's normal +1 from Dye over to Horse. What I would do with an Arena-Hippodrome is set the culture slider bonus to 1 /10% culture (the current Arena is 1/25%), keep the +1 from Horse, drop the innate +1 , and add +1 XP to Mounted units. It's slightly less happiness-potent than the original Hippodrome, but it's still strong over the current Arena.

Indian Mausoleum: Transplant to Graveyard. Both are buildings for honoring the dead. I would give Mausoleum the stats of a Graveyard with +2 and a longer expiration date; I think this one could last all the way to Graveyard's original expiration of Ecological Engineering.

Sounds very good

One thing I have noticed with respect to UB's is that ones that replace buildings that are them selves replaced seem weak. For example Cathage's cothon gets replaced by a port relatively soon, so looses its advantage.

I had an unusual thought. I think it might be a good idea to move the Grocer from Guilds to Crop Rotation.

Guilds is far and away the single best tech for new stuff, as long as you play with the Guilds and Civic Buildings options. It starts with Guilds civic, Piazza San Marco, Hanseatic League, and two minor tricks with +1 from Tailor Shop and +1 from Workshop. Civic Buildings adds the Guild Hall for a 5th trick and the Guilds option adds a staggering 17 tricks; 3 National Wonder Guildhalls and 14 of the 15 individual guilds have Guilds tech as a non-redundant tech. The only exception is Mercers' Guild, which requires you to go down the Guilds -> Paper -> Banking line.

On the other hand, Crop Rotation is a measly 1.5 tricks, with Butchers Master Guild and +1 from Farms. Giving this tech the Grocer would make it much more valuable. As it is, you don't have to research Crop Rotation until you are ready to go after Biology (it isn't required for any other Medieval or Renaissance Era tech).

The Grocer move makes sense to me.

Sounds very good to me too.

Go for it. I must add that I don't play with the mediaeval guilds, so that probably affects your trick system's relevance in my case.

I have been thinking that it would be a good idea if we merged together the Arena and Colosseum buildings. I don't think there really is room for two different places of public athletic entertainment in the Classical Era, and that it would be much better to just have one. They use the same building model as well, which is another clue. I'm normally in favor of keeping BTS names, but in this case, I think it would be better to keep the Arena name and save the Colosseum and to keep it at Athletics, so as not to cause any problems for Olympic Games.

The resulting Arena would look like this:

• Base cost 90
• Culture +2
• Keep Colosseum's +0.15 happy/citizen, or even cut it down to +0.1
• Keep happy from the Culture slider to 1/20%
• Keep Arena's +1 XP to Melee units
• Both get +1 from the Private civic, so keep it at +1
• Stadium/Zero-G Arena become upgrades of Arena
• Ball Court, Garden, Odeon replace Arena
• Events: Favorite Son and National Sports League can trigger off Arenas (although do we even need National Sports League as an Event if we have it as a Building?); Football War (which I have never seen trigger) can trigger off Stadiums.

Vokarya said:

I have been thinking that it would be a good idea if we merged together the Arena and Colosseum buildings. I don't think there really is room for two different places of public athletic entertainment in the Classical Era, and that it would be much better to just have one. They use the same building model as well, which is another clue. I'm normally in favor of keeping BTS names, but in this case, I think it would be better to keep the Arena name and save the Colosseum and to keep it at Athletics, so as not to cause any problems for Olympic Games.

The resulting Arena would look like this:

• Base cost 90
• Culture +2
• Keep Colosseum's +0.15 happy/citizen, or even cut it down to +0.1
• Keep happy from the Culture slider to 1/20%
• Keep Arena's +1 XP to Melee units
• Both get +1 from the Private civic, so keep it at +1
• Stadium/Zero-G Arena become upgrades of Arena
• Ball Court, Garden, Odeon replace Arena
• Events: Favorite Son and National Sports League can trigger off Arenas (although do we even need National Sports League as an Event if we have it as a Building?); Football War (which I have never seen trigger) can trigger off Stadiums.

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Very good!

After the merge, can we have a Colosseum world wonder? Pleeeeeeeease...

Do you build industrial parks? I feel it very unworthy to build lots of for almost nothing.
I think it could be boosted a bit. Give it a +10 or 20% to construction of all industrial buildings: Factory, Manufacturing Plant, all power plants, Cannery, Food Processing Plant, etc.

Sogroon said:

Do you build industrial parks? I feel it very unworthy to build lots of for almost nothing.
I think it could be boosted a bit. Give it a +10 or 20% to construction of all industrial buildings: Factory, Manufacturing Plant, all power plants, Cannery, Food Processing Plant, etc.

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I build them quite often, unless the city's deep in and can't build any more health buildings
Or just isn't a production city at all (Tundra locked "Space filler" cities for example)


They're required for Arcologies if I recall, so I'll be building them eventually one way or another.

The extra Engineer alone is worth it in my opinion.

Rezca said:

They're required for Arcologies if I recall, so I'll be building them eventually one way or another.

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Arcologies are too far away in the Transhuman era to make an Industrial era building worthy.

I think it would be good to streamline things a bit in Industrial era and onward.

Railway station:
Connects all nearby friendly cities with Railway route (only cities that also have railway station built).
Off course some connectedness bonus could be added too.

Every railway type could have their own version of it. It would remove a great amount of unnecessary micromanagement.

Isn't there the Golden Spike for that?

Tolni said:

Isn't there the Golden Spike for that?

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Yes. I would prefer keeping free route-building to Wonders. By the time I reach the Industrial Era, I really don't have anything else do with my workers EXCEPT build routes. I usually use the Automate Trade Network command so they don't build over anything I want to keep. (I have this astounding hatred for Workshops. I don't build them myself and use Workers to destroy them in AI-conquered territory.)

Talking about buildings, am I the only one who thinks that Artist Guild is a bit overpowered?

45°38'N-13°47'E;13440398 said:

Talking about buildings, am I the only one who thinks that Artist Guild is a bit overpowered?

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Perhaps a little bit... +4 and +50% seems a bit much for a standard building with no other requirements...

Maybe cut down on one or both of the effects, or have it require something else to be present first (Unless it already does so?)

Rezca said:

Perhaps a little bit... +4 and +50% seems a bit much for a standard building with no other requirements...

Maybe cut down on one or both of the effects, or have it require something else to be present first (Unless it already does so?)

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I think the problem might be that +50%. AG appears at Free Artistry and cities are producing a lot of culture already by that time. Let's see what Vokarya thinks about it.

45°38'N-13°47'E;13440426 said:

I think the problem might be that +50%. AG appears at Free Artistry and cities are producing a lot of culture already by that time. Let's see what Vokarya thinks about it.

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Agreed. +50% culture is really strong. I think we should keep the +4 culture and give it 1 Artist slot. I'm surprised a building with Artist in its name doesn't give you Artists.