Useful Patches for Civ 3 Conquests v1.22

Actually, I think this should be made somehow optional, or linked to a technology.
Like city use 2 squares until you discover "urbanization".

Steph said:

Actually, I think this should be made somehow optional, or linked to a technology.
Like city use 2 squares until you discover "urbanization".

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Yeah, that would be great, but it requires rewriting dozens of functions

Bengal Tiger said:

Hmm...Something I've noticed with the new city tile limit, is that very rarely something will happen where the city doesn't register the citizen labouring any tiles at all in terms of food/production/commerce. I'm not sure what's causing it.

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Oh... It seems that I have the same problem as Bengal Tiger: The place in the center (there the city itself is placed) no longer produces shields or food. The outer places (including the new extended places) work normally.



I have added my experimental save game, but I am not sure if you can open it, as my Civ3 is heavily modded.

Antal1987 said:

Please, share, your save file, if you can, because I couln't simulate case like that.

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Here it is. It's a different one than before, but I'm able to recreate the problem fairly regularly in-game. Check my second city built, Utica.

Something I've also noticed though, is that if you starve one of the population to death, the city goes back to normal growth, unless of course you only have one citizen in which case the city is destroyed.

Also, @ Kirejara I don't think the problem is unique to the city centre, as you an see from my screenshot before or this save file. I think the game has trouble registering whatever the "newest" tile is, so in a case like yours where the sole citizen is not working any tile it's the city centre that gets left out, but if citizens are working tiles then it will never be the city centre, for me at least.

clamel said:

I think question arise with what new feature should be in a "common" patch
The first patches to the "official" No-cd patch 1.22 was to increase city and unit limits and of course the no-raze stuff. That helped and improved the game.

Things that truly changes the game perhaps should be included in an extra patch, beyond the common and known true bugs. (Increase city radius is not a bug IMHO, just a limitation).

IMHO if all improvements/bugs are put into 1 patch gamers have to decide to skip like the submarine bug by not getting all the other presumed stuff.
Having a almost bug-free patch AND then increase that patch with additional possible things. I guess we all have many things in mind that really might change the game, but that could go horrible wrong as I mentioned before.

One thing (I mentioned before) is that resource needs to be within city radius to build a certain unit. That changes the game and is not a bug, but increase unit handling in mods. Such a change should not be in the primary "bug-free" patch but perhaps in an expanded patch.
BUT who makes the choices ???
Antal1987 of course within what great skill Antal1987 have. We other can only suggest.
It´s a big responsibility to get this right.
I wish Antal1987 the best of luck in his great Quest to improve this game.

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I know what you're saying, but I vote for not slowing this guy down with such concerns. He's on a productive tear that benefits us in ways we haven't had before. How long do we get to have this? Let's say he burns out tomorrow and moves on to another personal project and we lose him. He's documented his patches well enough I think someone else can pick apart the differences in patches and remove/recombine them as desired. Several of us can byte edit. But nobody has demonstrated his level of ability, interest, analysis, and unique results.

I'm really excited about the patch framework. I think if he accomplishes that then someone else might be able to contribute, too.

Now I introduce my first patch with the patch framework. It's now 2 files to be places in C3C directory: Civ3Conquests_p6.exe and C3CPF.dll. The 2-nd one is the patch framework. It's also required to run the game.

Do all versions of the patch include the no raze and no city limit patches?

nick0515 said:

Do all versions of the patch include the no raise and no city limit patches?

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Not yet.

You just have to get those adds for the sake of many mods and bigger maps. These No-xxx patches opened the doors to many modders and it would be sad to close them.

I´m counting on you mate, you´re moving along with great speed and zeal. Keep it up...

My big thanks.

Antal1987 said:

Now I introduce my first patch with the patch framework. It's now 2 files to be places in C3C directory: Civ3Conquests_p6.exe and C3CPF.dll. The 2-nd one is the patch framework. It's also required to run the game.

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Not to sound thick, but rather careful.. exactly which folders should these be placed in? That is, exactly what procedure do I follow to use this?

Balthasar said:

Not to sound thick, but rather careful.. exactly which folders should these be placed in? That is, exactly what procedure do I follow to use this?

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The folder where Civ3Conquests.exe locates. DLL should be there too. Just run patch's exe and that's it.

I have encountered the bug when larger cities doesn't produce the correct amount of food/shields. I have found what seems to be a pattern. It appears that when a tile beyond the "old" city limits is worked AND a wonder is completed (by the human player or AI), the output from that tile (beyond old borders) is lost. It doesn't get back next turn, either, and shield production is indicated to be negative, although it in fact is positive (need to test more). These effect are also cumulative. Also when being gifted a free tech (from goodie hut or by trading with AI) this happens. The tech that triggered the bug (every time) was a tech that revealed a new luxury in addition to enableing the forbidden palace. As long as none of the "extended" city limits-tiles were worked, everything seemed fine. Could it have something to do with a routine that is refreshing the yield from city tiles? I didn't check if the gold output is lost as well, but I will continue to investigate. With Steph back too, I have high hopes that this eventually turns out to be fixable, cause I'm already enjoying the new feature.

Update 1: Also when building a harbor (+1 food in water-tiles) the yield from the (worked) tiles beyond "old" city-limits are deducted. Commerce is also affected. If one of the tiles are water-tiles, then it is the modified food-yield (+1) that is deducted. A tile with pollution (not worked) outside the "original" borders (inside the expanded city) acts like normal when the pollution is cleared. If the tile is worked (no yield) when the pollution is cleared, the tile yield is deducted from the city's total yield (food, shields and commerce). It's worth noting that the great wonders that so far has triggered this bug either grants a free building to all cities, or it modifies the city's water-tile yield.
PS. the mod I use is a heavily modified version of Rise and Rule.

Update 2: The bug also occur in a city that has completed a unit with population cost. Techs that doesn't reveal any resources doesn't seem to trigger the bug.

This is what I have been meaning of scary.
"Fixing" too much might result in additional unseen problems, and the more changes that are done the more strange effect and what causing it might pop up.

Starting by trying to fix the CLEAR bugs, some and the most irritating mentioned by Civinator.
(I was under the impression that it was fixing BUGS in the first place that most gamers looked forward too.)

Then starting to try to add and change things gamers doesn´t think is good or alternative enough. I see that we can count of hundreds of wished changes and that almost certain will create new problems.
I know I have been cautious from the start that this might go overboard, and I still am.

I do however have hope that at some point we get an improved game too enjoy.

Let's not discuss this to death. Antal's the man, it's his call, and whatever he can do, we'll appreciate.

I agree: changes should be proritizes.
1) Try to fix things which are not working as they should
2) Make some changes in function that should be "independant" (like withdrawal chance, or take Rate of Fire into account for defensive fire to allow better Machine Gun). We can hope that for that, it's possible to only change the body of the function with little side effects
3) Maybe change some graphics behaviour, with litlte gameplay change and so fewer ompact (ex: play an animaiton for plane when they spy instead of just revealing the tile)
4) Introduce some new gameplay effects that may require adding some flags/attributes to the game file, but remains within one or two faction (ex: add a "bonus vs cavalry" and "cavalry" flags. It requires changing the file structure, but it should have an effect only in a few functions (I hope)
5) Make more important gameplay changes such as 3 tiles for city, or add a new era.
6) Add completly new stuff such as religion

How do withdrawal appears? What units (by default) can withdraw? (retreat?)

As far as a remember, if a unit with 1 MP fights a unit with more than 1 MP, then the faster unit has a chance to withdraw instead of being destroyed in combat. I think the chance of withdrawal is always the same.
If both units have more than 1 MP, then retreat never happens, even if one unit is faster.

Steph said:

I think the chance of withdrawal is always the same.
If both units have more than 1 MP, then retreat never happens, even if one unit is faster.

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In the Firaxis editor under the tab "Combat Experiemce" you can define the chances units with the different experiences have to sucessfully retreat ("Retreat Bonus".

Regarding the food-bug in larger cities: I just gave detailed observations in case someone now or later should want to invest time and effort into investigating the bug. I did not intend to make it sound like I was making "demands", and if that was the impression I gave, I apologize. Antal1987 is making amazing discoveries and analysis, and he alone decides which direction his work should take. Again, thanks for your efforts so far!

Regards Sigurd.

I have to agree that it would be nice if any unit faster than their opponent would be given a shot at withdrawing. Variation to that chance depending on difference in MP and/or Exp. Lvl between the 2 units involved would be even nicer.

I meant the chance is the same whatever the speed.
A unit with 10 MP has the same chance to withdraw than a unit with 2 MP, if they have the same experience.