SGOTM 15 - One Short Straw

@Dhoom

If we move John 1E, there is one square where the barb archer could be (Copper-SE+SE) that would put us at risk while standing on flat, open land. I don't think we should do this.

As LC said, our worker is spawn busting in the west, so moving Jack 1S is a safe move.
 
Mitchum said:
Dhoomstriker said:
3. Assuming that I am right in believing that we last saw the Barb Archer on Turn 49 2040BC on the square that is 1SE of the Grassland Banana and 1N of Crab, then make this move:
John (Warrior 1) will move 1E to the Grassland (1SE of the GRiv Copper)
If we move John 1E, there is one square where the barb archer could be (Copper-SE+SE) that would put us at risk while standing on flat, open land. I don't think we should do this.
Assuming that I understood where the Barb Archer was located the last time that we saw him and assuming that I counted correctly (please double check), the Barb Archer would have required 5 turns to get to the square that you are talking about. The Barb Archer has only had 4 turns of movement. So, this move by Jack (Warrior 1) should be safe if we make it this turn but it might not be safe if we wait until next turn to make the move.


Mitchum said:
As LC said, our worker is spawn busting in the west, so moving Jack 1S is a safe move.
Okay, good to know. We can make both moves then.
 
Thanks. Just to confirm, you mean the square that is 1N of the Crab and 1SE of the Grassland Banana, right?

That would be Turn 49 2040BC.
It is now Turn Turn 53 1880BC.

Negative I was incorrect I meant 1E 1SE of marble on a plains square
 
Negative I was incorrect I meant 1E 1SE of marble on a plains square

It looks like I'm not the only one who mixes up E and W. :D

In fact, I mixed up what you originally wrote and read 1W+1SW to be 1E+1SE because that's where I remember seeing him. :lol: Plus you have that tile marked in the real save IIRC.
 
Assuming that I understood where the Barb Archer was located the last time that we saw him and assuming that I counted correctly (please double check), the Barb Archer would have required 5 turns to get to the square that you are talking about. The Barb Archer has only had 4 turns of movement. So, this move by Jack (Warrior 1) should be safe if we make it this turn but it might not be safe if we wait until next turn to make the move.



Okay, good to know. We can make both moves then.

Nope we cant. Someone gave Dhoom bad intel
 
Okay, given that new intel, the Barb Archer really could be anywhere in the fog.

Thus, I'm fine with Warrior 1 (John) staying where he is and Warrior 2 (Jack) moving 1S onto the Grassland Banana.

In other words, I accept magnusmarcus' plan for the turn, as written.

Take your time, as usual.


If we're in luck, we'll get Toku's Archer for support, but if not, then yeah, we might really have to plan to build an Axeman before a Granary in Delhi.

If it turns out that we're going to build an Axeman in Delhi and a Warrior in Nature's Candi (Gems City), we won't need Pottery immediately, so if we can agree to research Fishing, then we could slot in Fishing before Pottery. We won't know for certain until we figure out where this Barb Archer is going to be and whether or not we'll have a chance of Toku supporting us in the upcoming battle.

P.S. Shouldn't the City be called Nature's Candhi? ;)
 
What about the wicked barb of the north? Still want me to move onto the forest with our northern warrior?
I believe the idea is to move him E to the forest, right? In other words, not to the forest where he might get attacked the following turn if he stayed there.

Btw, guys, I looked at the SDK and though I'm not an expert I'm pretty sure barbs units don't chase. The barb archer might pillage (nothing to pillage), attack (nothing to attack), patrol (to a free tile not next to our culture, if possible).

One more detail, now that we're past 20 cities, the barb units will pillage at a range of 2, which I understand to mean if they're next to our culture and see a possibility to pillage just inside our borders, they'll move to that tile. Past 30 cities, they'll pillage at range = 3.
 
magnusmarcus said:
What about the wicked barb of the north? Still want me to move onto the forest with our northern warrior?
Whoops, yeah, please add this bit to your plan and then we should be good:
Dhoomstriker said:
4. Make this move:
Warrior 3 will move 1E to the GRiv For (1W of Zlatorog)


LowtherCastle said:
Btw, guys, I looked at the SDK and though I'm not an expert I'm pretty sure barbs units don't chase. The barb archer might pillage (nothing to pillage), attack (nothing to attack), patrol (to a free tile not next to our culture, if possible).
So, the only way to "lure" the Barb Archer might be to intentionally sacrifice a Warrior? Specifically, triggering the "attack" behaviour of the Barb Archer?

Is it feasibly possible that a Barb Archer that sees us will still execute the "attack" mission even though it is two squares away from us? I mean, the code just says to execute the attack action... but the attack action might not require that the Archer can attack on the current turn but perhaps can attack on either the current turn or the current turn plus one turn? Maybe?


LowtherCastle said:
One more detail, now that we're past 20 cities, the barb units will pillage at a range of 2, which I understand to mean if they're next to our culture and see a possibility to pillage just inside our borders, they'll move to that tile. Past 30 cities, they'll pillage at range = 3.
Hmmm, well, we'll have to be careful about the Barb Archer getting too close to our Gold-E Locks' Gold Mine... the Barb Archer might just decide to beeline the Mine to pillage it!

Of course, it might not be too infeasible to whip an Axeman in Gold-E-Locks, so it might still be a reasonable idea to lure the Barb Archer in that direction, assuming that luring at a distance of 2 movement points away is possible.


Now, what happens if we have a unit standing on top of the pillageable Resource? Will the Barb still "see" the Resource as being pillageable or will the Barb unit ignore said Resource?
 
That's clever, magnus. I'm not sure barb units actually chase from two tiles away, though. It might just have been random. ZPV could maybe confirm that.

--------------

Here are all the things a barb will do:
Code:
Guard City
Guard a goody hut.
Pillage within 1 tile
Attack within 1 tile, except sometimes when odds are low.
--
If Raging Barbs:
  Pillage within 4 tiles
  Attack city within 3 tiles
  AREAAI_OFFENSIVE => move towards target city
If 3 cities per civ:
  Attack city witin 1 tile
  Pillage within 3 tiles
  Attack city within 2 tiles
  AREAAI_OFFENSIVE => move towards target city
If only 2 cities per civ:
  Pillage within 2 tiles
  Attack city within 1 tile
--
Load onto a ship
Heal
Guard city again
Patrol (i.e. wander away from borders)
Retreat to city
Move to defensive terrain
Sorry magnus, but they don't chase units deliberately.
 
ZPV said:
Pillage within 1 tile
Hmmm... would it be worth it to build a Road just inside of our Cultural Borders with the sole intention of luring the Barb Archer to there? Somewhere to the south-east of Delhi so that it's a bit removed from the Marble City location?

I'm pretty certain that a Barb unit won't Pillage improvements outside of Cultural Borders (otherwise we could just lure the Barbs around with randomly-built Roads that exist outside of our Cultural Borders), but is the thinking that if the Barb Archer "sees" a Road that is 1 square away, it will enter our Cultural Borders at said location?


ZPV said:
If only 2 cities per civ:
Pillage within 2 tiles
If there are 20 Cities and 9 AIs, that means that with 10 players, we are already in this situation, i.e. 20/10 = 2 Cities per Civ.

So, if we were to say, build a Road just inside of our Cultural Borders, would the Barb Archer "seek it out" if the Barb Archer wandered anywhere 2 squares away from said Road? That possibility is more likely that 1 square away if the Barb Archer is (for now) avoiding coming near our Cultural Borders.



ZPV said:
If Raging Barbs
Is this setting enabled in our game?
 
LowtherCastle said:
In both or your original plans (magnus 1pop, Mitchum 2pop) you both work corn+copper+2 mines on T53, correct or not?
I'm assuming that since the plan does not list this fact that Delhi is already working these squares. If not, then here's your reminder to ensure that those squares get worked.

Good luck with the mystical art of Barb luring! ;)


One thought that has been percolating is that if we're working the Pig Pasture to Size 2, perhaps only one Worker needs to Mine the Gem Resource, which could free up the other worker to either directly walk to the south-east or else gradually walk there while executing partial Worker actions along the way, followed by trying to build an improvement down there (preferably a Road if Barb units are lured by Road improvements, since a Road would be the quickest to build).
 
One thought that has been percolating is that if we're working the Pig Pasture to Size 2, perhaps only one Worker needs to Mine the Gem Resource, which could free up the other worker to either directly walk to the south-east or else gradually walk there while executing partial Worker actions along the way, followed by trying to build an improvement down there (preferably a Road if Barb units are lured by Road improvements, since a Road would be the quickest to build).

It all boils down to worker turns. Just by splitting up the workers, we don't mysteriously gain extra worker turns. Aside from chopping the forest under Nature's Candy, pasturing the pigs, mining the gems and quarrying the marble, we only have 4 spare worker turns with zero wasted on purely movement. Our lastest plan has us building a road and putting 2 chops into a forest with those 4 turns. Those 4 worker turns could be used for something else as long as the workers are standing directly next to the marble hill when they are done.

EDIT: PPP said this "MM Delhi 2 mines bronze corn"
 
The mystical art of barb luring has failed :(

Turn 53, 1880 BC: You are the worst enemy of Tokugawa, Hammuragawa.
Turn 53, 1880 BC: Clearing a Forest has created 16 ℤ for Delhi.
Turn 53, 1880 BC: Clearing a Forest has created 20 ℤ for Delhi.
Turn 53, 1880 BC: Clearing a Forest has created 20 ℤ for Delhi.
 

Attachments

  • MysticalArt.jpg
    MysticalArt.jpg
    401.5 KB · Views: 39
At least Toku's archer is headed the right general direction!

This is the point where we diverge from the 1-pop whip and 2-pop whip options. What do we want to do now? We need to commit to one or the other.
 
At least Toku's archer is headed the right general direction!

This is the point where we diverge from the 1-pop whip and 2-pop whip options. What do we want to do now? We need to commit to one or the other.

not really... i think he went W I wanted him to go sw
 
Top Bottom